Crunchy Con

Why I Can't Help Voting GOP.2

Tuesday May 9, 2006

Another point, this one brief. A colleague of mine, a religiously observant Democrat, asked me recently why religious conservatives are so hung up on abortion, such that we are effectively single-issue voters (and we almost always go for Republicans). We...
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Comments
Maximos
May 9, 2006 8:44 PM

I hate to say this, as I do not aspire to the mantle of the prophet; but the GOP will eventually cave. The mammonists and embrace-the-future libertarians will have their day, and the light will be snuffed.

They. Always. Win.>

Mark Windsor
May 9, 2006 10:16 PM

I too think the GOP will eventually cave if things remain as they are now, but I honestly think there's still a chance to address the issue. I hope and pray for a renaissance in the GOP that will return them to real conservatism, but I don't know that you can get enough brave people to turn away from the money that keeps the GOP at arms length for me.

The GOP needs to get behind a comprehensive view of pro-life politics...from conception to natural death. But every time I think they may be getting it, I hear about something like the Andrea Clark thing and Bush's part in that law.

They say that dark times bring out great leaders. I'm still hopeful that this is true in culture wars as well as in does in world wars.>

tovart
May 9, 2006 10:49 PM

Will cave to corporatism, IMHO, and all its inherent "religiousity.">

Mark Windsor
May 9, 2006 11:08 PM

I have a question for you and your crunchy cohorts.

Have we reached the point where it's no longer useful to even discuss things with the Left? Should we dig trenches instead of trying to find common ground?

I once, half jokingly, said that by 2020 the culture war would go hot, and we'd have armed bands in the streets of major citys fighting it out in a quasi-civil war. If I go and read the comments at Air America or The Daily Kos, I begin to think that prediction is more accurate than I could ever have imagined. Have we reached the point where we can't even talk to them about substantive issues, and they can't even talk to us?>

pesele
May 9, 2006 11:10 PM

I find your general approach to living with holiness to be very appealing. And it does highlight why abortion is so morally fraught. But there is more than one moral position that can be taken. The position that life begins at conception did not gain currency in this (admittedly dominantly Protestant) country until around the turn of the twentieth century.
There is an underlying assumption that the right moral path is clear--it is very much not.
For example, Judaism and Catholicism have always had very different approaches to birth. As I understand it, if a choice must be made, for Catholics, the life of the infant comes first.
For Jews, the life of the mother takes precedence (the fetus is called a "pursuer" in the Talmudic discussions). Further, there is a recognition of development marked by the time the mother can feel movement. Talmudic debates were and are motivated by the pursuit of the right moral path, especially in the case where there are two moral claims, as there are here. (I make no claims here about the unity of contemporary Jewish opinion about abortion (there is none), only want to highlight the traditional approach.)
Thus, two different traditions, both aiming toward a life of holiness, can result in very different results. Dominant society must then reconcile these--or at least provide a neutral space. I don't see how your approach allows for that reconciliation of difference.>

JH
May 9, 2006 11:26 PM

Pesele, can you expand a bit? When you say Judaism favors the life of the Mother, does that mean, specifically if there is a health issue, the Mother's life is a priority, or just in general, if the pregnancy would be a hardship in any way, the Mother's life is a priority?

Also, for Catholic teaching, I am pretty sure that if there is a life threatening health crisis and treating the Mother means the pregnancy would end, ie. ectopic pregnancy, there is no question that it is a priority to save the Mother.

Now, if it is a life affecting choice like, if she carries the pregnancy to term, she would have to quit school, I know the Church would teach that the baby takes priority.

Interesting topic, thanks for your post!

JH>

pesele
May 10, 2006 12:21 AM

Both Talmudic and modern debates center around defining the terms, which leads to moral consequences. It's been a while since I've looked at the Talmudic passages, but my recollection is that if the mother's physical health is at risk during the pregnancy, that takes priority, as well as during birth. This has been applied in different ways by contemporary Jews, with Orthodox Jews interpreting "health" much more narrowly than Reform Jews.
There is no question that at birth, though, the mother's life would take precedence. So either the case of a Jewish woman giving birth in a Catholic hospital or vice versa could lead to serious moral consequences. Which brings me back to my original question: how do we, in our differences, decide these holy questions?>

Julianne Wiley
May 10, 2006 12:33 AM

Mark Windsor: You referred to Andrea Clark's situation and Bush's role in the Texas law. As I understand it, Bush's role was to strengthen the family's power to obtain or continue treatment for a seriously disabled patient.

From Newsday:

"Bush spokesman Scott McClellan told reporters that Bush vetoed 1997 legislation that would have put into law Texas hospital policies that gave families virtually no protections and as little as 72 hours to find alternate care after a hospital decided to stop treatment.

"Under the 1999 law, another White House official said, Bush expanded that time to 10 days and authorized family members to seek extensions in court but acknowledge that if the challenges fell short, "under the legislation, the hospital still could authorize the end of life."

"In Texas, Bush's position also had the backing of Texas Right to Life, whose national headquarters, along with other Christian conservatives that make up a key part of the Republican base, has taken up the fight to prolong Schiavo's life.

"Burke Balch, director of the Powell Center for Medical Ethics at National Right to Life Committee in Washington, said he represented the Texas chapter in more than two dozen negotiating sessions over the 1999 bill.

"...[I]t was the best we could achieve at the time, better than the existing state of the law....When we have the ability to change the law to be more protective, certainly we would do that," Balch said.

Reprinted from Newsday:
http://www.newsday.com/news/nationworld/nation/
ny-usbush224186328mar22,0,3998982.story>

Maclin Horton
May 10, 2006 5:01 PM
http://www.lightondarkwater.com

Just chiming in to agree with you, Rod. As you quote me in your book, it's the difference between an unreliable ally and an enemy.

If the Dems could/would break the grip of the cultural left on their party, American politics would be a very different game.>

Diane Fitzsimmons
May 10, 2006 5:37 PM

There have been times when I have voted NOTA, effectively casting no vote at all.

Sometimes I vote for the candidate who will do the least harm.

All the time, I have to remember that God is really the One in charge and focus on His kingdom on earth and not the one established by either political party.>

Daniel Larison
May 11, 2006 12:57 AM
http://www.larison.org

Let me say from the beginning that I am not and never have been (and probably never will be) a registered Republican, as they seemed as far from my early constitutionalism in 1997 when I could first vote as they seem from my political views now. Not only has the GOP on a presidential level never seemed to be an option for me, but after the last two terms I cannot imagine any candidate credible enough to win me "back" (and I am only one generation removed from my parents' own alienation from the Democratic Party).

I take a rather odd view of the question of parties, since I have lived most of my life in one form of Democratic machine politics (New Mexico) or another (Chicago and Illinois) but could never take the local Republican opposition seriously, as they were constantly trying to compete by becoming, David Cameron-like, indistinguishable from their opponents. Even though everything about the mismanagement of government by the machine screams for actively supporting the opposition, the opposition is preposterous. Still, in state and local elections I do follow my anti-incumbent rule and vote for Republican candidates.

On the national scene, however, the NM GOP is an embarrassment. The conventional wisdom in New Mexico is that a moderate Republican is needed to win in our First District (no one has ever tested this assumption), and so we have been reliably represented by that part of the GOP strongest on the DoD and big government and weakest on all questions of life and culture. Those who live in the Second District at least usually get an avowed pro-life representative. If anything, it has only gotten worse since I started voting. Maybe if I lived in Idaho or Tennessee the virtues of the GOP would be more obvious to me.

In my two longest local experiences with the GOP, I have seen the state party either routinely push conservatives to the margins (as was done very clumsily and obviously to Bill Davis to get Heather Wilson the seat in NM-1, and as has been done to Oberweis in Illinois this year) or engage in spectacularly incompetent campaigns (think Alan Keyes), as if they had the intention of giving conservatives a bad political rap for a decade.

Everyone will say, "Okay, but what's the alternative?" Aside from presidential campaigns, where third parties represent something of a real, if limited alternative, it strikes me that the only alternative available at the moment, if you're going to vote, is to be consistently anti-incumbent or, if you cannot bring yourself to vote for the party on the outs, at least abstain from endorsing the incumbent party.

The GOP has not yet gone through the wilderness of the Major-Hague-Duncan-Smith-Howard-Cameron years that may precede its eventual collapse. I take the Peter Hitchens approach to the GOP: let it fall to pieces, and we may yet build a political movement worth supporting. Surely there is no sense in a representative government of supporting a party that does not, in any real sense, represent you, is there?>

SquirleyWurley
May 11, 2006 8:27 PM

I'm willing to vote against Democrats if things should get to the point of disparaging the retarded, mentally ill, 'genetically unfit', etc.

But for the time being I see the current ACTUAL Republican efforts to keep the 'unfit' in the gutter to starve or die without health care, as the CURRENT crisis.

Part of being independent politically, is weighing the nature of the current crises and remaining skeptical and willing to change alliances when and if necessary.

I don't expect Democrats to always have this advantage over Republicans, nor do I expect Republicans to have to be the way they currently are, but it seems to me that the Republicans are being undermined by the Mammonists, etc., as the first comment here put it, I agree. I am always willing to oppose Democrats when they cross certain lines, but I vote for them currently, because of lines the Republicans have crossed (excusing torture, ignoring health care of the poor, lack of accountability, recklessness, handouts to the wealthy, etc.)>

Mike S.
May 12, 2006 4:23 PM

Read Ponnuru's Party of Death, and you'll understand why the current version of the Democratic Party, at least at the national level, is a nonstarter for people who want to combat the PoD. The PoD has influence in the GOP as well, but not as much. So, as a practical matter, the Party of Life has more influence in the GOP. That doesn't mean that we should give up on the Democratic party, but for the near-to-medium future it won't be possible to vote for them on the national level.>

Anonymous
May 16, 2006 7:32 PM

"the Democrats, as a general matter, cannot be trusted to be on the side of life"

Um, how many people have been put to death in, say, Texas??? A Republican State, if I recall correctly.

In fact, aren't most Republicans in favour of the death penalty?

Why so selective?>

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About Crunchy Con

Rod Dreher is an editorial columnist for the Dallas Morning News, and author of "Crunchy Cons" (Crown Forum), a nonfiction book about conservatives, most of them religious, whose faith and political convictions sometimes put them at odds with mainstream conservatives. The views expressed in this blog are his own.

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