Bill Gates wants Congress to create more H1B visas so Microsoft can hire more foreign computer professionals. Maximos doesn't like it:
Shorter Bill Gates: "The failure of the Congress to grant permission to my company to subvert the professional middle classes by importing cheaper labour only means that I have to subvert the professional middle classes by outsourcing their jobs. Heads, I win; tails, they lose. But having to outsource their labour looks overly penurious, while importing foreign programmers looks so progressive and cosmopolitan. So can we please shaft the American people my way?"
I have a couple of American computer-industry friends who got pushed out of work because of H1B visas, so I'm partial to Maximos's position. And I'm philosophically inclined to this position as well. But in truth, I don't know a lot about this issue. Could ye who do please advise?
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We are also diminishing our national capability to undertake work in the computer, mathematical, and hard sciences. After all, the government has now told a generation of Americans that low wages are more important than having skills, ability, and experience. Good to know that law school is always an option, since we're the unquestioned leaders in litigation (and no one else appears to want to compete there).
Correct. Imported cheap workers in a field depresses wages all the way up and down that field. It's happened in unskilled labor, and it's happened in the IT industry.
The exact same thing is true with offshoring to another company, or opening overseas offices. Which is also a major problem in IT, which is why IT is falling apart.
And this situation is helped along by both parties. The right makes appeals to 'free markets' and the left makes appeals to 'globalization', but they're both just working for business interests who, in a classic tragedy of the commons, have decided to sell to, but not employ, Americans, little realizing that if Americans don't have jobs, they can't buy anything.
We need protectionism. We need it hard, and we need it fast.
On the Democratic side, 'globalization' and 'free trade' are pushed mostly by the Democratic Leadership Council and the New Democrat Coalition.
I don't know what's going on the Republican side, except that Romney was the supposed candidate of 'business interests'.
It's one thing to be 'pro-business', but all too often what that actually means is 'at the expense of American workers'. There's absolutely no reason to oppose tariffs. Free trade is a mindbogglingly stupid idea, especially for Republicans, who like to complain about taxes...all free trade does is result in us taxing only Americans.
Much has been spoken about the Chinese and Indian H1B visa holders, but as a few previous commenters have mentioned, there are Westernized people wanting to come in, such as Russians, Poles and Israelis. Is it so wrong that people such as these try to find legal ways to enter the country and contribute to the American economy? It's much more kosher than having illegal immigrants hiring "coyotes" to cross the border so that they can live here illegally--all the while sending money back to the motherland.
His (presumably Brin's?) PHD advisor was Mexican but lets not let facts get in the way.
Posted by: Peter | March 13, 2008 8:04 PM
Congratulations Peter.
You proved it.
Brin is a product of world-renown Mexican Computer Science Research and we should call him RussoJewMexoAdvisedAmericanCitizen.
Obviously, it proves that we need another 3-5 million educated H1B serfs in this country.
as a few previous commenters have mentioned, there are Westernized people wanting to come in, such as Russians, Poles and Israelis. Is it so wrong that people such as these try to find legal ways to enter the country and contribute to the American economy?
Posted by: Sherry | March 14, 2008 3:43 PM
God bless you Sherry, your good nature and naivity will help you in his world.
In this world, dear Sherry, God forbid if your children have an average IQ.
There are millions of brilliant people among 6 Billion world population.
With all those brilliant foreigners coming in, I'm afraid your children just might have to settle for a shift manager job at McDonalds, at best.
Besides, a brilliant (not really, usually an average programmer with BS) creates lots of externalities (look it up).
He is not a robot, he is human. He brings his wife -- she may or may not be able to contribute much. He brings his children -- taxpayers immediatly on hook for school at $8K/year per child.
And --- drum beat--- he brings his parents and his in-laws!
In a short time all those elderly -- 4 in the worst case -- will be on SSI (look it up).
SSI + Medicaid will run at about $40K/year per elderly.
Do you think your brilliant foreign programmer pays $160K/year in taxes?
I say bring in Russian and Czech hokey players, Dominican baseball players, Argentinian basketballers -- those guys with incomes of $500K and up will really contribute to the economy.
Foreign programmers? Drain on taxpayers.
OK,
The companies I know of aren't using H1Bs to fill positions like that and I'm Microsoft isn't wasting their H1Bs for jobs like that. Heck the legal fees for an H1B employee are likely half that salary. They are hiring masters-level people (which is becoming a norm). Many of these folks got their BS level educations overseas and attended grad school here. These same grad schools cannot find enough qualified US citizens to enroll in their programs.
Like I said, I'm trying to raise my kids to qualify for these positions and I see that the education situation is improving but it's still a long road ahead and I want there to be a healty US techology industry when they get there.
Posted by: SiliconValleySteve | March 13, 2008 1:41 PM
Steve you are hopeless. You live in SiliValley and you don't know basic stuff about job market.
I don't care for you, you are adult and choose to be iqnorant.
But why you are hurting your kids?
You are steering them towards field where they will be competing with people just as smart and educated as they are making $6/hour working in horrible conditions.
All the time observing they more clever friends making 2, 3, 4 times as much money working in fields that are shilded from outsourcing and immigration impact.
What so good about getting MS in CS from, say UC Davis, and make $75K while a nurse with 2 year degree makes $180K accross the road?
If it would be up to me, I would send Children Protection Services to your home, Steve, to check what other nonsense you push into young heads of your children.
Don't you have a wise uncle or somebody to bring you to reality?
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