Smooth

I wonder if the Catholic Church is beginning the transition into the Whore of Babylon, as foretold in Revelations. As of late its cardinals, bishops, and priests have not really been acting as God's apostle on Earth. This is just one more example. ;^( -------------------------------------

Goodness I hope Pauli is being sarcastic. That video is so full of s*** it's unbelievable. (and I'm not even Catholic.) Factually speaking, it is not true that "millions" died during the inquisition. An enlightenment myth. As far as the torture of protestants or whatever, we also must remember that if catholic princes/rulers did that to protestants, so to did protestants do that to Catholics. Brutally and in great numbers. So, one could say that the 'martyrs of Jesus' were Catholics. If the Catholic church is the beast/antichrist/woman, etc., why is the Catholic church the one institution in the West (and I guess the Orthodox too) that is reliably pro-life? Just part of the devil's grand strategy of deception? It is very, very bad for one to base one's theology primarily on Revelation. In fact, one of the chief Protestant doctrines of interpretation is that that which is most clear in Scripture is most important, and that which isn't clear ought be left alone. Anyway.

And yes, the way Cardinal Egan handled the closing stinks.

In light of the sex abuse scandal, and various smaller scandals like this one, it baffles me how anyone can still believe in apostolic succession. Okay. Then what's the excuse in the Protestant/Evangelical denominations that don't have apostolic succession and the same thing happens? And please don't play the numbers game. Whether its one or a thousand, the fact that it *happens* at all is proof that people of all times and places can submit to sinful temptations. Apostolic succession is the guarantor of the faithful tranmission of the teachings of Christ down the corridors of time. It was never a guarantee that his disciples would never sin.

But what Egan did is typical of the American Catholic Church's priorities, even before the Sex Abuse Scandal. Think aboutit , what "value" was this Lithuanian Church? They probably did a decent Mass, without the folk dancing, unsingable songs, and other liturgical idiocies; they probably attended to the SPIRITUAL needs of their flock. How boring! Did they attend to the Holy Trinity (death-row inmates, illegal aliens, peace-loving Muslims)? Probably not. Where's the army of social justice folk to cry for the Mass murderer? Where's the thousands (or hundreds of thousands) of dollars raised for the aforementioned Holy Trinity? And if their Church had "historical value," then it probably looked like a church, instead of Taco Bell World Headquarters. They probably had kneelers or an alter rail, or other things that make Jesus sad. And if they had Saint relics in their alter...well those @$%#'s got what they deserved! Catholic Churches are for white, Anglo-liberals with lots of disposable income. Not crazy Lithuanians who want to pray the Rosary and take communion on the tongue. Everything's groovy now.

So are there any statistics showing the frequency of sex abuse in Protestant religions? Based on all I've read, far more abuse has been reported in the Catholic faith. And yes, I would say that the numbers do matter. Any organization that involves children is going to attract pedophiles. The Catholic Church is huge and with its many parochial schools and altar servers is a perfect vehicle for those who want access to children. While I am in no way excusing the miserable way that most of the bishops handled the crisis I would still submit that numerically speaking the number of Catholic priests who committed these crimes is low compared to those who didn't. Pedophiles look to repeat their behavior as much as possible so the number of victims per incident is often high. It's just been in the past couple of years that we are beginning to hear about similar scandals in the Protestant churches, not to mention teachers, coaches, and other adults who it seems are being convicted almost daily of sexually abusing minors. Having been raised Lutheran I was dismayed to find out that a Lutheran pastor teaching at the University of Chicago was convicted of possessing child pornography on his office computer. I attended an Episcopal parish for about a year before becoming Catholic. Just do a google of the sexual scandals that have rocked that denomination. No one is immune.

The problem, dad29, is that the pastor really isn't being fired as an "employee" of the Church and the parishioners certainly aren't employees. Besides, if the pastor lives at the parish rectory, he is essentially being kicked out of his HOME as well.

Watsy: "Pauli, I don't get you. What do Kathleen and Diane think of that video, and is that really a video that a friend would choose to share?" Watsy, as Diane, Kathleen and I are all Catholic I'm sure they think the same thing as I do about that ridiculous video. A "pre-anti-Christ" will be the next Pope as John Paul II redivivus? And I like the way they start playing a rap beat at that point. Might as well pick up a few racial bigots along the way to pad the anti-Catholic ranks. I'm just saying that once you say anything like "maybe the Catholic Church is the Whore of Babylon" it's time open your eyes to meet your new neighbors.

You know while I accept that there are some good men who became priests with good intentions, even if I disagree with the Catholic religion wholeheartedly, I do not believe they are the ones who have gained power positions within the Catholic church system, the fruits of the ones in the highest positions seem to be incredibly jaw-droppingly more and more evil. How come there has never been one "good" bishop to speak out against the nonsense of his surrounding colleagues who exhibit more and more criminal and corrupt behavior as time goes by? When Catholics tell me, that leaders sin making excuses for this stuff... of course!...it is EVERYWHERE in every kind of church, but the problem is, when just about all of them are corrupt and colluding together to protect criminal behavior...[the scandal of the scandals wasnt that sex abusers exsisted in your church, but the INSTITUTIONAL COVER-UP]-- you have a major problem. Just google BISHOP EGAN and BRIDGEPORT. This guy got promoted AFTER THAT? The whole system is broken, and I know that this is one reason for me as an ex-Catholic the teaching of apostolic succession collapsed like a house of cards.

This is absolutely ridiculous. Here is the Cardinal's press release. http://archny.org/news-events/news-press-releases/index.cfm?i=3956 Note: Sunday and Holy Day Masses were regularly attended by six to thirty persons. They were in English, inasmuch as the priest serving the parish for many years does not understand, read, or speak Lithuanian. There have been virtually no weddings or funerals in the church for years. Moreover, persons wishing to participate in Mass and parish activities in Lithuanian are informed of Lithuanian parishes in the neighboring Diocese of Brooklyn and Archdiocese of Newark. Your typical Catholic parish that falls below 500 families is a candidate for closing. 6-30 people is 1-10 families. Life goes on. There are 97 parishes in Manhattan alone. Talk about making a mountain out of a mole hill.

"I'm simply astonished by the coldness..." Obviously, because the Post no doubt gives us the entire story.

Just today there appeared two new stories of sexual abuse of minors by teachers, one male and one female (the female is married). The following statistics appeared on another blogsite: In a single year, 1998, the Dept of Justice listed 103,600 cases of sexual abuse in public schools. From 1950 to 2003, there were 10,667 reported cases of clergy sexual abuse. That's 10 times as much in one year as there were in 53 years in the Church. Yet nobody is passing laws singling out teachers for special exemption from ordinary laws. Only Catholics. It makes no more sense to demonize the entire Catholic hierarchy for the abuses committed by some than it would to condemn all teachers. Let the guilty, and only the guilty, be punished.

Nope. Merely proves the reality of original sin. By the way, I've always contended that married men who abuse their children are the most heinous of all. They are the first image of God for their children, not priests or ministers.

Pauli (and Simon above) both remember to recite the mantra: It's the anti-Catholic media's fault. Why do they keep picking on us? Wrong, Joel. I didn't (and don't) fault the media on this at all. Neither am I any sort of apologist for the U.S. Catholic hierarchy's attrocious handling of these cases. My point was that your claim that the congregational structure of Protestant churches prevents abuse and coverups doesn't hold water. What that kind of structure does prevent is the denomination becoming a fat target for plaintiffs lawyers. If a Protestant pastor does something unlawful or actionable, only the assets of his own local church are potentially at stake. Even if it's a mega-church, that's small potatoes for a plaintiffs lawyer. But consolidate hundreds of local churches into one big legal entity and you've got the potential makings of a trial lawyers retirement fund. That's what's going on with the Catholic Church. Whether abuse or coverups are prevalent within Protestant denominations is something I have no clue about. What I do know is that you'd hear about more of it if there were an entire sub-industry of lawyers dedicated to pursuing contingent fee lawsuits against those denominations. But the financial incentives simply aren't there to generate that kind of interest among plaintiff's lawyers. And few lawsuits means little basis for news coverage.