A Pagan's Blog

A Pagan's Blog

Encountering Deities and Spirits: first post

posted by Gus diZerega

Our discussion of
Pagan atheism prompted me to write something on Paganism’s theistic side.  Speaking for myself, no argument
convinced me to follow a Pagan path, it was concrete experiences that did:
encounters with a Pagan deity.  Not
surprisingly, if Spirit is immanent, existing within the world, it is more
accessible than a purely transcendent entity. It seems to be accessible in a
number of ways, from the pantheistic perception that includes some calling themselves
atheists to direct encounters in many different forms and under a wide variety
of circumstances, from complete sobriety to employing entheogens. This does not
mean that every spirit or force encountered is divine, but some are.  I hope others who have had encounters
will share them in the discussion I hope this post provokes.


There are a
variety of dimensions to Pagan theism. 
Some I have experienced personally, others not. My initiatory deity
experience involved encountering a deity experienced as on the outside.  This happened at the first Midsummer I
ever attended, and is why I am a Pagan today.  I wrote about it in Pagans and Christians (shameless plug). Another kind of event would be visitations
in dreams.  With one exception,
which I would not consider a deity event,
I have not had those experiences – not that I remember anyway. Perhaps someone
else can describe such a dream that happened to them. 

Another would be
actually seeing an entity or deity. 
I have seen entities but so far as I know, no deities.  Again, perhaps a reader can describe
such an event.  

Finally, there is
when a deity or other entity enters into our bodies and provides information or
actions that would not otherwise have happened. Exploring this latter is the
purpose of the remainder of this post.

 Deity incorporation is the practice that
more than any other separates Gardnerian Wicca and similar Pagan traditions
from the West’s traditional idea of spirituality and religion. In Wicca we call
this experience Drawing Down the Moon when the Goddess or some aspect of Her,
enters into the high priestess, or Drawing Down the Sun when the God or an
aspect of Him, enters into the high priest.  Again, this is not the only kind of encounter with spirits
and deities that Wiccans can have, but it is a profoundly meaningful one.  This kind of experience is hardly
unique to Wicca.

It is also one of
the greatest experiences within many other Pagan practices world-wide, where
your body is entered into or even temporarily “borrowed” by another
entity.  This usually occurs within
ritual space or when explicitly invited. 
In contrast to possessory or other invasive phenomena, the beings leave
when requested, or earlier, if they have finished what they came to do.

Incorporation in Western history

Most people do
not know how important a role this kind of communication from the spirit world
has played in our history.  To give
one example, Socrates began his civilization-changing mission in response to a
message from the Delphic Oracle, given to him by a Priestess in trance.  Her message was followed by other more
direct communications to Socrates himself from the Gods and other spiritual
sources.  As he described it  

…this duty, as I say, has been enjoined
me by the deity, by oracles, by dreams, and by every mode by which any other
divine decree has ever enjoined anything to man to do.

In addition,
Socrates testified he had a daimon  that would warn him when he would begin to make a serious mistake. In the Apology he said

I am moved by certain divine and
spiritual influence . . . This began with me from childhood, being a kind of
voice which, when present, always diverts me from what I am about to do, but
never urges me on. 

In the Phaedrus, Socrates’ great speech on love was apparently made
while in a state of incorporation. 
As is obvious from Plato’s descriptions, these kinds of events were not
considered particularly unusual in Greece at the time.  Certainly those with him when these
things happened were not amazed at the events. 

What counted for
most Greeks was the quality of the spirit involved, not whether or not it was
real.  Just because an entity spoke
through a human intermediary did not mean it was wise or helpful.  So far a I know, this has been the case
in all traditions that make use of this practice.

It is ironic that
Plato and Socrates, the two men most responsible for the Western philosophical
tradition, took spirit incorporation as a fact of life.  As I myself have come to do. The broad
philosophical traditions these men initiated now universally deny the reality of such phenomena, and
mostly ignore its reported role in their own origins. They also ignore its
appearance world wide, for thousands of years, probably since the dawn of
humanity, if not before. 

Why Not So Much Today?

I have long been
curious as to why some people experience spirit incorporation relatively
easily, and others do not.  I have
concluded that Western culture is probably the most closed to such experiences
of any major culture, worldwide. 
Why?

The first reason
is pretty certainly our Christian heritage.  In its various forms the church has universally denounced
spirit communication as the deceitful work of demons.  Nothing should be an authority except for scripture properly
interpreted, and a church hierarch. 
No one should ever depend on his or her own insight, with or without
spirit help, even if the spiritual source appears orthodox.  The somewhat similar practices of Pentacostalists
and charismatics have been controversial and distrusted within most
institutionalized churches although, interestingly, their numbers have recently
grown substantially across denominations. 
But except for charismatics and Pentacostals, and then mostly in
Christian services, many people are terrified of experiences such as Socrates
and other Greeks had.  Fear create
a barrier.

But there is more
to the matter than this, and these other reasons may explain its not being more
common among NeoPagans.  The West
has long identified itself as universally individualistic.  Protestant Christianity is usually
credited with strengthening this individualism with its emphasis on the sole
importance of the individual’s relationship to God.  At its extremes other people were seen as potential
impediments to this primary focus. Western individualism seems unique in so
often denying connection with others as essential part of what it is to be a
human being.  This attitude colors
much more than our approach to the Sacred.

When writing with
my political scientist’s hat on, I have argued one place where this sense of
the isolated individual manifests very destructively is in our conception of
ownership.  The West usually
conceives the relation of ownership as despotic power over a thing: I can do
anything I want with what is mine. The conception of freedom that shakes out is
of a gaggle of despots each of whom completely respects one another’s realm of
absolute domination. Such a perspective has a hard time seeing any inequality
of power between workers and bosses or consumers and corporations.  All despots are equal within their own
realm and so long as realms are respected, the relative size of their domains
is irrelevant. 

I believe for
reasons both historical and logical that a more accurate view of the matter is
that property rights are the rights to enter into certain relationships with
what is owned and with others. 
What is central for my discussion here is the distinction between a
despot’s concern with secure boundaries compared to the sense of permeable
boundaries when ownership arises out of relationships.  Such ownership facilitates connection.

Another off shoot
of Western individualism relevant to this post is its view of knowledge. The
scientific ideal of knowledge fits this individual as isolated and autonomous
being image.  Reality is what we
can measure, experiment upon, and predict.  To the degree we can so manipulate it, reality is at least
potentially under our control. I as a sovereign individual am surrounded by a
world of things, of objects, which I and similarly sovereign individuals
appropriate and exchange. 
Expanding knowledge increases human power.

This denial of
relationship, and therefore of intrinsic value in another, is why scientific
methods are controversial when applied to human beings.  It is all too easy to step from saying
this is a good way of finding some knowledge out about people to saying this is
the best way to find knowledge as such out about people.

As a kind of
corollary, subjective knowledge, such as we have of the character of our
friends and loved ones, is devalued. 
It is personally important, but not “really” real because it cannot be
demonstrated objectively.  To the
degree we buy in to this model, our sense of personal isolation increases.  Our dominant conception of knowledge is
a poor approach to connecting with what can only be understood within a
relationship. 

Relatively closed
boundaries for the self not only close us off to other people, they also close us off to more subtle energies in our environment.  Western individualism is an extreme expression of this attitude,
and on balance American society is an extreme expression of Western
individualism.  In what other
country is such a disturbed view of human relations as expressed by Ayn Rand
taken as an ideal by many adults?    Remember Rand’s supporters in earlier comments on this blog
who argued it was fine to despoil the Indians because they were not “using”
their land in the way Randians found appropriate? (See my discussion with her
devotees, starting with my 1:16 comment. ) l   They did so while praising voluntary cooperation among
‘rational’ people, without any awareness of the gaping  and quite irrational hole in their
reasoning. 

Where else but
America is a serious argument made that empathy is a disqualifying capacity for
being a judge?    Clinically, a person without empathy is regarded as a
mentally defective human being.   But then, this is a society where a
corporation, the very incarnation of sociopathy, is regarded as a person in the
eyes of the law. There is something deeply disturbed about American
‘individualism’ when empathy is derided and a corporation is called a person
and given more access to political decision making than a human being.

The West’s
relative closedness to the outside except when it is in control, and therefore
closedness to this kind of spiritual encounter, is not simply “being modern.”
Other modern societies manage quite well without this attitude.  Modern Korea  and Taiwan have strong traditions of
mediumship and shamanism, and family mediumship traditions are rapidly
reappearing
in modern China. 

I think the rise
of possessory/incorporative traditions in the modern West, and perhaps the
growth of charismatics within Christianity, is a sign of deeply profound
cultural changes taking place. The feminizing of our culture, so long overdue,
is making the openness required for these kinds of experiences more acceptable,
first among women for whom openness is initially more acceptable, and then
among men. But our individualistic concern with impregnable boundaries remains
a barrier to contact.

Seeing and Feeling Energy and
Boundaries

I was intrigued
that when I wrote my blog posts on how to see and feel  energy fields I received no comments at all.  None.  Not positive. 
Not negative.  Perhaps it
was because most of my readers already knew this.  Perhaps many people did not want to see for themselves
whether or not our boundaries interpenetrate with those of others, comprising a
field rather than a collection of independent objects. Perhaps some readers
went off to try these suggestions, and never reported whether they worked or
not. Perhaps there were other reasons. 
I do not know.  But I do
know that when you can see and feel the continual interpenetration of our
selves with the rest of the world, the West’s extreme individualism is
obviously
a mental error and a perceptual
shortcoming.

From years of
experience casting circles and working with energy I know a strong sense of
self-containment puts up barriers that screen out harmful and beneficial forces
alike.  Is it a better or worse way
to live than not doing so? There are times when shields are a good idea, and times
when their costs outweigh their benefits. But on balance, if we deliberately
close ourselves off from connection with the world, we are usually the poorer
for it. 

In the Brazilian
healing group of which I was a member for six years (and in groups I have
occasionally conducted independently for nearly 20 more) many members had to
participate for years before the stronger incorporative experiences happened to
them.  And they were hardly a
random group.  Other participants
entered into these relationships very quickly.  There were many degrees of trance attained, from a slight
alternation of perspective not altogether different experientially from being
stoned, to full blown incorporation, where the person was either taken over
briefly by the entity or allowed the entity in to do things the person could
not do. (Some scholars argue the distinction between mediumship and shamanism
is precisely this degree of control, with the shaman actively involved, the
medium more passive.)

In a Wiccan
context Drawing Down the Moon or the Sun also varies in intensity, but I
believe normally grows in ease of access and power of connection with
experience.  Such has been my
experience, anyway. But NeoPagan traditions are new at developing practices
that largely died out in the West millennia ago.  Many have learned and benefited from experience with African
diasporic traditions they have attended.

Incorporation and Spiritual
wisdom

As a person for
whom this kind of encounter came relatively easily, I once wondered whether it
was evidence of “spiritual maturity” or “accomplishment.”  I no longer think it is anything of the
kind. Some spiritually aware and committed people enter into these
relationships relatively easily, others do not. 

In addition, I am
not convinced that being “spiritually advanced” is even necessary for entering
into such a relationship. 
Certainly when it first happened to me, and many times thereafter, I
would not have called myself “spiritually advanced.”  Though I believe (and certainly hope) I’ve made some
progress since then, I still would not use that term today. 

Openness to
spirit incorporation is a talent that like other talents seems unevenly
distributed across our species. Some people have this capacity to a far greater
degree than I do, and some have it less.   It can be valuable in some spiritual traditions and
very disruptive in others, but it is particularly useful in spiritual
traditions emphasizing sacred immanence: that Spirit is everywhere.
Importantly, it is an ability that can be developed 

There is no
certain formula.  These experiences
do not appear to be brought on by a particular musical rhythm or external
environment that triggers changes in brain states, although ritual space seems
more conducive to incorporation than mundane space.  To be sure, in some African diasporic traditions particular
rhythms played within particular ritual spaces do seem connected to particular
entities.  Even so, incorporation
and trance can also happen quite unexpectedly and far from ritual or music.  On the other hand, the same rhythm or
ritual or frame of mind or mental state can have no impact at all, with
incorporation not happening. 
Friends of mine describe an experience when visiting Brazil, where one of
the leaders of a temple there had always wanted to experience incorporation,
and never had.   They were
there when, after years of work and service, she finally experienced her first
“close encounter of the fourth kind.” 

The spirit
chooses to come or not, for whatever reason.  Even those for whom these experiences are common report
their intensity can vary dramatically. 
There are no guarantees.

Experiencing It for Yourself

If I had to
advance a tentative overview of these issues for someone seeking such an
encounter, I would make the following suggestions.  First, the degree to which someone is open to other peoples’
feelings is probably usually correlated with their capacity to enter into these
relationships.  Second, the more
exposure someone has within contexts where these things happen, the greater
their likelihood of entering into such a relationship.  Go to rituals and celebrations where
the Gods and spirits are invoked, and come.  Repeatedly expose yourself to those ‘energy fields.’ 

I will repeat my
description of my first such experience in a passage I wrote Joshua in an
earlier discussion.

Many years ago,
in the 1980s, I was invited to a Brazilian style Umbanda drumming
ceremony.  Never having been to one
and knowing almost nothing about it, I sat on a chair in the back of the room.  I was dressed in white because all who
came were asked to do so.

The
leader/shaman began the ceremony and went into trance with a “caboclo” spirit -
a kind of South American Indian spirit. 

As the ritual
continued I noticed some twitching in my body.  I tried to sit still, so as not to be disruptive to those
around me, but it was getting difficult. 
The twitching was getting stronger, though I was still sitting in my
chair.

The leaders
noticed me, signaled to stop the drumming, and wordlessly motioned for me to
come forward.  I did so, fully
expecting to be expelled from the ceremony for being disruptive.  My ignorance of this sort of thing was
about 100%.

As I stood
before him, the center of very unwanted attention, he touched me briefly in the
forehead and base of the skull (or the other way around) and signaled for the
drumming to resume. 

My feet started
to dance, and I was not doing it. 
No one else had entered into this kind of trance at the ritual, nor had
I ever seen this kind of thing.  I
had read about it, and decided that the entranced people were either faking it,
or simply carried away by their enthusiasm.  Now it was happening to me.  I remember thinking something like “My god, this is real!”

I continued to
dance/be danced alone in front of a bunch of strangers for quite some time.
(Anyone who knows me knows this is unheard of behavior on my part, before or
since, unless I am being “ridden” as the term goes.)  In time a few others entered into trance and did the same.  At a certain point the leader signaled,
the drumming shifted, the spirits were asked to depart, and my feet stopped
dancing.

Probably most
importantly, incorporation is a two way street, and the entities involved, from
spirits to what I call “high beings” or deities have their own agendas.  Their agenda may or may not involve
working with you, and even if it does it may or may not involve doing a lot of
such work.  I would guess that the
more fervently a person seeks to go into trance the more ego and power motives
are involved, and all else being the same, the more that ego and power, the ‘I
want!’ is involved, the less likely incorporation will happen.  So when putting yourself in contexts
where this kind of thing might happen patience, humility and good sense are
always wise ideas.  Invite, be
available, and don’t demand at any level. 
(Notice – when we demand we separate ourselves out from that which we
desire we create or strengthen boundaries. And we have a sense of our own
power, which I think is a mistake in these contexts.) 

If a group
practices entity incorporation, and you are not impressed with their openness
of heart and personal and group integrity, don’t go there.  Just
as with dealing with people, not all ritual trance and other contact is
beneficial.  Just because an entity
claims to be wise does not mean it is. 
In the
Phaedrus Socrates
makes just such distinctions.  Like
people, entities can initially be evaluated by the kind of company they
keep.  It’s a good first step,
especially for wise beginners, to “run with a good crowd.”

Once this
experience happens, the more you do it the easier it gets.  It is as if we get ‘tuned.’  But developing this capacity is not
something to take lightly.  Even
after initial connection, it can take years before the person has a smooth meld
with the spirit energies.  In the
African diasporic traditions these experiences come with sometimes substantial responsibilities.
Wicca is less demanding, but the experiences are usually less powerful. 
I am not sure of all the reasons for this, but the relatively lighter
commitment by the practitioner is likely a part of it.  This makes sense if we are seeking a
relationship, rather than responding to some physiological or psychological
cue.

It is all very
confusing if we try and put these kinds of experiences into logical boxes
giving us a means of rational control or reduce them to some kind of
reductionist scientific analysis. 
Committed aggressive atheists deal with these phenomena most often by
not discussing them.  When pushed
they will say somehow those who have such experiences are either faking or are
mentally unsound, unlike themselves. 
On the other hand, this kind of experience is not so confusing if we
grant that there is will, care, intelligence, and even love and compassion on
both sides of the veil.



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Comments read comments(8)
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The L

posted July 6, 2010 at 7:46 am


I’ve channeled Deity in that manner once. I cannot adequately describe the sensation. The word “intense” comes to mind, but isn’t all that descriptive. “Weight” is both right and wrong. It was almost as if I WAS the oceans, the air, the earth, the galaxies, for that fleeting moment, yet was simultaneously experiencing them from outside.
As for the “seeing/feeling energy” posts: I discovered your blog after both. I’ve been feeling energy since about the time I “discovered” Paganism, but I’ve always had extreme difficulty seeing it, even after trying the tips in guides like yours. I’ve sort of resigned myself to “magic-blindness.” I may not be able to see my Circles, but I can always feel them working, and sense where the boundaries are.



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Pitch313

posted July 6, 2010 at 1:51 pm


Early on, whatever communication I enjoyed with non-corporeal entities was with spirits of the land or guardians of some qualities of the land–trees, predators, trickster birds, Earth energy flows. I accepted these experiences as within the scope of possible human perceptions. Not as supernatural, paranormal, or especially occultish or magical.
Years later, as a joking response to pesky Evangelicals, I declared that I worshipped Kali. Imagine–or maybe Don’t!–my astonishment when I discovered that–for me, at least–joking invocations do invoke.
After barely surviving the merest brush with Kali and putting my sense of what living as a Neo-Pagan entailed for me into a workable heap, communication with Deities became something that happened to me. Again, I tended not to evaluate these experiences as supernatural, paranormal, or occultish, I did, however, appreciate them–and their transformative outcomes–as magical.
As for an individual’s “spiritual advancement,” well, I’d say that it happens not because you can communicate with deities, but because you can make fruitful and grounded sense of that communication. Work the magic where it matters, here where we live.
Deities may tell us too much, too little, or stuff too skewed. You can, I think, pretty much burn out your spirit listening too hard and too long to Deities.
Burned out isn’t advanced, it’s just ashes. Spiritual advancement for humans may mean growing out of habits of communicating overmuch with Deities–and paying attention of living on Earth.



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Sarenth

posted July 6, 2010 at 4:34 pm


As someone who does contact with Gods, spirits and the like regularly, I see that continuous contact with the spirit world is important. It doesn’t make me better than someone who has little to no contact that they can recognize, it just makes me different. I have my own circumstances for why this is so just as they do.
I would caution others on evaluating spirits by those they contact alone. I know I have had times where a spirit has trouble translating through my tongue what it is they are trying to say. I also think that it takes some training to reliably do it whether the spirits are talking only to you, or to others through you. In my experience, if you work the ‘muscles’ and develop the skills of spirit communication you can move into it easier. Until those ‘muscles’ and skills get built up you may have some problems reliably communicating, but it takes, like any other discipline, dedicated practice.
You make the point, Gus, that Wiccan Callings seem less intense than other forms of Deity invocation. In my experience there are a few reasons for this is:
1) Wicca works a lot through or with Archetypes rather than Gods in full. I’ve had more than a few Gods as part of a Wiccan coven Called into me in terms of being a Maiden/Mother/Crone or Son/Father/Sage rather than being called in themselves. It wasn’t until I moved out of that paradigm that I called in Gods more intensely and it became more energetically draining. With the added strain and lack of archetypal overlay also came more direct, impacting spiritual interactions.
2) The spiritual technique that I use now for invoking a God/dess or spirit heavily draws on trancework, breathing, use of prayer beads, drums, using titles/Words of Power, and other spiritual tools/techniques. None of these were used except deep breathing was used in Calling Down the Moon/Sun when I was Wiccan.
3) You wrote: “I would guess that the more fervently a person seeks to go into trance the more ego and power motives are involved, and all else being the same, the more that ego and power, the ‘I want!’ is involved, the less likely incorporation will happen. So when putting yourself in contexts where this kind of thing might happen patience, humility and good sense are always wise ideas.”
I quite heavily agree with your last sentence, however, I have issues with the rest.
I personally do trance quite frequently, and in my experience, keeping lucid while in the state and doing magick makes it more powerful, lasting, and impacting. Seeking to go into trance with purpose pushes out ego concerns because you’re not concentrating on all the things surrounding your magick, you’re concentrating on your magick itself. Similarly, I go into trance prior to God/dess or spirits using me as a vessel. Without trance, and summarily my Self being supplanted or moved aside, etc., I look at the experience with more skepticism because without trance more of me is involved. Perhaps your own experience is different, and I respect that, but these are my experiences.



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jennypittsberg

posted July 8, 2010 at 12:42 am


There are numerous theological beliefs which varies and have the importance in their own way.The small independently spinning deities have eaten or taken the human form they have undertaken the minds and hearts of most of the people and are ruling the country by capturing the every single and basic encounters.
christian louboutin



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Sheherazahde

posted July 8, 2010 at 11:58 am


I am interested in reading more about relationship based ownership. I don’t think I understand what you mean by that.
I totally understand what you mean about the Scientific world view. The belief that only that which can be measured “objectively” is real. I call that the Religion of Science.
Interestingly enough I don’t think that worldview comes from individualism. I think it is rooted in Platonic dualism (Cartesian dualism) that values the mind (reason) over the body (intuition). That was taken up by Christianity creating that whole world-woman-evil vs spirit-man-good dualism.
People often talk about Wiccan dualism. But, for me, one of the important differences between Wiccan Dualism and Christian Dualism is that Wiccan dualism does not demonize one of the sides, it is more like the Taoist Yin/Yang.



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Cheryl Hill

posted July 8, 2010 at 2:26 pm


In my 38 years of being Witch, I’ve encountered Spirits and Elementals quite often, mostly during Ritual. However, I’ve had personal encounters with Deity only three times.
The first two were in the form of Goddess. Brigid appeared when I was scrying over a “crossroads” decision in my life, and Cailleach when I called out to Her after my husband died in February of 1996.
The encounters were quite literally soul-shaking. I felt a tugging on my spirit, as though part of my life force recognized its Source and was being pulled to rejoin. For a fleeting moment it was as though I *was* part of Them. I completely lost my sense of Self. It was during my encounter with Cailleach that my broken heart and spirit were healed.
The third encounter was in the form of God; Cernunnos. Although Cailleach had healed me of my debilitating grief, I still felt love for my deceased spouse and was unable to move forward with my life. I was rejecting any advances from other men, and simply couldn’t allow any man to get close to me. I can’t explain much here because this Blog is public. But one night around 1am , without my consciously calling Him or asking for help, Cernunnos gently came to me in the most intimate way possible.
After that I was able to move forward, and eventually even remarried in 2001. No one can experience an encounter with Deity and not be forever transformed.



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Sheherazahde

posted July 21, 2010 at 9:05 pm


Re: Deity Incorporation
I recall that being called “being ridden by the Loa” in Voudoun.
The Reclaiming Tradition calls it Aspecting
http://www.reclaimingquarterly.org/86/rq-86-aspect-intro.html
I attended a Wiccan Elders’ Workshop given by Gwyneth Cathyl-Bickford and Judith Harrow at Panthea in 1995. They called the practice Deity Assumption. And talked about four levels: Enhancement, Inspiration, Integration, and full Possession.



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Aliessitrence

posted January 8, 2011 at 7:43 am


Hi, just joined the forum and looking forward to learning, looks like a useful place!
Thanks!
brtghbgf!! xx



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