Obama talks while McCain acts
Wednesday September 24, 2008
McCain has gone to Washington today to help work on the bailout crisis. Obama is on TV right now, saying he's planning to stay on the campaign trail, and stay in touch with Harry Reid and Nancy Pelosi by phone....
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Rod Dreher is an editorial columnist for the Dallas Morning News, and author of "Crunchy Cons" (Crown Forum), a nonfiction book about conservatives, most of them religious, whose faith and political convictions sometimes put them at odds with mainstream conservatives. The views expressed in this blog are his own.
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Oh? What would your reaction be if Obama had suggested this maneuver? It's always good to check your motives by switching roles.
How about Palin debate Biden on Friday then? After all, it's good practice for her to step in on short notice for presidential duties!
Not to be rude, but this is a publicity stunt of McCain. It may work; it may not. McCain can't really do anything in that kind of a meeting; neither can Obama. If anything, it makes it look like McCain is trying to dodge the debate. :)
And McCain said himself that he doesn't know about the economy.
Show what would a man who doesn't know about the economy do? :)
Call me cynical, but given that A. McCain has never shown much interest in economic affairs in the past, B. He (and in fairness, Obama) didn't say or do anything months or years ago but let the good times roll, C. Obama is back ahead in the polls with McCain and Palin dropping, D. Postponing the debate would be strategically better for McCain than for Obama, since it might slow Obama's momentum (whereas McCain has less momentum to lose), and E. McCain's campaign manager has been dodging meetings since the revelation that he was a huge recipient of money from Freddie Mac--given all these factors, there may be something a little bit less than noble concern for the U.S. economy at work here. In any case, we'll see.
Great post, Rod. A lot of conservative Republicans have been annoyed by McCain over the years, especially when he crossed the aisle to work with Feingold and Kennedy and Lieberman on contentious issues.
Looks like McCain is doing the same thing, and I applaud his decision to suspend the campaign and head to the Capitol and work with Democrats and Republicans to try to work through a solution. It looks like that, as with the surge, he'd rather risk losing an election than see the country go down the drain.
Yeah, let, Obama talk and talk and talk and talk and talk .....
As for the debate that is (was?) scheduled for Friday, I think most observers agree that McCain would have come across better than Obama, judging by the preview we saw at Saddleback. Otherwise, why else would Obama need to take three days off and invest time in "debate camp." Isn't Obama ready already?
I don't know that it is such a contrast - McCain's been absent from Washington during the negotiations thus far. Why should we assume that his showing up now will constructively help the process? Does he even know the details of the proposals as they stand today? I'm thinking especially of any drafts or not-yet-publicly-announced aspects of the plan that those already involved in the negotiation certainly are up to date on.
As a potential president, isn't it actually more important for the public to hear what he plans to do if placed in a position of immensely greater authority? The debate would be a good place to show off some long-term planning and foresight rather than jumping into a process he's already been absent from during key stages in order to grab headlines about "putting his country first".
Rod -- for all of the times you lament how the GOP has suckered you into supporting them before letting you down, I'm awfully surprised that you just bought this hook, line, and sinker.
This is all stunt, zero substance, and nothing more than pathetic posturing in an attempt to spin some advantage his way in the polls.
I'll cross my fingers that we end up with a President who is able to handle more than one thing at a time, because dealing with foreign policy v. dealing with domestic policy is not an either/or proposition once in the White House.
Politically, a pretty cheap, transparent, slimy move to try to shove Obama into a corner, but pretty brilliant all the same. Turning cheap, dishonest, slime into success has worked for the last eight years, so why not again now, eh?
I'm all for having the debate. I really want to hear now what they both have to say about what happened in the past, what is happening now and what is going to happen when they take over the White House.
I'm not sure what McCain is going to do if he isn't on the committee drafting the bill. While it would be great for all three Sen to be there for the vote, I don't think cancelling the debate is more then a stunt.
Maybe this is one of those times when you probably should reserve your initial reaction until things play out a bit?
OTOH, I guess I should not expect Dreher reaction to be 'luke-warm'. :}
There you have a man who wants to talk about fixing the economy, versus a man who is actually on Capitol Hill right now doing the hard work to actually fix the economy. I mean, hell, this is by far the biggest issue the next president will have to deal with; you'd think a real leader would want to have some hand in crafting the solution.
Ah yes, Thank god that McCain is here! After the preening for the cameras concludes the real work can begin.
Is he still waving his copy of Greenspans book around when he speaks on economic matters?
versus a man who is actually on Capitol Hill right now doing the hard work to actually fix the economy.
Considering McCain's record on the subject of the economy (he was for leverage before he was against) and his habit of grandstanding (which tends to make conservative people dislike), if you came up to me and said that in your best movie trailer voice, I would... burst out laughing. Like I did just now. And then I would feel bad, because I like you... and then I would start giggling again at the idea that this should make me take McCain more seriously instead less seriously... and then I would feel bad again. Rinse, lather, repeat.
max
['The word for the day is 'clown show'.']
It does have a whif of gimmickry to it, but hell, everything down to the color of the candidate's tie is focus-grouped and poll tested. The bottom line is that Paulson screwed up by asking for a mile, rather than the inches (or yards) he needed. There was no way congress was going to approve $700 billion, no strings, no oversight, no review, no punishment for the parties involved. Any plan that boiled down to "Trust Us" from this administration was DOA on the hill, hence the delay. The delay could very well prove to be a catastrophe.
"Why should we assume that his showing up now will constructively help the process?"
A presidential candidate, R or D, less than 2 months from an election, weilds a very big stick on The Hill. Obama no less than McCain. I don't think that McCain or Obama are economic wizards by any means (I don't think that there are any economic wizards that have a magic wand to get us out of this mess), but this is rapidly escalating to be the #1 item on the next President's agenda, and will have a huge gravitational pull on any other issue that could be debated (how many of you think that either candidate's tax or spending plans are going to survive this?).
I'm with Jesse Walker:
http://www.reason.com/blog/show/129010.html
"The Shorter John McCain
Jesse Walker | September 24, 2008, 3:25pm
I'd rather debate pressing issues behind closed doors with my colleagues than on national TV where voters might see me."
By the way, I'm generally a big fan of William Gross, but I can't understand why he's so sanguine.
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2008/09/23/AR2008092302322.html?hpid=opinionsbox1
Hugo Estrada: "Not to be rude, but this is a publicity stunt of McCain. It may work; it may not. McCain can't really do anything in that kind of a meeting; neither can Obama. If anything, it makes it look like McCain is trying to dodge the debate. :)"
Hugo, I appreciate your cynicism ... but right now it looks like the Paulson proposal is dead in Congress. The markets are rattled. If large and small banks stop lending money because they hold too many zero-value mortgage-backed securities (which they can't sell) ... then it honestly won't matter to a lot of folks who wins the election ... because then we're looking at a major recession if not a genuine depression. That means a lot of people in this country that will be hurting in a very bad way.
Unlike Obama, McCain actually has a track record of significant legislative accomplishments in the Senate ... and it is one of working with Democrats and Republicans to work through major and contentious problems and come up with solutions that at least the "moderate middle" can agree upon (ask Ted Kennedy, Russ Feingold and Joe Lieberman if you don't believe me). This has made McCain severely unpopular with large parts of the GOP establishment. This is not the first time that McCain has put politics aside for what he thought was right for the country ... and I think this is another example of that.
The election is not for another six weeks, and they'll be time in October for debates, etc. Right now, these Senators (including Obama and McCain) need to get back to Washington and cut the posturing for a week and sit down and deal with this problem ... and do it NOW. After that, they can all go back campaigning.
This fellow says it best about McCain: http://www.theglobeandmail.com/servlet/story/RTGAM.20080923.wcoibbi24/BNStory/International
McCain is partly to blame for what we are going through right now. Just because he's the first (and loudest) to cry about the mess he made and rally the masses to help him clean it, doesn't exonerate him as part of the mess to begin with.
Do you carping combox clowns understand what is at stake?
If an agreement isn't worked out by the end of the week (or at least Sunday night), the markets will probably crash on Monday. Banks will be in a fullblown panic.
Democrats and Republicans are understandably balking at supporting the bailout measure. It will make them wildly unpopular.
Bush is a discredited lame duck.
What would a real leader do in this situation?
Obama and McCain should be in the West Wing of the White House right now working out a bipartisan executive strategy with Bush.
Dear Rod, you've gone 'round the bend. You're so desperate to have good news for your party you have lost touch with reality.
One candidate saw crisis, blinked and said "I can't handle this." The other said "I am handling this."
Just making sure I'm clear on McCain's position:
1) Democrats and Republicans need to work together, so let's bring Democrat and Republican who are fighting day and night into the same room because they'll be good at bringing the country together. Never mind that they haven't been involved in the negotiations to this point.
2) Last week the fundamentals of the economy were great, but this week we need to stop everything and work on a plan.
3) Running for office is too big a distraction from focusing on the real issues troubling our country. I guess McCain is announcing he definitely WON'T be running for a 2nd term, because how on earth could make major decisions as President AND campaign?
4) He's going straight to Washington, after attending the Clinton Global Initiative. Because, you know, that's really more important.
5) I'm glad that McCain's campaign is able to launch a new web video titled "Where is Obama?" the day McCain decides that he wants to work with Obama.
We have "jumped the shark" for tv show going to ridiculous. "Nuked the fridge" for movies. What do we come up with for political campaigns?
Neil
wow, rod
it will be nice for mccain to show up at the senate
wapo reports (http://projects.washingtonpost.com/congress/110/senate/vote-missers/)
Of all Senators, John McCain has been the most absent. There have been 643 votes taken in the current Senate session: McCain has missed 412 of them. McCain has not voted in the Senate since April 8th. Since March, he has missed 109 of the last 110 votes.
He missed votes on the GI Bill, energy policy, and in 2007 he missed "all 15 critical environmental votes in the Senate" -- giving him a 2007 rating of 0% from the League of Conservation Voters."
Actually, Obama called McCain FIRST to try to act in a bipartisan statement, and Obama has been part of the negotiations from the beginning. He also said that he is willing to come to Congress if needed, but the truth is that it is NOT THE DEMOCRATS holding up passage. It is conservative Republicans refusing to back the package, so if McCain needs to go to Washington to rally his party then more power to him. Both candidates need to be there for the vote, but the last thing this country needs is for the candidates to hide from the American people by shutting down their campaigns and canceling the debate. (which I might add is at 9:00 on Friday night) If McCain can't multitask, I think it says something about his ability to be President because there will be MANY occasions when he will have more than one important issue occuring at the same time. With McCain plummetting in the polls, I guess no one will fault him for a Hail Mary pass, but I guarantee the campaign had a PLAN to criticize Obama and use this to McCain's advantage regardless of what Obama did. If Obama said yes, McCain would have ignored the fact Obama called him first and pronounced he was the leader and Obama the follower. If he said no, McCain would jump on it and accuse him of putting politics over country first.
Pyrrho: What would a real leader do in this situation?
You're assuming we have one....
the markets will probably crash on Monday. Banks will be in a fullblown panic.
Spoken like a man who has unprotected positions at risk.
Banks are going to fail regardless! Lets not piss away 1.8 trillion that we won't have access to later if its used foolishly now. This business/financial model is irrevocably damaged, its not coming back! Lets not destroy any hope of recovery after the crash.
Are you kidding?
Do you honestly believe that the injection of two men who are actively competing for the presidency will somehow help resolve anything? And that McCain and Obama's input is so vital that they have to drop everything and pitch in?
If McCain were really interested in coming up with a depoliticized response to the crisis, he would have worked with Obama in private to produce a joint response.
Instead, he decided to attempt to suspend the presidential campaign in order to add two highly politicized actors into an incredibly unstable situation that we [b]cannot[/b] allow to become any more politicized.
The best possible outcome is that two additional Senators with no particular economic expertise (in McCain's case, by his own admission) can work on a solution to the crisis.
The worst possible outcome is that the injection of two presidential candidates into the process of crafting a response to the crisis polarizes the issue. That would be disaster. And even if Obama takes the next step towards it, it would still be McCain's fault for hauling himself and Obama into the process in the first place.
What an act of desperation and political grandstanding by McCain! With every unpredictable, impulsive action he takes, McCain digs the hole deeper. As if the Senate can't get along without McCain and Obama to resolve this crisis. This looks like McCain is afraid to face Obama in the Friday night debate.
I can't believe I ever considered voting for McCain. He's really losing it.
Short and Sweet attack from the right as usual. Only you are ignoring much in regards to the timing from McCain and his past 'distraction' politics.
Obama also brought up a good point...that Presidents need to be able to deal with more than one thing at a time...he believes they can do both...you know...multi-tasking! :)
Obama has stated he will be there and jump to do whatever it is that Washington thinks he can to help with the ‘crisis’...but he also believes that right now is PRECISELY the time that we need to hear from both of these potential Presidents in terms of what they really stand for and what they really plan to do.
Maybe McCain needs to take a crash course in technology so he can too multi-task and focus on more than one thing at a time? ;)
We have "jumped the shark" for tv show going to ridiculous. "Nuked the fridge" for movies. What do we come up with for political campaigns?
"Rode in the tank"? (a la Dukakis in 1988)
Whatever else we may think about Sen. McCain's actions, and regardless of what ulterior motives he may have (and he does have them, I assure you), let us give the man credit for stepping up to the plate and doing his job when the stuff hits the fan.
It's a matter of priorities. Sure, both these Monkeys want to be President. Both of them are so steeped and/or marinated in ambition that casual passers-by can smell it unaided. Both of them have put in considerable amounts of time and energy and money on getting the job. There does, however, come a time when one just has to tell oneself what is important at that time, kick distractions in the face and get on with work.
Neither of these Monkeys has been elected President, yet. They ARE, however, right now, US Senators. They have jobs they already occupy and presumably have to do. In a sense, McCain is taking care of his "base"--the people of Arizona---by doing the job he presently has, and at least making the effort to do so in a competent manner.
I'm not going to vote for McCain, not under any circumstances. But I can recognize and give credit for the fact that, at THIS MOMENT, he is choosing to do his job. There's something to be said for that.
Your servant,
Lord Karth
I wonder if he'll come back from "suspending" his campaign.
I gotta say as someone who has been accused (unfairly) of being a partisan operative in the past for Republicans on this blog by some commenters: This has all the hallmarks of a publicity stunt by the McCain campaign. It doesn't pass the smell test with me. And if I -- a McCain-Palin supporter -- can see through it with disdain, how are the Independents and swing voters going to react to it?
The public is no mood for stunts this week. We're talking about adding, at a minimum, $700 million to our national debt. We're talking about, at a minimum, a recession.
The media has not been fair to McCain-Palin throughout the entire campaign, but when is the MSM ever going to be fair to conservatives? McCain's advisers need to play tight and smart. This stunt is neither.
Rod, you've hit a new high in suckerdom if you intended for this post to be taken seriously. This is Tanya stopping to tie her shoelace.
Tumarion: Touché
Fish: I exited my positions long ago. Do you really want to see banks and other financial institutions fall like dominoes across the world? It would take years to reboot the financial system. In the meantime, the economy would wither and die. You're right that most of them are goners anyway. But we need time to get a backup system in place.
Denial ain't just a river in Egypt. It runs pretty deep in this country.
Er. no Rod. I'm with Andrew Sullivan on this one : he's been absent without leave from the Senate for most of the past year
andrewsullivan.theatlantic.com/the_daily_dish/2008/09/the-senator-che.html (add http://)
He's had his chance to "act," now I want to see some clearheadedness not more "vehemence over coherence" (as George Will characterized his poor performance these last few days) he should be putting pen to paper to distill his philosophy for leading our country out of the Bush trainwreck and then proving its worth in debate with an opponent.
Instead he's practicing for a Halloween "trick or treat" contest by dressing up as a ghoulish reincarnation of Reagan riding across the high chapparal to save us from the hoodlums in Washington and Wall Street. Less histrionics, more hard facts please.
Do you carping combox clowns understand what is at stake?
Yes, do you?
Because of you did, you wouldn't want McCain around for a photo op interrupting the hard work. McCain knows nothing about the economy or the markets beyond what his advisors--failed CEOs given huge golden parachutes, UBS executives who think Americans whine too much, and Fannie Mae lobbysist--tell him. He's going to just be in the way and this is one of the greatest grandstanding, political acts I've ever seen.
And Phyrro and Rod have bought it hook-line-and-sinker.
Here's a senator who's still at work up on the Hill, Ron Paul on Fox:
http://www.campaignforliberty.com/blog/?p=598
McCain is like a pinball bouncing wildly from one corner of the machine to the other.
Pyrrho,
But we need time to get a backup system in place.
Yes certainly lets have it run by the same thieves ruining the existing one.
This economy is done and you know it! 100 trillion dollars of current and future obligations that can't possibly be satisfied.
Kill it now and we may be able to rebuild it! Let it descend into complete corporatism and voila we go down the same hole that the former Soviet Union was flushed into with a far less hardy populace.
P.S. What is your proposal for rescuing FDIC when it cracks if Paulson gets his claws into the 1.8T currently in play!
Rod, you can't really believe this can you? As others have said, if Obama had proposed this, the trusty rightwing bloggers would be blasting him for opportunism and gimmickry. Let the campaigning and debate proceed. If McCain can't do 2 things at once, it's time to retire.
So the entire weight of the administration and congress can't come up with a solution without John McCain's presence? And apparently the Senate will be sitting so late Friday night he can't come to a debate? Sorry, but I think this is one of the silliest pieces I've ever seen on Beliefnet. In retrospect, McCain's "actions" over the last three days seem more like "panic" than thoughtful response; and his current grandstanding just looks like more of the same.
Ummm, I meant to write "$700 billion" in the above post. That must have been a wishful reduction on my part. If only it was $700 million.
So, all you socialists out there, riddle me this - what institution backed Freddie Mac and Fannie Mae?
Why do put faith in proven failures?
24.09.2008
Quote of the Day
Says a Democratic strategist: "If you were wondering how bad McCain's pollster was telling him things are, there's your confirmation."
--Michael Crowley
http://blogs.tnr.com/tnr/blogs/the_stump/archive/2008/09/24/quote-of-the-day-sept-24.aspx
Harry Reid said either last night or this morning (I heard it on the morning news) that the Democrats would not agree to anything unless John McCain had signed off on it, because they didn't want a deal to be used against them by McCain on the campaign trail. I think Harry Reid is absolutely right (in the sense of intelligent and savvy) to insist on that condition -- and if Mitch McConnell is not insisting on the same condition re: Obama, he's a moron. This deal is so important that both Obama and McCain should be in the room when it's being hashed out. I very much want to see McCain and Obama debate economics, but what's happening in Washington this week is more important.
I don't expect either Obama or McCain to be leading these discussions. But I want them in the room. One of these men is going to own this solution come January.
First: earlier today Rod had a post: where is Sarah? Even if neither her nor McCain open their mouthes before the election, Rod and many others are going to vote for them. Faith over competence.
Second: We are so lucky McCain is on the case.
John McCain hates to prepare for anything....he's intellectually lazy and given to impetuous actions.......he's rather DO something, even if it's reckless, than do the normal thing.
I think this is a crass stunt...........he'll show up for the debate, get his butt kicked and say he was unprepared because he was doing the people's business in DC.
Besides, McCain's NOT a leader in Congress, even in his own party. He may be hoping he can take credit for something. People have watched as he made one stupid remark and/or suggestion after another over the last ten days. Did he just ffigure out something was happening in DC. Yesterday he was having photo opps about solar energy.
The truth is this is a phoney crisis: none of it is a surprise and the Administration has been preparing its "plan" (bloodless takeover of the financial system) for at least 6 months. Any distraction is good enough for these folks.
I'm waiting for Rod to chastise us for missing his obvious satire.
Isn't this interesting? Exactly how Bush would have handled these matters. Sudden, impulsive, last minute decisions. Like the hastily selection of Palin (who, by the way, was selected to elect the unelectible) and now the sudden cancellation of his SCHEDULED PRESIDENTIAL DEBATE (as America has been waiting for the very first one from him & Palin) But, no, he has to rush to the financial meetings...even though he publicly admitted he knows nothing about the economy. Suddenly his attendance is mandated. America, be afraid of this candidate!!! BE VERY AFRAID!!! Republicans have bankrupt our country! How much clearer does it have to get!! McCain does not belong in the White House. McCain does not belong in the Senate. McCain is not fit to be our President.
Excerpted from LeMetropolecafe.com
An indication of fraud before the bill is even signed!
There was a tense moment during the House Banking Committee testimony when a senator asked about the 62 T$ CDS derivative market and that failed institutions have been revealed to have had massive exposure to it. She asked if Paulson intended to buy any CDS derivatives in the RTC fund. Paulson visibly froze. Chris Cox quickly jumped in and said it was a huge market and it needed regulating and is "ripe for fraud and manipulation" but it was far too much of a complex problem to tackle with the current bail-out bill but needed to be addressed! Bernanke then babbled on about how Tim Geitner of the NY Fed had been leading an initiative on this issue and was making good progress! It was like watching Ice Hockey players avoid the body-check. They got away with it because everyone was focused on the 700B$ problem and completely missed the 62 Trillion dollar elephant sitting in the room (good job no one mentioned the 1200 trillion dollar global derivative market elephant!). The other senators probably thought that they said "trillion" when they really meant to say "billion"!
I knew you were from Louisiana, but this is just insane.
Help is on the way:
Politico via AS:
"The McCain campaign's new urgency about the financial crisis didn't entirely clear his schedule this morning. My colleague Amie Parnes reports that he made it to his scheduled morning meeting with Lady Lynn de Rothschild, a Clinton backer who recently came out in support of him."
I also do not like those elitists.
Watch Letterman and you'll see where McCain really was today. Or read Ben Smith's blog. Let's just say the economy wasn't the first thing on his mind.
Rod, you've got this one exactly backwards. Here's Ezra Klein just recently:
"Both candidates made an effort to transcend the campaign today. At 8am this morning, Barack Obama called John McCain and asked that the two collaborate on a statement on the bailout. The call was not announced to the press. At 2:30pm, McCain called back and accepted. The initiative made sense: Without some unity from the two campaigns, some linkage of their fortunes, the two parties would be too paralyzed attempting to ratfuck each other to actually pass a bailout proposal. The statement, meant to remove the interests of the two presidential candidates, is forthcoming."
"Later in the day, John McCain surprised the Obama campaign by going before the press and announcing a cessation of the campaign and a delay in the debate. There was no effort to plan a coordinated action with the other camp. Rather, he publicly demanded that Barack Obama follow suit. McCain promised that he would return to Washington to work on the bill. The drama of the negotiations will now be combined with the drama of the presidential campaign. The leadership structure of the Senate Republicans is suddenly unclear. No one quite knows what effect the presence of two presidential candidates -- and their attendant political incentives, media strategies, and advisers -- will have on the process."
Obama is the prudent and responsible one here. There is nothing substantive the candidates can do to help fix this thing, other than casting their respective votes in the Senate with all the others. The biggest thing either could do to help is remove presidential politics from the process, which is precisely what their morning agreement and joint statement would have done. Now, McCain's return to Washington will completely undermine that. It's a PR stunt from top to bottom.
Surprise, surprise
http://politicalticker.blogs.cnn.com/2008/09/24/mccain-camp-to-propose-postponing-vp-debate/
September 24, 2008
McCain camp to propose postponing VP debate
Best comment I heard on this: "Let them do what real women do every day and multi-task. Surely the 90 minutes it takes to have a debate won't mean the difference between achieving and not achieving anything."
And from another source: "The last thing we need is for presidential candidates to muck up negotiations in DC, their flexibility is necessarily limited."
That said, it's a sight better than having a president who fails to cut short his vacation when warned of impending crisis.
Clare,
Your beloved nut case (Ron Paul) is merely a representative, not a senator.
This is just an excuse to "suspend" the election period and leave George W. in to fill that vacuum just a wee bit longer, no?
The comments indicate that many people have already made up their minds. They see what they want to see in McCain's actions and Obama's actions. For them and for many people, a debate is superfluous at this point as well as at any time between now and November 4.
The race has been characterized as one between a "doer" and a "talker." Well, the "doer" is wanting to do something in Washington, and the "talker" is wanting to have a talk on TV. In view of this, McCain made the wiser move, because actions speak louder than words. Should some success come out of whatever happens in Washington over the next few days, McCain will be able to air better campaign ads as a result (e.g., "The country needed immediate help, and John McCain responded."). I don't see much downside to what McCain did or said he wants to do.
Rod, I love that you speak your mind and go with your gut on this blog...it makes for very interesting, entertaining reading.
Unfortunately, I think you're gonna wish you could have a do-over on this post. You are seriously, seriously getting played by McCain.
Postponing the VP Debate... What a surprise.
Jeez. This is getting more and more pathetic.
First McCain wants to suspend the debate and then he gets congress to suspend the election because it would "take the country's focus away from the problems at hand". Tom Clancy where are you?
Actually, Obama called McCain FIRST to try to act in a bipartisan statement, and Obama has been part of the negotiations from the beginning.
That's what Keith Olbermann says tonight on the Late Show when he fills in for McCain.
Aside: By what is the possibly the craziest coincidence ever, I'm in New York right now for a work thingy, and someone else got me tickets for tonight's taping, so I went even though I'm not a huge Letterman fan. I didn't know who the guest was, and was unsure how to react when I learned it was McCain. But I'm glad, because I managed to see McCain's last minute cancellation in real time. Secret Service roaming around at 2, no McCain at 4:30. (As evidence I was there, the top ten tonight is 'Top ten questions to ask McCain'.)
And, as Letterman points out, McCain didn't go to Washington. He taped a piece with CBS news.
And only in imaginary world does putting every Senator to work on a bill make bills get written faster, especially as most of them aren't written by Senators at all. The idea that John McCain has some magical talent that will fix everything, and thus is desperately needed in Washington, is just silliness.
Eric -
The downside:
1. Most people will see it as a political stunt.
2. By asking to postpone the debate for President, McCain seems to be afraid of and/or ducking Obama.
3. By proposing that the VP debate be postponed, McCain seems to be admitting that Palin won't be ready to be debate.
4. By insisting he has to be in Washington, it underscores how many votes he's missed - ALL of them since April 8th (108).
5. By injecting himself into what are ongoing negotiations, he runs the risk of seeming like an opportunist - and that seems to be the initial response.
Unfortunately, I think you're gonna wish you could have a do-over on this post. You are seriously, seriously getting played by McCain.
Exactly right. Rod's just looking for wayto justify voting for his beloved Palin. PA-thetic.
All McCain did was say that he will suspend his campaign tomorrow. Sounds like talk to me. That in itself will not do one bit in helping with the crisis. If he were serious, he'd be back to DC already.
Come on! This is so transparently a stunt.
Obama and McCain are Senators and should be there to protect the interests of the people who elected them. Whether this is a true once in a generation emergency or a $700 billion fraud, I still want every damn one of them there. Every one of them should be asking questions and getting answers that make sense. This is especially true of McCain and Obama, since one of them will be president and have to deal with what is done here for at least four years.
Also, if Obama "suggested it first" why has he changed his mind? There are 40 more days to have debates. People act like someone just canceled their favorite soap opera.
These comments are so pathetic. And it's a shame that the comboxes on this excellent blog been invaded lately by so many trolls whose usernames have never appeared here before and who slavishly regurgitate the Obama talking points of the day (My personal favorite: "The Gramm-Leach-Bliley Act is the cause of this financial crisis."). Folks: Go back home to Open Left and Daily Kos and the other cyber-asylums you were sent from.
Just imagine if this were the other way around, and Obama had decided to go to back to work for a weekend in the midst of the country's greatest legislative challenge in decades. These same trolls would be praising his post-partisanship and courage.
Yesterday Harry Reid declared that no bill would pass unless John McCain showed up in person to vote for it. Today Reid is feigning outrage that McCain has decided to spend the weekend working for a bill he and others can vote for. Clown.
I keep hearing that "everyone" will see this as a political stunt. I think this is more of the typical blue state/red state worldview divide.
I live in redneck central, in a state so red that no one bothers to campaign here. I can assure you that everyone is talking about how great it is to see someone who understands that it is more important to DO something than to talk about doing something. Actions speak louder than words, here, and from my neck of the woods, Obama is saying that he only cares about winning the election, and not about the real issues.
Disagree if you want, but don't be surprised to find that a significant amount of the population, you know, the ones who see comfort in guns and religion, feel that McCain made a brilliant political decision.
"Exactly right. Rod's just looking for wayto justify voting for his beloved Palin. PA-thetic."
My sentiments exactly. McCain is getting buried by his lack of experience/interest of economic issues. This is his way to cope with it. It is also a good excuse not to debate on Friday night. Action vs. Talk? Give me a break! This also about campaign politics by someone who's desperate.
Your beloved nut case (Ron Paul) is merely a representative, not a senator.
True enough. But he's the only elected official out of the 535 empty suits who understands the problem and isn't being played the fool by Paulson!
"Also, if Obama "suggested it first" why has he changed his mind?"
What he reportedly proposed was a joint statement from the two campaigns. Which makes sense, regardless of what you want that response to be.
So are the fundamentals of our economy strong, or do we need to drop everything, cancel everything, and postpone everything so we can act RIGHT NOW?
McCain's a boob.
Its time to put the ball back in the media's court to quiz the candidates on their comprehension of the way the division of powers ought function - oversight of Treasury (and in turn, Tr.Sec.'s oversight of the Fed) is Congress's job not the President's:
Don Rich posted Sep 24 at Mises.org.I agree with Rod. I'm glad McCain seems to be rolling up his sleeves and working on a solution. McCain seems essential to whatever plan is eventually passed. I think it's interesting that the Congressional leadership don't seem to care whether or not Obama is there in DC. Is it because the Dem. leadership doesn't feel Obama's input is useful or critical? To me, it's weird that Obama is NOT back in D.C. Or does he not understand that the financial crisis is more urgent a matter than campaigning? We don't have 40 days to wait for a new president to be elected to choose what to do on this issue. The timing is unfortunate, but I think McCain made the right call.
McCain's a boob.
Now, just don't say that about Palin!
McCain's a boob.
And Obama's an idiot.
There. I feel better.
I can't believe you're falling for this one, Rod. McCain "doing the hard work to fix the economy"???? What a laugh. He's the one who championed the deregulation that got us here, bub. Fleeing to D.C. and "suspending" campaigning is another Hail Mary move like the Palin pick; this one was borne of desperation after seeing Obama shoot ahead in the polls today as people have realized it was the GOP that enabled the entire market fiasco. McCain's cynical creeps (i.e., campaign staff) said, gee, what can we do to interrupt Obama's momentum, ASAP? Hey, I know, let's have McCain do a Superman and fly off to D.C. to look like he's "doing" something! And, oh yeah, that would mean conveniently postponing that pesky debate coming up on Friday. Hilarious! Looks like the adulterer with the 13 cars and 8 houses is running scared, big time.
Come on, Rod. You're smarter than that.
This is grandstanding on McCain's part, although apparently "the base" is believing it.
My understanding of debate rules is that when someone doesn't show up, that counts as a forfeit.
I thought I was cynical. Yes, for many on this blog even John McCain going to the bathroom is a calculated political move. I never knew there were so many McCain-haters who are actually even at this moment reading the senator's mind, faithfully relaying to us his every tactical thought in the campaign. We are so fortunate to have so many people who can see directly inside the mind of another human being !!!
It can't possibly be that Mr. McCain would like to fulfill his job responsibilities, during a time when some important issues are at stake. And the simple comment made by McCain that the economy wasn't his strength, or that he needed to learn more, has morphed into the headline that McCain knows nothing about the economy, so why should he even go to Washington? Because it is his job and it is what us taxpayers pay him and Obama to do.
This is too logical for the hate-filled bloggers on this site. And worse, it might cast John McCain in a positive light.
Isn't anyone concerned about the months and months both candidates have spent campaigning instead of working? What would happen if you skipped out on work every day to go look for another job?
What's with the sudden infusion of Obamatrolls?
Do you get a sub-prime mortgage from Penny Pritzker if you post on Rod's site?
Or did Michelle say she wouldn't be proud of you unless you did?
Me thinks that Rod lost this Blog 99to 1 !!!!!!!
ObamaTrolls? Really? Name them.
Better that the candidates send their economic advisers to Washington D.C. instead...
You don't need to name ObamaTrolls, just look for any one of the following posts:
"McCain even said himself he doesn't know anything about economics"
"McCain just wants to continue the policies of Bush"
"McCain wants to give tax breaks to big oil so his friends can get rich"
"McCain wants a 100 year war in Iraq"
"McCain voted 90% with Bush, and we can't have 4 more years of that"
"McCain is a warmonger who wants to keep us in Iraq for 100 years"
"McCain is going to let lobbyists run his White House"
"McCain thinks the economy is just fine"
"John McCain and the Republicans caused the banking crisis with their deregulation policies"
Chowda,
You, yourself, and you ... for starters.
"McCain even said himself he doesn't know anything about economics"
Looking like a doddering old man during the debates and waving around "The Age of Turbulence" did nothing to make this statement false. This is a legitimate issue so its open to debate.
"McCain just wants to continue the policies of Bush"
That seems to be the direction in which he's headed. But if I'm wrong please enlighten me.
"McCain wants to give tax breaks to big oil so his friends can get rich"
Most of his friends are already "rich".
"McCain wants a 100 year war in Iraq"
Not exactly. He did say that a U.S. presence in Iraq might be necessary for 100 years. (Still pretty stupid if you ask me)
"McCain voted 90% with Bush, and we can't have 4 more years of that"
Again a legitimate issue certainly legitimate as a decision for a voter. History shant be kind to Bush.
"McCain is a warmonger who wants to keep us in Iraq for 100 years"
See above.
"McCain is going to let lobbyists run his White House"
That would certainly fit the pattern of the past 30 years. To be fair though I'm sure that Obama won't be any different.
"McCain thinks the economy is just fine"
Not after this week.
"John McCain and the Republicans caused the banking crisis with their deregulation policies"
The events leading up to this week had their inception 80 plus years ago! Both parties share equally in the blame!
Essentially your argument boils down to; "I like John McCain so you better not say anything bad about him."
Leave Brittany Spears alone.........
Fish -
"Yes certainly lets have it run by the same thieves ruining the existing one."
We'll deal with the thieves later.
"This economy is done and you know it!"
I do know it. We have a choice between a controlled crash and an out-of-control crash.
"Kill it now and we may be able to rebuild it!"
Unwind it as slowly as possible. Kill in now and we take everything down with it.
"P.S. What is your proposal for rescuing FDIC when it cracks if Paulson gets his claws into the 1.8T currently in play!"
I outlined my plan the other day.
[1] Buy time to make sure essential institutions can stay afloat.
[2] Flush the toilet.
[3] Refill the toilet. (Defaults, Limited Monetization*)
[*Credit Destruction > Monetization = No Hyperinflation]
We need to complete [1] first. It's critical.
Look, I've been warning about this problem for years. The time to fix this problem the right way has long since passed. But the world is full of trivial people who mistake ideological slogans for knowledge and defend themselves against substantive challenges with ad hominem attacks. You just can't get through to these people.
(I'm not talking about you, Fish.)
thanks but no thanks for Mcsame's pretentious grandstanding.
Pyrrho,
Let me just say that I appreciate the tone of your argument. I disagree, but I can't say with any certainty that my "solutions" are any more valid than yours. In truth mine would be significantly more painful.
Point by point:
The thieves won't be punished. The ability to wield as much influence as those committing this crime influence virtually assures this.
An "out of control" crash requires an unpleasant reboot. A controlled crash prevents any "fix"....the authoritarian business model continues apace.
"[*Credit Destruction > Monetization = No Hyperinflation]"
Perhaps. But [*Credit Destruction > Monetization + politics + cronyism + ongoing govt.entitlements]^Blatant Stupidity = Police State Command Economy + Severe Inflation + Years of Pain!
Who determines "essential"? Who gets kicked out of Paulsons lifeboat?
"McCain voted 90% with Bush, and we can't have 4 more years of that"
Bush votes in the Senate? Since when?
Rod, I know from having read your book that you are a really thoughtful and decent guy, but jeez Louise. I think your response to McCain's decision to "suspend" his campaign is really, really naive. Just because you might not be cynical doesn't mean politicians--and political campaigns-- aren't. Senator McCain's not wanting to take part in the debate--aired for all who want to see--should make all Americans question how interested McCain is in governmental transparency. And a lack of transparency and oversight is what got us into this mess.
Remember: The debate is on a Friday night at 9pm. A Friday night at 9pm. And McCain (and Obama) both have access to jets that can whisk them down to Oxford in a couple of hours, and back up to DC in the morning--or hell, that night--if need be.
Fish,
It's getting late here in the East, so we'll have to continue this another time.
A brief response before I retire:
(1) The thieves are going to get sued.
(2) By out-of-control crash, I mean the plane hitting the ground nose first. No survivors.
(3) Hyperinflation is just not going to happen in this situation. I have never seen an argument that makes sense economically or politically. It's the equivalent of using nuclear weapons: it would end up destroying everything.
(4) I never said the "essential" designation did not involve "political considerations".
Wow, what a thread. I take one day away from the PC for a staff meeting, and look what happens.
Just to associate myself with one of the many great comments here:
"First McCain wants to suspend the debate and then he gets congress to suspend the election because it would "take the country's focus away from the problems at hand". Tom Clancy where are you?" (Leslie)
Could any of have expected the ride we've been on since the Palin selection? Is it really outside the realm of possibility for someone to propose postponing the election at this point?
Bless,
Doug
"Just imagine if this were the other way around, and Obama had decided to go to back to work for a weekend in the midst of the country's greatest legislative challenge in decades. These same trolls would be praising his post-partisanship and courage."
No, Simon...it would still be a bullshit maneuver. The only difference is that you would see it for what it really is if Obama did it.
McCain is saying he cannot focus on two problems at the same time. Let us pray that if he gets elected all of the crises during his administration decide to come via serial rather than parallel transit. God help us if we get two problems going at once.
A real leader would be able to take time off from campaigning, participate in the Senate discussions and vote, and still look good for the debate on Friday. It's called multi-tasking, and many business leaders (and all mothers) do it every day of their lives.
McCain wants to fill the most powerful leadership position in the world, and he can't walk and chew gum at the same time.
Dear God above, save us from concrete-sequential thinkers.
Remember: The debate is on a Friday night at 9pm. A Friday night at 9pm. And McCain (and Obama) both have access to jets that can whisk them down to Oxford in a couple of hours, and back up to DC in the morning--or hell, that night--if need be.
------------
Heck, Sarah Palin made a 10 hour flight after her water broke. Surely McCain could make a 2 hour flight after getting his keister kicked in a debate.
Honestly Rod, at this point you should rename the blog "Crunchy Gets Conned...again!"
McCain hasn't voted in 5 months, the second worst voting record this year in the Senate next to Tim Johnson who suffered an anurism, now suddenly it's all-important for McCain to broker a deal on a subject he admits he knows little about, and for which he sits on no related committees? STUNT, is too kind a word for this cynicism.
"versus a man who is actually on Capitol Hill right now doing the hard work to actually fix the economy."?
Wasn't this about the time that Senator McCain was being interviewed on CBS? After lying to Dave Letterman on why he couldn't be on his show? Apparently Dave was watching the feed on his own network while taping his show, where John-boy was supposed to be.
Do you really think that an economic illiterate will bring ANYTHING to the negotiations, which have gone well, reportedly, even when based on the "give me all your money or I'll destroy the world" threat from the President's finance-men?
"ObamaTrolls? Really? Name them."
Abso-f**cking-lutely. I've been posting here almost daily for well over a year. I know the names and the regulars, some of them personally. Whence all these pro-Obama newcomers who suddenly materialize, as if by magic, on a site where -- surprise! -- they've never posted before. This is akin to one of those events on Amazon.com when some goofy Leftist book is published and 347 positive reviews of it appear overnight, many of them having the same verbiage.
Rod, I suggest you close this thread.
Rob G - maybe some of us read this daily but we don't post often because of responses just like yours. If people don't agree with what you say you call people "pro-Obama wackjob commie arseholes" and worse. That's right Rod close this post because people like RobG have different/logical opinions who don't call people names..........
No one is saying you have to post daily. But it's a bit...odd...that out of the blue appear a dozen hardcore Obama supporters who just happen to show up all at the same time!
Sorry, but this is the equivalent of calling the talk shows and clogging the lines. One Obama pod-person sees this, emails another, and next thing you know, a whole crapload of them show up to foul up the works of discourse.
Rob, so what? Everyone/Anyone is allowed to come here & post whatever they want. I am sorry if you just can't take it.
Rob, this was an obvious political stunt on McCain's part. If you can't see this, then, frankly, you are naive.
Ah, so you admit it.
Oh, I can take it, if it's legit. But this isn't. So why bother? Trolls are still trolls, even when they arrive en masse.
Rob, so what? Everyone/Anyone is allowed to come here & post whatever they want. I am sorry if you just can't take it.
That's not true.
"Rob, this was an obvious political stunt on McCain's part. If you can't see this, then, frankly, you are naive."
I'm no McCain fan, so I don't have much of an investment (politically at least) in this either way. But I will say that if it was a mere stunt, it was an incredibly risky one, and thus I'm inclined to give him the benefit of the doubt here. I could be wrong, but if I am, so what?
Letterman was hilarious last night, and he was really dead on.
Why couldn't Palin be out campaigning while McCain came to Washington, where he is actually not needed, except in this meeting with President Bush today? Does the McCain campaign trust her so little as a surrogate that they can't leave her to campaign on her own for a few days?
I suspect, strongly, that the McCain campaign sees, as a side benefit of postponing this debate, the possiblity of postponing the Vice Presidential debate to give Palin more time to cram.
I voted for McCain in the primary, but there is now way that I am voting for him in November. This action by him stinks - unlike last year when he supported the surge.
A year ago, I thought, and still believe, McCain was acting on principle, but then again perhaps he also felt that he had nothing to lose. This time, I believe that this is an entirely political act of grandstanding by a man so desperate to win that he is willing to throw everything, including the kitchen sink, at Obama to see if he can sink him.
Rob, so what? Everyone/Anyone is allowed to come here & post whatever they want. I am sorry if you just can't take it.
That's not true.
--------------------------
OK...then perhaps some clarification is in order. Assuming the posts adhere to the rules (both Beliefnet's and yours), is anyone allowed to post here regardless of their political leanings, beliefs, wild theorems or ideas?
Or are there only Obama trolls here and no McCain trolls?
Bill Clinton defends and supports McCain's action:
http://blogs.abcnews.com/politicalradar/2008/09/bill-clinton-do.html
Bill Clinton: Don't 'Overly Parse' McCain Request to Delay Debate
September 25, 2008 8:26 AM
ABC News' Nitya Venkataraman Reports: Former President Bill Clinton defended Sen. John McCain's request to delay the first presidential debate, saying McCain did it in "good faith" and pushed organizers to reserve time for economy talk during the debate if the Friday plans move forward.
Appearing on Good Morning America Thursday, Clinton told ABC News' Chris Cuomo that McCain's push to postpone the debate would only be a good political move if both candidates agreed. McCain announced on Wednesday that he would "suspend" his presidential campaign to come to Washington to help negotiate a financial bailout bill.
"We know he didn't do it because he's afraid because Sen. McCain wanted more debates," Clinton said, adding that he was "encouraged" by the joint statement from McCain and Sen. Barack Obama.
"You can put it off a few days the problem is it's hard to reschedule those things," Clinton said, "I presume he did that in good faith since I know he wanted -- I remember he asked for more debates to go all around the country and so I don't think we ought to overly parse that."
If the debate moves forward as planned for Friday night, Clinton says "they should be able to talk about this some of the debate because it is a security issue."
The former president thought Bush's address Wednesday night on the economic crisis had a "positive reaction".
"I thought it was the clearest statement of why we're in the fix we're in, at least what the nature of it is and why some national action is needed," Clinton said.
He said that both Democrats and Republicans "should move as quickly as they can" on the president's economic rescue plan but that both parties "want to know exactly how this $700 billion is going to be invested..to stabilize the system."
President Bush's bipartisan meeting on the economic crisis will take place at 4pm at the White House, both Obama and McCain will be in attendance.
This is nothing but a political ploy by McCain. He has become a joke. I'm embarrassed for him.
Reaganite in NYC,
You make your point well, but I still disagree. McCain doesn't know anything about the economy, as he himself said it, and as he himself proved it last week, when he announced that the "fundamental were strong" so his contribution on this amounts to a big zero.
So this is all about McCain putting McCain first, and trying to politically exploit a crisis for which he is responsible to a large degree.
McCain "acts" is exactly right. He *acted* like he had to rush back to Washington--that's what he told Letterman when he cancelled--but instead he went across town for the Katie Couric interview. Not an honorable decision.
Oh, and to the commenter above who was looking for a political equivalent of "jumped the shark" and "nuked the fridge"--how about "field-dressed a moose"?
"Rob, so what? Everyone/Anyone is allowed to come here & post whatever they want. I am sorry if you just can't take it.
That's not true.
Posted by: Rod Dreher | September 25, 2008 9:37 AM"
Well Rod, I looked at the Code of Conduct and I did not see anywhere that only certain people are allowed to post here (and yes these people are posting comments directly relating to your post so I don't see how they are committing any problems). Is there something I am missing?
However, it does mention that Rob's comments shouldn't be tolerated. Oops, me bad most of the time he agrees with you so I guess it makes it okay:)
I agree, Hugo.
Within a week, McCain went from saying "the fundamentals of our economy are sound" to saying "We are in an emergency and will slide into another Great Depression if I don't suspend my campaign and postpone the Friday night debate."
We all have our biases, but I try and judge people honestly. Frankly, I am appalled and angry at what I see as naked political grandstanding by McCain. And, I happen to be more or less in agreement with McCain about Iraq and I also voted for him in the primary.
I also preferred Hillary to Obama. It doesn't matter now. We need a steady hand and a calm person in charge right now, and that is definitely not John McCain.
Noodle Beach,
And which ones of the statements below are not true?
"McCain even said himself he doesn't know anything about economics"
"McCain just wants to continue the policies of Bush"
"McCain wants to give tax breaks to big oil so his friends can get rich"
"McCain wants a 100 year war in Iraq"
"McCain voted 90% with Bush, and we can't have 4 more years of that"
"McCain is a warmonger who wants to keep us in Iraq for 100 years"
"McCain is going to let lobbyists run his White House"
"McCain thinks the economy is just fine"
"John McCain and the Republicans caused the banking crisis with their deregulation policies"
Good point, EricW. Why would McCain "run" from a debate when he's all along been pushing for more of them, and for 'town hall meetings' as well?
Obama ought to be glad he can postpone a Ralph Cramden moment here: "Hummana, hummana, hummana..."
Well Rod, I looked at the Code of Conduct and I did not see anywhere that only certain people are allowed to post here (and yes these people are posting comments directly relating to your post so I don't see how they are committing any problems). Is there something I am missing?
Yes, there's something you're missing. I've long made it clear that I don't allow comments here that personally insult or abuse someone else posting in these threads (it's why I edited a regular's comment this morning; this poster almost always followed the rules, but crossed the line in a comment today, so I took out his offending line). I also reserve the right to unpublish posts from people who aren't adding anything to the discussion, but are rather behaving like trolls -- people who just want to shout down the opposition. I don't care if you're a right-wing troll or a left-wing troll, if you're carrying on in an obnoxious way that would get you shown the door if you were at a party at my house, you're not going to be allowed to remain on a particular thread. If you keep doing it, you won't be allowed to post here at all. My interest is to keep this a place for robust and diverse discussion within an atmosphere of civility. If you want to rant, there are plenty of left wing and right wing sites where you can rant to your heart's content.
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