Check out what Pope Benedict said today:
The Vatican has set itself on a collision course with other Christian faiths, reaffirming the primacy of the Roman Catholic Church in a corrective document designed to clear up recent "erroneous" doctrine.The document's central claim that the Catholic Church is "the one true Church of Christ" is likely to revive a debate that has dogged the Vatican's dealings with other Christian faiths for decades.
The 16-page document, prepared by the Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith, which Pope Benedict used to head, describes Christian Orthodox churches as true churches but says they suffer from a "wound" because they do not recognise the primacy of the Pope.
But it says the "wound is still more profound" in the Protestant denominations, a view likely to further complicate relations with Protestants.
"Despite the fact that this teaching has created no little distress... it is nevertheless difficult to see how the title of 'Church' could possibly be attributed to them," it said.
I'm sure there'll be lots of howls over this, but you won't get them from me. Of course Benedict believes the fullness of the faith is denied to my church, the Orthodox Church, and to a greater degree the Protestant churches. He's the Pope of the Roman Catholic Church! If he believed anything else, he would be unfaithful to Church teaching and tradition. You can't believe what the Catholic Church teaches, and also affirm all of what Orthodoxy and/or Protestantism teach. I would expect a good Baptist to agree. I appreciate Benedict's clarification here, because in my years as a Catholic, I almost never heard a Catholic priest teach on what makes Catholicism distinctive, and why Catholic orthodoxy matters. One of the last Catholic homilies I heard before leaving my old parish in anger was a deacon thanking God from the pulpit that we Catholics aren't like those awful fundamentalist Protestants, who insist Jesus is the only way to God.
This is the kind of thing that Pope Benedict is trying to combat. I think all of us small-o orthodox believers ought to affirm him in this.
That said, it seems that Benedict may have used some unfortunate and unnecessary language in making his claim, at least judging from what was quoted by the press. I understand that the role of apostolicity is very, very important to Catholicism, as it is to Orthodoxy. Like Orthodoxy, Catholicism doesn't recognize the validity of the sacraments of other churches, because of the loss of apostolic succession. It's not a matter of being nasty about it; it's that we believe they broke apostolic succession, and therefore lost something vital. This is a theological matter, not a personal insult. But goodness, did the pope really need to say that it is difficult to see how you could even call Protestant bodies churches? That seems to me to be unnecessary, provocative and most unfortunate.
UPDATE: I've now found a copy of the actual document from Rome, which -- surprise! -- presents a more complex and nuanced picture than the press accounts did. This is really, really not a big deal. Read the document yourself. The pope is not saying that Protestants aren't Christians, or that people can't be saved unless they're Catholic. What he is saying is that the fullness of truth exists only in the Catholic Church -- that the rest of us have only part of the whole truth. I disagree, of course, but the Pope is right to say that. Secondly, he explains how for Catholics, the word "church" has a precise theological meaning. You can't have a church, in a historical and theological sense, without a valid Eucharist, and you can't have a valid Eucharist without a valid sacramental priesthood ... which you can't have without unbroken apostolic succession.
The pope is not denying the existence of the ecclesial communities of Protestantism, and he's not even denying that Christ's salvific work can be done through those communities. He's only clarifying what Catholicism teaches that a church, and the Church, is. As a former Catholic, I welcome this teaching, even as I disagree with parts of it. There is nothing to fear from clarifying our terms, and in fact a lot to fear from wanting to elide over what divides us, or even deny it, for the sake of ecumenism.
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Loran Washington DC
Anyone able to use their mind would know the pope is in error. The one and true God of the Roman Catholic Church created the universe more than 4.5 billion years ago. Man is known to have existed more than 6 million years ago. I refused to believe that God waited all this time ignoring thousand of churches (religions) and millions of his creation until recently, in the fourth century, to "affiliate" himself with the one and only true church. The church would have you believe that all existence before and after the establish Roman Catholic Church are doomed for eternity.
Do you truly believe an honest, truly lovable God would embrace only catholics to his kingdom? What would be his purpose to condemn non-catholic good people especially children? The document issued by the Vatican this week restating its believe that the Catholic Church is the only true church of Jesus Christ could best be described as both incredibly naive and utterly devoid of truth.
In view of the sexual behavior of so many priests and the deliberate cover up of the crime by cardinals and popes, you should seriously give some thoughts to why a good loving God would want to have anything to do with such a church. Can it be true that the pope is the direct descendant of St Peter as directed by God through his Son to be head of such a despicable church. Good God, do not let it be so.
I am here to tell you that the Roman Catholic church was the first "protestant" church when it broke from the Holy Orthodox Church around 1014. All the protestant churches and the Roman Catholics have much more in common than the Orthodox Church does with the Roman Church.
I am a convert to the Orthodox Church and I can tell you that it IS THE TRUTH! It is not just a bunch of rules. I am constantly being saved every day from my sins. He feeds me with his true body and blood. THIS IS REAL! Forgive me because it cannot be easily put into human words.
I beg all of you to come and see that the Lord is good and give up all these humanistic arguments and you will begin to understand what the Lord is all about.
Not being Orthodox is like being married to a person you have never met face-to-face.
Please do not argue or delay, but come at once to the truth and put away all this other foolishness an you will see how the centuries of errors made by Western Civiliazation is so wrong!
Orthodox Christian
I really do not understand what you are telling me other than implying that the Orthodox Church is the true church. From what you say does not make so.
In regards to you being saved every day from your sins, why do you sins so much? A God would be proud of me for I never sins. I obey the laws of the land and I have been staying out of trouble for some 80 years.
I am a good man. I am a generous man. I sponsor a child in Niger, Africa because the Lord does not seem to care about the millions that are starving in Africa. If all the members of the Orthodox Church would sponsor a child in Africa there would be no children starving. The Lord easily could make you do that.
In studying the history of religions I equate it with the history of world I can't help but think the world would be better off if there would not have been any religions. The Lord needs to explain to us why so many innocent children have to suffer. Maybe you could tell me.
What does it mean to "come at once to the truth." If man, especially religious people, would be truthful with mankind the world would be a better place to live. It takes a strong will individual, hard fact and evidence to know the truth. I am all for the truth when it is proven.
Loran
Dear Sir.
God has just led me to contact you and inform you that it is time to go around the world with the gospel of Jesus to make many people the desciples of Jesus.for we are living in the last of the last days Blessed are the people who are working with and for God their Reward is great.
God asked me this question and He told me to ask all the minister's of the gospel,
If you die/sleep in christ today do you have any thing tanchable which you will show God?Q,No 2 God asked me Do You Know where you are taking my people?you must know where you are taking the people of God the Destiny,You must Have Vission and mission but God told me many ministers of the gospel they have Vission But they don't have mission Think about that,
Lastly God Told me to affiliate my ministry with you we be friends invite each other and work together.unity is God's oriented Plan it is time for the church to be united,
Finally Am Apostle Tom The founder of the church called Oasis of Miracles based in Nairobi Kenya,
Feel free to contact me we plan on how to glorify God an do meetings together worlwide
Your's In God's service
Aposstle Tom
Box 8798-00200
Tel:+254722501110/+254733501110
Nairobi
Kenya
There is only ONE faith, ONE God and ONE Baptism ONE Church as is tought by the Lord. The idea of "churches" either "true" or "false" is the product of mans continued failure to obey God.
Being a "good person" is not the issue. Many good people who love all other people are in constant disregard to the commandments of Jesus Christ. So it is good to be a good person.....it is better to obey the Lords Holy Word in all things so that in being good that 'good' bares fruit in Christ name alone and not ours. This is understood by Christs followers.
We are by nature disobedient creatures. And have created confusion for oursleves. WE are like the Jews of old.
If we could obey then we could love each other without conditon of any kind. Upon which we would have no wars or crimes agianst humanity such as what has been heaped onto innocent nations that have been under the iron foot of wicked albiet more powerful nations for the last 2oo to 3oo years and beyond.
Love without conditions at all is the wholeness of the truth which is the primal substance of the ONE HOLY UNIVERSAL, APOSTOLIC CHURCH established by Christ alone and given to His Twelve Apostles to expand to all humanity.
This not imply modern day "apostles". The Holy Church has only 12..that is it and we know them from the Holy Scripture and the life of the Church. Anything more is folly...unholy folly.
In this way we need no reference to Rome or Popes or any nation of men. We need only reference God.
Christ is the savior of the world.
Teaching people about papal supremacy and all the other pomp is like clouds without water or a fig tree that bares no fruit.
People are starving in Africa because of the greed of man. he greediast men on earth are behind the atrocities on that God blessed continent. God loves all of us. WE cause the pain we have.
Thanks
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