Noah Millman faces an interesting dilemma:
[O]ne of these days [my young son is] going to deserve a more serious discussion of the war than we've had to-date. Let's say my son was nine years old - old enough to comprehend more than good guys versus bad guys. How, in narrative terms, would you explain the Iraq war? On the assumption that you didn't want to say either that, "Iraq is only one front in World War IV, the global struggle against Islamofascism" or "we went to war so the President could get back at the guy who tried to kill his dad, make money for his buddies in the oil business, and protect Israel."Suggestions?
That's a great question. I'd like to take a stab at it, and I hope you will too. It's not a theoretical question for me. I have a son who's almost nine, and will be asking more serious questions before too much longer. Here's a stab at how I might explain it to him in terms he can understand, while being as honest as I can in my judgment without being overly ideological:
The Iraq War happened because our country was attacked on September 11 by Arab Muslim terrorists. Everybody realized how much danger we were in by some crazy Muslims, that they could hurt us worse than we thought. Saddam Hussein was the evil dictator of Iraq, and we had fought one war with him already. President Bush and his advisers thought that Muslims in the Arab world were so unhappy because they lived in countries that are unfair, and where they were poor compared to Americans, that they ended up using their religion to hate us. So President Bush thought if we can just get rid of the bad dictators in the Middle East, where the Arab Muslims live, then they people would see they could have a better life by living like we do, and they would want to be just like us. So President Bush and his advisers got everybody to think that Iraq might have been behind the 9/11 attacks, or might come do something like that to us again.It's not certain whether or not President Bush really believed that, or was using it as an excuse to start a war to destroy the old order in the Middle East, and replace it with an order -- that is, a way of running a country and a society -- that was more like us. The idea is that if the people were more like us, they wouldn't hate us. And the idea was that all people deep down want to be like us.
So we attacked Iraq and destroyed the Iraqi government, and got rid of the evil Saddam Hussein. But then things went wrong. It turned out that not all the people were glad we were there. It turned out that the people of Iraq didn't really want to be like us, not most of them. They wanted to be like themselves, and they hated having a foreign army in their country. A lot of these were really bad people, especially the crazy Muslim ones who used their religion to justify killing our soldiers, Iraqi people who weren't Muslims, and Iraqi people who weren't the right kind of Muslims. but we couldn't just leave, because we screwed their country up by invading it.
However, it should be said that they had screwed it up bad enough on their own. We were dumb to invade, but we really did give them a chance to make a better country for themselves, and they've done a bad job of it for a lot of different reasons. Still, it looks like now that we made it worse for them by invading, though maybe things will get better in the end. Certainly we made it far worse for the Iraqi Christians. They had hard lives anyway, and we pretty much ruined them while not meaning to.
The war cost a lot of money, way more than President Bush said it was going to cost. It's really hurt our army. We don't know when they'll be able to come home. The war did us no real good, and ended up helping our enemy Iran. President Bush and his advisers did a lousy job running the thing. The lessons are that America isn't as powerful as we like to think we are; that not everybody in the world wants to be like us; that you can't force people to do what's best for them; that if you're really scared or mad, you can be tricked into going along with things without fully thinking them through; it's easier for the people of a country to agree to go to war when they don't have to go themselves, or know anybody doing the fighting; and that sometimes a country has no choice but to fight a war, but a country really really really should only go to war as a last resort.
Your uncle fought in the war, and like most of our soldiers, was very brave and good and loyal and only wanted to help people. He risked his life to help people who wanted to kill him and other American soldiers. The world is a crazy place. What we have in America is a very special thing, and we shouldn't forget it. It's not way of the world. Thank God.
I need to polish that. What's your version, for your kid? Try to be as truthful to your judgment on the war, whatever it is, without being preachy. It's kind of hard, given how much we argue about it.
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Like I said ... there's no deluder like a self-deluder ...
Awaiting a list all the successful attacks by Islamic terrorist groups in the U.S the last few years
(I guess it will come right after the apologies from all those who said the war is lost, the surge won't work, etc.)
Awaiting a list all the successful attacks by Islamic terrorist groups in the U.S the last few years
Also awaiting a list of all successful attacks by shape-shifting reptilians in the U.S. in the last few years.
(I guess it will come right after the apologies from all those who said the Chariots of the Gods is bunk, that tinfoil hats won't work, etc.)
Our troops are in Iraq for a lot of reasons. Some of them were discussed before the war, and some of them were not.
1. One reason our troops are in Iraq is to help contain and counter Iran's growing power and to give the United States and other leaders more leverage in our efforts to influence Iran's behavior. (That's important because Iran's leaders say on an almost daily basis that they wish to destroy both the United States and Israel - the only freedom, democratic country in the region - and they're currently developing nuclear weapons in pursuit of those goals. They also threaten the sunni countries to Iran's west - who quite possible hate and fear the Iranians even more than the Iranians hate and fear us.)
Also, because of Iraq's location between Iran and Syria, our troops in Iraq make the supply and coordination of Iran's various proxy groups in Lebanon, Syria and Gaza potentially more difficult and potentially more vulnerable.
Any direct assault on our allies by Iran would have to navigate past/over/by/through a large US occupied zone to their west.
Finally, if it becomes necessary to attack Iran, we have the men, material and installations already in place to do so.
2. In the past, Oil wealth in the ME has been monopolized or threatened by brutal dictators who use the money and influence to spread radical, violent ideologies, threaten and destabalize other countries, and support islamist groups and militias which do not believe in freedom and often attack their host countries. Our troops are in Iraq to make sure that Iraq's oil does not fall under the control of, and can't be threatened by, unfriendly groups and regimes -not now and not in the future.
3. Also, our leaders believe that if we can help make just one stable, democratic, friendly country in the ME, it will change the dynamic of the whole region and then other countries in the area will begin to move toward self-governance and moderation as well. In this way, the United States hopes to take momentum and power away from the worst groups and regimes.
It's a very risky plan, and it's too early to know if it will work. But Iraq now has a fairly friendly, democratically elected government and our troops, along with the Iraqis, have seriously discredited one of the very worst islamist groups in the world, Al Qaeda - which had mobilized a very large effort against us and also against the new Iraqi government at the time of the invasion.
Here's my response to the text that he posted from Rod:
I have a problem with, "So President Bush thought if we can just get rid of the bad dictators in the Middle East, where the Arab Muslims live, then they people would see they could have a better life by living like we do, and they would want to be just like us. "
It should have read, "So President Bush thought if we can just get rid of the bad dictators in the Middle East, where the Arab Muslims live, then people would be able to realize their God-given right to live freely in a democracy, which could be set up and established in accordance with their customs to fit their lives."
Rod wrote: "So President Bush and his advisers got everybody to think that Iraq might have been behind the 9/11 attacks, or might come do something like that to us again."
It Should be: "So President Bush, after reviewing the best known intelligence at the time that had been collected by the US and other allies (Britain, Russia, NATO, etc), enforced the consequences of 17 different United Nations security council resolutions, which clearly stipulated that military force would be used against Iraq."
Rod wrote: "The idea is that if the people were more like us, they wouldn't hate us. And the idea was that all people deep down want to be like us."
It should be: "The idea is that democracies don't go to war with one another because they are too busy being free and being prosperous."
Rod wrote: "So we attacked Iraq and destroyed the Iraqi government, and got rid of the evil Saddam Hussein. But then things went wrong. It turned out that not all the people were glad we were there. It turned out that the people of Iraq didn't really want to be like us, not most of them. They wanted to be like themselves, and they hated having a foreign army in their country."
It should read, "So we attacked Iraq and destroyed the Iraqi government, and got rid of the evil Saddam Hussein. Things weren't perfect. No war is perfect. In this case, Iraq became a magnet for every Muslim extremist who ever had a poster of Osama hanging in his room growing up. In fact, so many foreign fighters flooded into Iraq to destabilize the situation, that it was just about an all out regional civil war. This was really bad. What was worse, Iraq's neighbor Iran, provided weapons and money to the foreign fighters to further deteriorate the situation. It turned out that the Iraqis needed our help even more - so much that when we asked them if they'd like us to leave, they said 'no -we still need you here', and haven't asked us to leave yet."
Rod wroteL "A lot of these were really bad people, especially the crazy Muslim ones who used their religion to justify killing our soldiers, Iraqi people who weren't Muslims, and Iraqi people who weren't the right kind of Muslims.
He should add, "When all the Muslims were fighting each other, they were too damn busy to realize that an actual democracy had been set up around them. Some realized it, but just boycotted it because they didn't understand that getting involved gave them a meaningful stake in their country and in their futures. One group of Muslims participated in the democracy before the other groups - and they started getting the picture. Now most of the groups are participating - so much so that they are becoming more in charge of stabilizing their own country again. They have a long way to go. Things are not perfect yet. It's even quite interesting to see a democracy being born and not too hard to imagine our own democracy when it was originally set up. Heck, ours took a good 35 or 40 years to really get set up. We had violence and bloodshed too - but it eventually got formed into the democracy that we wanted it to. And, it's still not done."
Rod wrote: "The war did us no real good, and ended up helping our enemy Iran."
It should read, "The war, despite helping our enemy Iran in the short term, may prove to be the formative watershed moment that began a generation-long transformation of the Middle East. Provided that we show resolve to stick with the sometimes painful and costly transformation, your kids may live to see the Middle East the way it once was in the 7th century, before radical extremism took over Islam like a cancer - and help it back to being the shining star of culture and civilization."
Rod wrote: "It's easier for the people of a country to agree to go to war when they don't have to go themselves, or know anybody doing the fighting; and that sometimes a country has no choice but to fight a war, but a country really really really should only go to war as a last resort."
It should read, "It's easy for a country to go to war when we think it's going to be cake walk. We should have studied things a bit more. But, it's also easy to play Monday Morning Quarterback too. There were alot of well respected people from both political parties that agreed to go to war based on the best intelligence at the time. Heck, nobody took the decision lightly. We even have a Presidential Candidate today (John McCain), who's own son is fighting in Iraq on this very day, who was in on the decision making. He was one of the men who voted to goto war, knowing full well his own son may some day have to fight there. What noble and honorable men we have leading this great country that would even follow principal if it meant their own children would have to wage war!"
Son, the reason why America went to war was because someone had to pay for what happened at 9/11.
It was the second round of revenge, only we weren't sure who to go after, once we were mostly finished with Afghanistan.
The first attacks were against the Taliban in Afghanistan, and that group was really a threat to everyone's peace and safety. So, along with UN forces, the US destroyed Afghanistan's Taliban government.
But knocking over the Taliban wasn't enough. Nobody found Al Qaeda's top people, including Osama Bin Laden. He was probably the one that they really wanted to catch.
Because they were so frustrated, they went looking for other places to do harm to the people they thought meant to hurt us. The next most "bad" person left was Saddam Hussein. The president said he believed that Iraq had weapons that could kill lots of people. Lots of people argue over whether anyone even really believed that, or if it was just a lie, but in the end, very little evidence that Iraqis had any real capability to hurt us, was ever found. Nevertheless, the US decided to go in alone, without help or agreement from any other country, and attack Iraq, and overthrow Saddam Hussein. Many brave men and women, American soldiers, have died because of this, and many innocent Iraqis, most of them innocent men, women, and children, have died because of this. We're still trying to figure out when, if ever, and how, to get out of this horrible situation.
W
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