Webb: Affirmative action hurts Obama

True enough. How would your conservative friends react, though, to a policy that gave a bit more of a helping hand to disadvantaged children irregardless of race?

Barack Obama is affirmative action incarnate! Geraldine Ferraro was right: would a white man with his thin political resume ever be considered presidential material? Democratic caucus goes and primary voters were voting for him precisely because he was black.

I remember Obama saying he was an uninspired underachiever in high school. Fair enough. Like Obama, I too went to an Ivy League school. Let me tell you: this white son of the working class would never have gotten into that school if he had been an uninspired underachiever in high school. You can't believe how much this stuff burns me up!

"Both have gone a long way because they have certain intangibles that seem to inspire a lot of people."

Like their race.

And their membership in unpopular religious groups, eh pyrrho?

I'm just here to trot out my deceased equine and point out that;

1) Affirmative action was established by a series of executive orders, not by legislation.

2) I don't see an "objectively more qualified white male" licking his wounds because Obama is getting more votes due to the arbitrary affirmative action myth of quotas and the like. Neither do I see a list of voters complaining that they were forced to vote for Obama due to affirmative action compliance.

People were voting against Kennedy precisely because he was Catholic.

Some people are voting for each of the candidates because of their race or gender. In terms of people getting into schools, wasn't W a legacy? Is pyrrho just as burned up about him?

Finally, Obama has stated that he doesn't believe his children should be the beneficiaries of affirmative action. So, it remains to be seen whether he can go beyond it or not. Neither Bush I, nor II, nor Reagan nor Ford eliminated affirmative action [and it is a presidential executive order that established it so any of them could have done it]. It was under the Nixon administration, by the way, that goals were established. I don't know that Obama will end it, but he has more of a chance to revise it....he seems more open to listening to various sides. In his Philadelphia speech, he acknowledged the feelings of some whites about affirmative action. Can you imagine anyone else doing so?

"The idea that the Ivy-educated Michelle Obama, who makes a hefty six-figure income off the scammy diversity industry, has the nerve to complain about how unfair life is, rubs some people the wrong way."

What does being a VP at the University of Chicago focusing on community affairs have to do with the "scammy diversity industry"? I know she gets under your skin, but at least let's make a bit of sense.

And Webb apparently has no problem with either of the Obama's benefitting from Affirmative Action--if they did--because he understands the significant for African Americans.

"The idea that the Ivy-educated Michelle Obama, who makes a hefty six-figure income off the scammy diversity industry, has the nerve to complain about how unfair life is, rubs some people the wrong way."

Yeah, don't those uppity nigras make you sick to your stomach, especially the ones who think they're too good to be domestics and go to law school.....

Maybe some of the resentment settles around the very question. Why is it that when ninety percent black voters go for Obama it isn't discussed, but in the few contests where sixty percent of whites go for Clinton they are assumed to be racists? Why is any criticism of Obama judged as racism, but his pastor inciting racial hatred against "whitey" viewed as just a colorful religious tradition?

"Why is it that when ninety percent black voters go for Obama it isn't discussed, but in the few contests where sixty percent of whites go for Clinton they are assumed to be racists? Why is any criticism of Obama judged as racism, but his pastor inciting racial hatred against "whitey" viewed as just a colorful religious tradition?"

Why is it that most whites seem to forget that Obama is half white?

Maybe some of the resentment settles around the very question. Why is it that when ninety percent black voters go for Obama it isn't discussed, but in the few contests where sixty percent of whites go for Clinton they are assumed to be racists? Why is any criticism of Obama judged as racism, but his pastor inciting racial hatred against "whitey" viewed as just a colorful religious tradition?

Only after Europeans are kidnapped and brought to this and other countries by Africans and African-Americans, and subject to a 400-year (and counting) history of slavery, oppression and inequality, will the above statment will have some coherence.

pyrrho: I'm not sure why Obama got into the schools he did. Was it because of affirmative action or was it because of great SAT/ACT scores. I don't know. He did get in and apparently he excelled. I can understand the frustrations you speak of. Interestingly enough, Obama said that he did also in the Philadelphia speech.

In terms of the posts saying that 90% of blacks voted for Obama, what's the usual percentage who vote for a Democrat? Some of those are going to go for him no matter what. What percentage of blacks are voting for him because he's black? I don't know. Maybe it's a lot. It probably is. I do know, that when people were interviewed in exit polls in the Ky and WVa primaries, something like 20% said it was because of race and 80% of those voted for HRC. Now, persumably that 16% who voted for HRC voted for her because she's a white candidate. And presumbably race is an even greater factor because most people are unlikely to say that it is to a complete stranger. I'm not sure where the feelings that any one who doesn't vote for Obama is considered a racist is coming from. I've never heard that from anyone. What I've heard are the statistics cited here.

The same kind of thing went on on the Republican side concerning religion. There was endless talk about Romney being a Morman. Did some people vote against him because of that...undoubtedly...or at least he thought it was enough of a problem that he had to give a major speech about it. Group hatred is very strong in a human beings. Shiites v Sunnis, Catholics v Protestants, Jews v Samaratins [how's that for a biblical reference], Serbs v Croats, Germans v fill in the blank, Japanese v Koreans and Chinese...the list goes on and on. Conservatives v Liberals.

If you don't think "poor working class whites" don't benefit from white privilege, you're wrong.

Affirmative action is needed because there has never been a point where our society has stopped being racist at an institutional level. White people have simply gotten better at convincing themselves that their racist views aren't racist, and they're "just telling it like it is".

If you want an example, read Rod's post about IQ tests that implies blacks are inherently less intelligent than whites.

White privilege is invisible to most white people because A) they have the luxury of mostly ignoring race as a factor in their lives, B) they have racist attitudes they accept as fact, C) it's in their best interest not to acknowledge the benefits of being white in this country, D) it makes them very uncomfortable, and--

E) It implies (correctly) that there has been UNNAMED, UNOFFICIAL AFFIRMATIVE ACTION for white people since this country began.

White people can't stand the thought that their achievements might be influence by something other than their merits.

P.S. I'm white, too.

Quinn: Last time I looked Clinton was still a Democrat.

You are quite right. I guess I didn't explain my point very well. The question is, what percentage of black voters are voting for Obama because he is half black? It is not necessarily 90%. Some blacks are voting for Obama on the basis that they think he is a better presidential candidate. And some people, whether white or black are voting for a variety of reasons, including race.

MSNBC has a site with exit polls. I only looked at NC because there was a substantial black population in that primary. Of the whites who said race was a factor, 62% voted for Clinton. Of the whites who said race was not a factor, 61% voted for Clinton. Of the blacks who said race was a factor, 92% voted for Obama. Of the blacks who said race was not a factor 90% voted for Obama. Quite frankly, what does any of that mean? I don't think anyone can really tell what percentage of whites or blacks are voting on the basis of race.

Many blacks supported HRC over Obama at the beginning of this campaign. I don't remember the figures, but Obama was not getting any where near 90% support among blacks. Now, they didn't change their support because they suddenly found out that Obama is black. They changed it for other reasons. So, I don't think you can say that black or white support of a candidate is solely on the basis of race.

I am a single, white, working class, non-custodial, male, parent.

I made child support payments on my own for 5 years until the Government stepped in and garnished my paychecks. This made me homeless and out of work.

I went to a job support center and asked for help getting a higher paying job or at least help affording training. The lady who helped me told me she would look into it and call me back. When she did she told me that if I was female and/or a minority then there was help for me but since I was not there was no help.

Where I live most of the help wanted ads say hiring bilingual. We all know this means Spanish speaking. So the Latinos get the jobs and the blacks get the affirmative action loophole.

My son and his mother are the true victims for not being born a minority

My mother went to the Department Of Motor Vehicles and could not understand the Latino lady working because her English was so bad. The lady got angry at my mother and her picture for the license was lost and she had to go get it retaken.

We need One language here in America vand we need to have equality for everyone.

Including single white noncustodial male parents.