Onward and upward with the ROP
Friday November 30, 2007
Categories: Islam
A thousand foaming lslamic loonies took to the streets of Khartoum today, demanding the execution of that poor British schoolteacher who allowed her pupils to name a teddy bear Muhammad. Boy, I can't imagine why the immigration from Islamic countries...
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Rod Dreher is an editorial columnist for the Dallas Morning News, and author of "Crunchy Cons" (Crown Forum), a nonfiction book about conservatives, most of them religious, whose faith and political convictions sometimes put them at odds with mainstream conservatives. The views expressed in this blog are his own.
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So what is the perspective, then, war on "Islam"?
I'm just about finished reading While Eupore Slept. I'm a liberal French Canadian, I have no problem with gay marriage and want to have as open a dialog as I can with my Muslim neighboors. I spent nearly 9 years working side by side with many Muslims in a technical firm here in Montreal. I found them to be conservative, we disagreed on many things, but none of them were Islamist radicals. If, for instance, any one of them would have mentioned that I should perhaps not wear skirts in the summer because it offended their religion, I would not have been very pleased and most probably would have continued to wear my skirts. I'm absolutly appalled at the ridiculous lenghts to which some people will go to appease. I'm shocked to read what is happening in Europe... frankly, it scares the crap ou of me!!
I don't think our lens is big or distant enough for real perspective. How about "we're screwed up, you're worse?"
There are a lot of Muslims out there who are hard working and trying to scratch out an existance for them and their families, just like us. The problem being that unlike the extremeist Christian fringe, The Islamic fringe is very vocal about it's needs to destroy what they view as offense, which is just about everything Jewish and western. I'm not to worried about the KKK or Fred Phelps lighting up a nuke, the Islamist fringe can't wait to do it - THAT scares the hell out of me.
Phil
Absolutely, Phil. Even though I think what is happening in Khartoum is sheer demagoguery, I can't forget that's how the Nazis starte out as well.
"While Europe Slept" is a good book, as is Paul Berman's "Terror and Liberalism." To balance those out, I recommend Reza Aslan's, "No god but God." Aslan is a Muslim who has written an incredibly literate, exciting, and sympathetic history of Islam that places it in context with other great religions.
It helped me to remember that there are Muslims out there who aren't Islamists, Wahabists, or radical Shiites.
I just read the article on the MSN homepage. This kind of reaction to "insults to Islam," causes people like me to conclude that Islam is the most weak and brittle faith that has ever existed. That's my emotional reaction to the story.
How long before the Dhimmis Among Us compare these marchers to abortion-clinic vigils and pickets of THE LAST TEMPTATIONS OF CHRIST, and relatives the calls for death to the fact that the US has the death penalty ("murder by the Christianist Governor of Arkansas!!!") ...
5 ... 4 ...3 ...
They don't care what your reaction is, Alicia. That's where they're off base. They need to care.
It helped me to remember that there are Muslims out there who aren't Islamists, Wahabists, or radical Shiites.
And those voices would be raised where? I'm not hearing....
Too true, Victor. And should the scimitar ever be placed at their throat, their last words will be, "Congratulations for beating the Christianists to the punch!"
Susan, I suggest reading Reza Aslan's book. He's a most impressive young man (only in his early 30's, I believe) and a voice for truly moderate Islam.
I agree, the imams who are engaged in this demagoguery don't give a darn (I'd prefer to use a more colorful word, but) about what I believe. But, we have to speak up anyway, because there are people who do care.
As I said on the thread below, the "Yes, but" crowd who are justifying extremist actions in the name of Islam are mostly (IMO) very well-intentioned people. But they are also dead wrong.
See .... I always had this funny idea in my head that religions were more than the sum of the negative actions of the people who purport to adhere to them. How much more is UBL reflective of Islam the religion as a catechism (i.e. pick up the proverbial catechism and say "I believe this, all of it") vs. an IRA bomber is reflective of Catholicism? Before everyone jumps all over me and slings USA/Western hating invective at me, I'm not saying said UBL and said IRA bomber are equivalent.
I always had this idea in my head that Christians were taught by Jesus to ask forgiveness of their fellows regardless of their fellows asking their forgiveness in turn.
I always had this idea that defending my faith meant speaking its truths, living its truths, and disagreeing when I believe someone misrepresents the faith. (I realize many of you will roll your eyes at the irony of that given my not being in alignment with the catechism of the RC on the matter of homoesexuality). OTOH, defending my *country* may require police or military action.
When Bruce Thornton accuses the signers of not defending their faith, I'd like someone to exaplain to me exactly what defending one's faith means. Perhaps he is conflating religion with culture, or mayhaps even confusing religion with country.
This "Christendom" vs. "Islam" business seems so .... 13th century .... to me. Just as Muslims live everywhere in the world, so, mostly, do Christians.
If we want to talk about politics being hijacked by radical fundamentalist Islam, OK doke, I'm on board. Bad bad bad bad bad. But I'd assume that when we're talking about Muslims, we're also talking about US citizens, Europeans and places like Turkey, Morocco and many other countries that are not necessarily in the grip of radical fundamentalist Islam like Sudan, Nigeria, Saudi Arabia, parts of Pakistan, etc etc etc
BTW, that last sentence was quite poorly formed. I meant countries not in the grip of radical Islam *unlike* Sudan, Nigeria, SA, parts of Pak, etc.
I'm not saying said UBL and said IRA bomber are equivalent
Good. Because one of the more obvious differences is that IRA bombers never claimed to be fighting for Catholicism. The IRA has from the beginning explicitly disavowed any religious affiliation (they prefer the term "Nationalist"), and the Catholic Church has consistently condemned membership in armed secret societies (including the IRA, Fenians, etc.). IRA members certainly aren't characterized by any sort of religious zeal.
crowd who are justifying extremist actions in the name of Islam are mostly (IMO) very well-intentioned people. But they are also dead wrong.
You mean members in good standing of RoP who celebrated 9/11 are well-intentioned people?
Forgot to take your meds?
mik, I believe you misunderstood I was saying, and the personal attack is beneath you. At least I hope it is.
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