Palin's daughter gets pregnant, chooses life
Monday September 1, 2008
Categories: Culture, Republicans
Well, that's kind of a bombshell: Sarah Palin's daughter is pregnant. Guess that absolutely positively shoots down the weird pregnancy smear. Will this hurt her politically? I'm thinking not. Nor should it. Unplanned teen pregnancy is not unheard of in...
Add to Del.icio.us
Add to Technorati
Add to Digg
Add to Newsvine
Add to Facebook
Add to StumbleUpon
Advertisement
Advertisement
Search This Blog
Recent Posts
About Crunchy Con
Rod Dreher is an editorial columnist for the Dallas Morning News, and author of "Crunchy Cons" (Crown Forum), a nonfiction book about conservatives, most of them religious, whose faith and political convictions sometimes put them at odds with mainstream conservatives. The views expressed in this blog are his own.
Subscribe
Archives
Blogs Worth Reading
- Front Porch Republic
- The American Conservative
- Patrick Deneen
- Conventional Folly
- The American Scene
- First Things
- Andrew Sullivan
- The Plank
- Eunomia
- Get Religion
- Postmodern Conservative
- Alex Massie
- The Corner
- Contentions
- Sharon Astyk
- Barry Ritholtz
- The Oil Drum
- Mere Comments
- First Principles (ISI)
- Brian Kaller
No, I'm sure this will help her tremendously.
Right after she hitches up her pumpkin carriage to her team of unicorns and rides them down the rainbow highway to fairy land.
Given what Sullivan has written about this entire episode, I can't believe he is still linked here.
God bless her. And everyone else: leave her alone.
Hi Rod -
I think you're being naive if you don't think this should hurt Palin, and here's why:
She's a mother, with a 4 month old special needs child...
...AND four other children...
...AND a husband who works full time "because they need the money"...
...AND a pregnant 17 year old daughter who will need a ton of help raising her own child...
...AND she's going to campaign non-stop for 60 days then become Vice-President of the United States?
Tell me again why she's a great mother and example of family values.
Please.
Perhaps it's time for her to drop out of the race to spend more time with her family.
I talk openly about this all the time, because it makes me proud: My mother conceived me out of wedlock when she was 18. Doctors tried to convince her into having an abortion - they would make it clean and easy, they assured her, and she was far too bright and promising to ruin her life with a young pregnancy. She and my father loved each other deeply; they married. He died very young, and she was a widow with a toddler. Her life would have been "easier" for sure if she had aborted me, but far emptier, too. I suppose you can understand if I take the abortion debate somewhat personally.
Premaritial sex and unwed motherhood....you've got to love those conservative family values! Another example as to how "abstinence-only" sex education---epoused by the Republican Party---does NOT work. And, I feel its insulting that Dreher suggests that abortion is the "easy" way out; for many women that is the toughest decision of their lives. Bristol is lucky that she comes from a wealthy, influential white family....I think that makes her "hard" decision a bit easier, no?
Lauren
Leave the kids alone.
And, can she campaign for 2 months? Darn right she can.
While I'm quite sure this is not what they wanted, I don't think this is a "crisis" in their book. Not, at least, the kind of "crisis" you guys seem to keep prattling on like it should be.
I've been saying that I KNOW people like this, I've LIVED in this kind of working family situation, and there's a "take in stride" mentality and level headedness that you people do NOT understand.
As for them, it's not a crisis. You all keep moaning about why Sara would go on a plane ride to a small town to deliver her baby. Easy. To be HOME, you dunces.
It's just having a baby, and women have been doing that for quite some time now. It's not exactly a recent medical advancement. As for caring for the baby, it's something you do as part of everything else. You just do it.
Man, what indulgent lives a lot of you must lead.
Guess that absolutely positively shoots down the weird pregnancy smear.
Technically speaking, this announcement only shoots down the rumor if the announcement is true.
A dedicated conspiracy theorist could argue that the announcement is false to cover up the swap and that in a few months, possibly just before the election, we could learn the tragic news that the young lady has suffered a miscarriage.
Hey, I'm not saying that any of the above is true, I'm just saying that the use of 'absolutely positively' is not correct.
But Rod, you're missing the point -- she is being sold as a promoter of 'conservative Christian family values' -- and she failed to do that even in her own family! In my church, if she were a man (because only men can be elders), she would be disqualified from the eldership having failed to well manage his own family. So the GOP wants to put her forward to appeal to conservative Christians like me? Either cynicism or stupidity is sky-high in this situation.
Leftists think this would hurt Palin politically because they believe their own ignorant caricatures of religious conservatives as intolerant puritans who are scandalized by such things.
Clueless. If anything, the news of this young woman's pregnancy, with her decision to keep the child and marry the father, makes her more admirable in conservative eyes. By extension, that only benefits Governor Palin.
Especially since the whole fracas calls attention to exactly what a scum-infested swamp the Leftist blogosphere is, with its lies and innuendo deliberately targeting a teenager, for no reason other than the fact that her mother potentially stands in the way of the Lightworker's election and all the Important Public Policy Achievements that would mean.
Oh, and have I mentioned that Andrew Sullivan is scum, scum, scum?
"As for caring for the baby, it's something you do as part of everything else. You just do it.
Man, what indulgent lives a lot of you must lead. "
Palin's youngest child is not just a baby, it's a baby with Downs Syndrome.
And that is a whole 'nother ball game. I have a severely autistic sister, and
I know the demands such a child can place on a family.
My mother cared for my sister for Mother's entire life, for the 46 years that
she lived after my sister was born - not exactly an indulgent life, is it? - and I know what she would say about the needs of such a child, and about Palin's choice to campaign for VP with such an infant in the family.
Mother was the strongest person I have ever known, fully as brave and as strong as any soldier in combat, or firefighter running into a burning building, and
her ordeal lasted much longer.
This gets better and better. Yet another decisive blow in favor of life, and yet another wonderful example of the way ordinary pro-lifers welcome life!
The pro-aborts are apoplectic -- how DARE those Palin women give birth! How DARE Sarah Palin allow the Downs Syndrome baby to live! How DARE her teenage daughter eschew a quiet abortion!
I am loving this. Like a lightning bolt at midnight, it instantly reveals the fault line between those who love life, and those who disdain it.
Deo gratias for Sarah Palin and her family.
Folks, regardless of your preference for president, this is an area that best be left alone by all sides. Because if it's not, the next couple of months will be the ugliest campaign we've ever seen. Leave the kids - all of them - alone.
Its really tacky to play the "I told you so" game. But I wonder if the commenter named Houghton would be willing to revisit his remarks made in response to a comment I made under this post (Sarah Palin: GOP succumbs to diversity nonsense). I made the comment attempting to give an explanation for the bizarre rumors that had begun floating around the internet Friday night. At the time I was trying to put out what I thought was the most credible explanation I had seen for the truly weird stories circulating about Sarah Palin's youngest son. I used a phrase that I knew was an invitation for snark when I said that while I could not vouch for the accuracy of the source I quoted, it had the 'ring of truth' for me. Since then, the story I quoted has been confirmed pretty much in every detail, I wonder if Houghton is prepared to withdraw his offer to sell me a bridge?
I think that the Palin family, as private citizens, has every right to have their private lives held private. At least one of them however is not a "private" citizen. Fair or not, (and I don't think it is fair) every detail of all of their lives is now going to be front page news. If Sarah Palin did not realize this when she accepted the offer of the VP nomination, it is simply one more example of her lack of judgment and inexperience.
"As for caring for the baby, it's something you do as part of everything else. You just do it.
Man, what indulgent lives a lot of you must lead. "
Palin's youngest child is not just a baby, it's a baby with Downs Syndrome.
And that is a whole 'nother ball game. I have a severely autistic sister, and
I know the demands such a child can place on a family.
My mother cared for my sister for Mother's entire life, for the 46 years that
she lived after my sister was born - not exactly an indulgent life, was it? - and I know what she would say about the needs of such a child, and about Palin's choice to campaign for VP with such an infant in the family.
Mother was the strongest person I have ever known, fully as brave and as strong as any soldier in combat, or firefighter running into a burning building, and
her ordeal lasted much longer, an ordeal that involved staying up nights with a child who wouldn't sleep, of trying to manage my sister's tantrums and
bizarre behaviors, of cleaning up after her during the many years it took
to toilet train her. How would you like to do that, and exactly how would
you manage to preside over the Senate while doing it?
Perhaps had she spent less time pursuing politics she could have stayed home and provided proper guidance to her daughters.
She should have choose birth control and now she gets a shot gun wedding at age 17. Shameful GOP.
The Anchorage Daily News is really getting hit with hateful remarks about this news. The venom is extremely poisonous. The level of hate is beyond anything I have ever encountered. I am truly afraid for my country after seeing the display of hate out there. Pray for us!
"But Rod, you're missing the point -- she is being sold as a promoter of 'conservative Christian family values'..."
Strange, but I have not heard anyone from the McCain campaign trying to "sell" Palin on that basis. She is being promoted as a reformer who understands the middle class and knows what it means to raise a family and deal with all of the junk that Washington imposes on us.
I'm sorry that your church behaves that way - maybe you should find a different church. However in most churches, sin is an acknowledged condition, even among children, and the important thing is how we deal with sin. The Palins seem to be dealing with it in an appropriately Christian manner - not approving of the sin, but helping their daughter deal with the consequences of the sin and welcoming the coming child into a loving family.
I am already seeing posts claiming how this is evidence of "hypocrisy" on the part of the Palins. On the contrary, the hypocrisy would be if they opted for abortion for the sake of political expediency. They continue to live their Christian values, regardless of the political consequences. I think this incident will solidify support for Palin even more.
OK, but here's the deal: Palin/McCain supporters who say this is no big deal (electorally speaking; obviously it's a big deal to the Palins) need to keep quiet from now on about condemning unwed pregnancies. Period.
What you say about the Palins applies to all families in this situation; white, black, Hispanic; rich, poor, middle class; urban, suburban, rural. These families need privacy and prayers, right? We need to mind our own business, right? If not to all families equally, why on earth not? How do you distinguish? And please, don't just say "Christian families only." I'm a Christian but that doesn't exempt my family from moral accountability; if anything, it should raise the bar, not lower it.
Further, if the young Miss Palin and her fiancee end up receiving some sort of taxpayer assistance - - not unlikely, I'll wager - - how does that affect the equation?
Think of it...
"Juno" in Juneau
"But Rod, you're missing the point -- she is being sold as a promoter of 'conservative Christian family values' -- and she failed to do that even in her own family! In my church, if she were a man (because only men can be elders), she would be disqualified from the eldership having failed to well manage his own family. So the GOP wants to put her forward to appeal to conservative Christians like me? Either cynicism or stupidity is sky-high in this situation."
This type of comment boggles the mind.
Palin supports her daughter and her grandchild in the womb. They all want to bring that new life into the world; not destroy it. What's un-Christian about that?
The idea that Palin is at fault because she "failed to that in her own family" is weird. What was she supposed to do? Crush her daughter's free will?
Yeah, the comment I quoted above is another example of the hairbrained ideas that libs carry around in their heads about conservative Christians. Oh wait, it's from a memeber of a church with Elders. Oh well, I guess there's a reason I'm not a member of THAT church. (At least one reason; I'm sure there are many more.)
Libs really don't get conservatives. They really don't
OK, but here's the deal: Palin/McCain supporters who say this is no big deal (electorally speaking; obviously it's a big deal to the Palins) need to keep quiet from now on about condemning unwed pregnancies. Period.
Oh right. Because I suppose social conservatives are constantly wagging fingers at young women who get pregnant out of wedlock and smugly kid themselves that this never happens to Christian families .... What planet are you living on?
Teenagers have raging hormones. They copulate, whether or not they regard it as sinful. Whether or not they know about birth control, they get pregnant. It has always been thus in thus country.
I would draw no conclusions from this at all, other than that the family seems to be a loving one and are standing by their daughter and grandchild. Now leave the kid alone.
'Nuff said.
Now, what does Sarah Palin think about international affairs, if anything? How much history has she studied?
Evangelical hypocrite.Republicans in general are the most hypocitical party.Using christianity,breeding a false image of purity about themselves.Breeding lies or false assuptions about mr obama's religious background.
Married or not bristol palin's facts are the same,she still a evangelical hypocrite.
Think of it...
"Juno" in Juneau
But Rod, you're missing the point -- she is being sold as a promoter of 'conservative Christian family values' -- and she failed to do that even in her own family!
Being Christian is not some fantasy land where things are always perfect and no mistakes are made. Sarah Palin, or any parent for that matter, can not keep their kids from making mistakes. This does not make them hypocrites neither does it make them somehow less Christian...only human. I find it hard to believe that someone who attends Church made this comment. This is the sort of thing secular liberals say as a 'gotcha' every time a Christian makes an inevitable stumble. The Palins could have quietly aborted their youngest child when they found out he had Down Syndrome and they could have done the same with their daughter, but they didn't. They instead welcomed the children into their family. Sounds like 'conservative Christian family values' to me.
How can she promote an abstinence only agenda when she can't enforce that agenda on her own child? You're putting lipstick on a pig here. McCain made a very irresponsible decision, knowingly putting this family in crisis in an incredibly vulnerable position. I'm praying for all the children involved here.
"OK, but here's the deal: Palin/McCain supporters who say this is no big deal (electorally speaking; obviously it's a big deal to the Palins) need to keep quiet from now on about condemning unwed pregnancies. Period."
Fallacious argument. I know of few people supporting Palin who approve of the fact that Bristol got pregnant out of wedlock. What most enthusiastically approve of is the fact that this family, faced with a difficult situation, lived by their values and principles in choosing life for the baby, supporting the daughter, and by the daughter and her boyfriend choosing to accept the responsibility for their actions by marrying and creating a family for the baby.
However, I can certainly disapprove of those who decide that having a child out of wedlock is just another lifestyle choice, and proceed to glamorize and celebrate such a choice.
"Further, if the young Miss Palin and her fiancee end up receiving some sort of taxpayer assistance - - not unlikely, I'll wager - - how does that affect the equation?"
Considering the unwavering support her family is showing, and also considering Sarah Palin's fiscally conservative principles, I see no cause for concern on this point.
I am just completely disgusted with the media. The treatment of McCain's pick for VP is the straw that broke the camel's back. This weekend has been a real eye-opener.
Now we see the true value of "Abstinence Only" sex education. A fundamental belief of our new prospective VP nominee. Kudos John McCain! excellent choice to showcase the effectiveness of republican social conservative ideals!
Here is what kind of boggles my mind - Sarah teaches abstinance only, obviously that was not the right tactic since her daughter had no clue about how to keep from getting pregnant. So how is Sarah going to help run the government, by closing her mind to some of the facts? Is that any way to run our country?
Libs really don't get conservatives. They really don't
Max, that's exactly what's going on here.
Politically, Palin has already provided a huge boost of energy and excitement to the GOP ticket. But this story will help her even more, partly because it underscores her family's pro-life credentials. More importantly, the whole thing calls attention to the Andrew Sullivan/Daily Kos Lie Machine that worked overtime all weekend -- and their despicable behavior is already rallying sympathy for Gov. Palin and backfiring on her detractors.
What kind of mother would accept the VP nomination knowing the pain and embarrassement it would cause her daughter once the pregnancy was exposed? And drag along a 4 month special needs infant on the campaign trail?
A mother whose political ambitions and lack of judgement are startingly obvious.
Had she been home more often, taking care of her own children, perhaps this wouldn't have happened.
As Mark quoted above:
"Remember, your wonder boy Barack was born to a teen age mother who was impregnated out of wedlock by the 24 year old married black African Muslim father when she was only 17 years old."
The hows and whys of someone's birth just isn't something we need to be talking about. Really, let's not go down into this swamp. Please.
When I was a teen, long ago, there was some shame attached to the fact that 16/17 year olds had gotten pregnant. People here do not seem fazed, rather almost proud of this young girl and her lover. Is this because there is no longer any stigma to getting pregnant out of wedlock? Is that because it is so common? I seem to see a lot of harsh criticism about people who screw around, and a lot of finger pointing towards parents who let their children screw around. Yet, this is different. Please explain.
Steve
Good for her for keeping the baby and for getting married.
It does, however, ruin the Palin family tableau. Ronald Reagan ran with a tragically dysfunctional family, so obviously it doesn't hurt men. But does it hurt women? Can a divorced father who was once estranged from his kids and the mother of a teenage mom really be the Focus on the Family poster-candidates?
Tony D,
Wrong. Conservatives do believe un-wed pregnancies are not a good thing. And it is wrong to damn the un-wed mother and child.
But we do think the family, and not a national "federal" governmental leviathan, should support the new family.
That's what the Palins are doing.
Un-wed pregnancy: Not good.
Keeping the child: Very good.
Expecting Washington to solve all your problems: Idiotic.
By the way, when the pro-Palin backlash shows up in this week's poll numbers, the Nutroots will start claiming that the whole Trig story was planted by Karl Rove to discredit them. Many of these people are as deranged as they are unprincipled.
"Now we see the true value of "Abstinence Only" sex education. A fundamental belief of our new prospective VP nominee. Kudos John McCain! excellent choice to showcase the effectiveness of republican social conservative ideals!"
And the last 30 years of sex education and free birth control have given us over a million abortions a year. I don't think you want to go down that road...
As an evangelical and a prolifer, I am totally embarrassed by McCain's choice (and have been since it was announced). After all the progress the evangelical movement has made in recent years to prove that we are intelligent, cultured people who "walk the Christian talk" and are capable of tackling a wide range of policy issues, we get the Palin soap opera on prime time. Pregnant daughter, snowmobile-racing husband who had a DUI, former beauty contestant governor whose policy positions on many issues are to the right of Bush/Cheney, etc.
I wish everyone would quite calling the Palins "evangelicals." More accurately and fairly, they are fundamentalists. And there's a world of difference.
She has one child with special needs and another child who needs her. It appears that Mrs. Palin needs to take care of her home and family before she can spare anytime to learn foreign policy or any of the other duties of Vice President.
Wait, she "chose" life? Does that mean that the daughter might have "chosen" to abort? Does that mean that the grandparents-to-be "chose" to make their decision for their daughter? Did they chose life, or political expediency?
If Sarah is so concerned about the safety of her children, then maybe she shouldn't go on the campaign trail. It seems like her family is already suffering by her difficulties of balancing a career and personal responsibility.
There is a certain irony in all this: Ann Dunham (b. Nov. 29, 1942) was 18 when she gave birth to Barack Obama II on August 4, 1961. Thus, it is likely that Ann was pregnant at 17 with a child sired by a 24 year-old Kenyan exchange student.
Life presents us with certain hardships, some of which are the consequences of our actions. These are the times at which the exercise of virtue becomes the most difficult as well as the most rewarding. Thankfully, there are still many Ann Dunhams and Bristol Palins residing in our communities. We have much to learn from them.
At least Bristol has a choice.
If Palin has her way there will be no choice.
FISCALLY IRRESPONSIBLE Palin, who portrays herself as a fiscal conservative, racked up nearly $20 million in long-term debt as mayor of the tiny town of Wasilla — that amounts to $3,000 per resident. She argues that the debt was needed to fund improvements.
http://www.politico.com/news/stories/0808/12987.html
Toward the very bottom.
Not for America now.
I guess this also explains the whole homeschooling thing. I'm betting the Homeschool Legal Defense Association is having to kill a fundraising letter as we speak.
Yeah, it's quite plain that the libs can't figure this one out, because they have a deficient view of conservatism to start with. They've been taught over and over that conservatives are smug, self-righteous simpletons who are at base hypocrites.
So when they encounter a loving family that is time and again, demonstrably pro-life and forgiving, it doesn't compute because it doesn't fit their pre-conceived notions of conservative Christianity.
They. Just. Don't. Get. It.
It's called Love, people. Christians are all about it, because He's all about it.
God bless the Palins!
I salute Palin's daughter for keeping the child, and agree that the Palins' family are no one else's business.
However, I think a point that's getting missed was well made here:
"Imagine that Joe Biden was an admitted former potsmoker whose wife had a DUI on her record and that his unwed, teenage daughter were pregnant right now—oh, and that Biden was an advocate for sex education in school. Rushbo & company would be going ballistic right now about the corrupting influence of those coastal values, wouldn’t they?"
I think the answer to that rhetorical question is "In spades."
Who would have thought way back in December last year that Lynne Irene Spears would have been someone you could compare the republican VP candidate to.
Okay, so we have another entry for the "political soap-opera file". That's nice.
Still waiting to hear what Palin thinks about
-- Immigration
-- Energy policy
-- America's current economic problems (both the current credit crunch & the impending entitlement train-wreck)
-- US foreign policy
I didn't see this until I'd already made the last post, so pardon the back-to-back posts. I think it makes another good point:
"When the subject is a pregnancy to an unwed, minority teenage mother growing up in some (presumably Democratic) urban area, that pregnancy becomes fodder for lectures from conservatives about bad parenting, the perils of welfare spending and so on. But when the subject is a pregnancy to an unwed, white teenager from some small town in a Republican state, that pregnancy is...a celebration of the wonders of God's magnificence--and choosing life!"
I think it is right to choose life, but a lot of conservatives need to get a reality check on being consistent.
Making this about abortion is a fascinating way to change the subject and attention. Is it fair for voters to ask how a privileged girl like this ends up pregnant? Is it fair for voters to be concerned about the life inside the Palin home? If is fair to wonder, as another commenter asked, who will be watching and raising the Palin kids while mom is attending Naitional Security meetings?
Is it sexist? Absolutely. But female candidates always raise new questions for us. It's not fair, but it is the way it is. I assume her husband does plan on quitting his job and being the primary caregiver if they move into the veep mansion, but is it wrong to ask and want an answer?
FBC:
Sorry to shatter your world, but there are plenty of liberals who are loving or Christian. Some are even both!
On basis do you conclude that neglecting your teenage daughter (and yes, I think teenage pregnancies almost always are evidence of neglect, even if it is benign neglect) is evidence of love?
Real love, as the Gospel makes clear, is built on sacrifice. I haven't yet seen much evidence that the Palins are models of sacrifice. But, I consider the willingness of one parent (and it could be the husband as easily as the wife) to postpone their career for the sake of their children to be the fundamental essential to loving and successful parenting in the United States today.
Bless,
Doug
Hello,
I watched Meet the Press and heard the promotional of Sarah Palin. However, what I don't understand is why did they send in the low level, of the Republican tier, if the base is so excited?
Where are the big endorsements from prominent Republican members such as: Newt, Pat Buch, George Bush (41 especially, and, 43) Karl Rove, Rice, Cheney? And, the brigade of high ranking Republican military to solidify her "readiness"? Just to name a few players. What happened to Morning Joe's Scarborough this morning promoting her? No American wants to watch 3 day coverage of a hurricane, all day long. We can, ourselves, go to the internet and get up-to-date info on the storm.
Basically, the "buzz" is the Republican Party has realized McCain blew it with this choice. Nobody, is buying this hard sell. The internet is a-buzz because mainstream media is running scared of their bosses who want to keep the good spin going. There has been no oposing viewpoint on any media channel since the announcement. We Americans are loving this. It's pure power. We can go from site to site linking stories, sourcing out our own material and sharing it with others in our social groups. With this being a holiday weekend, and because of what I described above, we can circulate our own media bias whatever that may be.
In my fact finding research mostly Alaskian Newspapers (I was reading for an entire day, it was that extensive); as an Independent, voter with conservative viewpoints, I found out:
Palin has ethics and judgment problems - 1.) Questions about the baby, high risk pregnancy, her behavior when faced with going into labor while out of town, etc. 2.) HIGHLIGHTing: Using a special needs baby, campaigning, is extremely poor judgment even with some conservatives. What does her husband do? Every report is--has worked for, or seasonal. What does that mean...sits home, lives off his wife, pumps out babies and watches his wife work herself to death? She's either on her back or her feet working. This picture sends the wrong message to our conservative sons and daughters. Maybe, you should give us clarity by doing a investigative story on him so voters can have all the facts. NOW THE 17 YEAR OLD DAUGHTER IS PREGNANT AND IT MAY NOT BE THE FIRST TIME THIS YEAR. PUSHING FOR A DNA to clear McCain. You push too. Thanks, for your time.
If God wanted teenagers to not have babies, he wouldn't have made them horny, lacking judgment, and fertile. So what if abstinence-only doesn't work; stop fighting the culture of life. Mary had Jesus when she was only 14. What more important thing are young girls supposed to be doing than having babies? Congratulations to Gov. Palin for raising her children with proper Christian values.
I talk openly about this all the time, because it makes me proud: My mother conceived me out of wedlock when she was 17. Doctors tried to convince her into having an abortion - they would make it clean and easy, they assured her, and she was far too bright and promising to ruin her life with a young pregnancy. She and my father loved each other deeply; they married. He died very young, and she was a widow with a toddler. Her life would have been "easier" for sure if she had aborted me, but far emptier, too. I suppose you can understand if I take the abortion debate somewhat personally.
Barrack Obama
since her daughter had no clue about how to keep from getting pregnant.
See, there's a fundamental fault with liberal theology: "If they only knew how to avoid pregnancy."
What a load.
Here's my problem: how old was she was when she got pregnant? who is this dad and how old is he? obama's mother's had similar circumstances but I don't think it will have much traction - the durham's weren't running for the highest office espousing conservative talking points, i.e., abstinence only education, that clearly do not work, i.e., bristol palin.
I'm sorry but as conservative as I am, I just do not trust Gov Palin to lead this country should something happen to Pres McCain.
I was glad when Bush first got elected. At this point, I dont think we need any more of a Whitehouse that pushes party interests over the national good.
Should have taken Hutchinson...
Oh please, liberals, keep it UP!
You're vicious, hate-filled screeds are absolutely necessary for McCain-Palin's November victory.
I'm serious.
"Their decisions are seen by the antichoice Republican base as affirmation that Palin shares their values. But the underlying message that each woman had a choice is a validation of pro-choice values."
Juneau. I can picture the Saturday Night Live sketches now including the shotgun wedding. This too funny.
Read this article by Fredrica Mathews-Green called Lets Have More Teen Pregnancy.
http://www.frederica.com/writings/lets-have-more-teen-pregnancy.html
Shelley
Apart from the irony of Palin speaking about her daughter's choice to go through with the pregnancy (a choice that Palin would deny to all other women in this country), the trainwreck that is the Palin family makes it clear that McCain & his campaign are totally incompetent and lack any judgment at all. They clearly did not vet Palin. This was proven alone by the fact that the Wasilla hometown paper's first outside inquiry came from the Obama campaign. Now, apparently the McCain-ites are filling the hotels in Palin-land in a desperate attempt to find out what they should already have known before ever making the announcement last Friday. Unfortunately for them, they're going to find out worse about what is already known -- Troopergate -- and more.
These are not people that I want running the country. Make no mistake - whether it's Grampy or the Governor who ends up in the #1 slot, it's going to be an utter disaster.
When did having a baby out of wedlock stop being stigmatized? Remember Dan Quayle's harsh words to Murphy Brown (which I agreed with, btw)? I wonder what the right wing pundits would say if Joe Biden's unmarried daughter were pregnant? So many questions on this one.
"obviously that was not the right tactic since her daughter had no clue about how to keep from getting pregnant"
How do you figure it's "obvious" that she "had no clue how"???? Maybe she knew perfectly well how (in fact, that's what abstinence-only teaches) but chose to act otherwise. You know, birth-control oriented education has the same problem -- it's still up to the person to ACT on the education.
"Apart from the irony of Palin speaking about her daughter's choice to go through with the pregnancy (a choice that Palin would deny to all other women in this country),"
Posting from the People's Republic of China, are we? No one in this country would deny anyone the choice to go through with a pregnancy. It's only killing off the inconvenient people that we would deny as a "choice."
Does anyone here think that if the Democrats nominated for VP someone whose teenage daughter was pregnant out of wedlock that the right-wing media wouldn't be filled to the brim with rhetoric about how this showed the bankruptcy of liberal values and the fundamental lack of morals among liberals?
The issue isn't Sarah Palin, people. The issue is that the right gives a pass to one of their own which they would never in a million years give to someone on the other side. Hypocrisy, anyone?
Wrong. Conservatives do believe un-wed pregnancies are not a good thing. And it is wrong to damn the un-wed mother and child.
I agree; that was part of my point. The mother and child should not be "damned." Not Miss Palin; not the poor kid in the ghetto.
But we do think the family, and not a national "federal" governmental leviathan, should support the new family.
I also agree. But taxpayer assistance in one form or another, be it reduced school lunch prices (which I received for a couple of years after my parents' divorce and before my mom got fully on her feet) or help getting trained for a good job is not the same as cradle to grave handouts.
"When the subject is a pregnancy to an unwed, minority teenage mother growing up in some (presumably Democratic) urban area, that pregnancy becomes fodder for lectures from conservatives about bad parenting, the perils of welfare spending and so on. But when the subject is a pregnancy to an unwed, white teenager from some small town in a Republican state, that pregnancy is...a celebration of the wonders of God's magnificence--and choosing life!"
Touche'. Puts well what I was trying to say.
I take that last bit back, actually -- there ARE people in this country who deny people the choice to go through a pregnancy. They are parents, husbands, boyfriends, and eugenicist doctors who pressure women into going through abortions.
As for having a baby out of wedlock is stigmatized, others have made the point that once something has occurred, you can still call it wrong while applauding people for dealing it with it well. But that's missing the point -- there apparently isn't going to BE a baby out of wedlock. That's why they're getting married, because they want to do the right thing, NOT the Murphy Brown thing.
I take that last bit back, actually -- there ARE people in this country who deny people the choice to go through a pregnancy. They are parents, husbands, boyfriends, and eugenicist doctors who pressure women into going through abortions.
Posted by: pentamom | September 1, 2008 4:30 PM
Are guys who have had vasectomies on that list too?
A couple of thoughts come to mind...first of all, there's no comparison to Murphy Brown here...no one came out and said "I'm single and I'm going to be artificially inseminated because I want a child and I don't want a husband."
Second of all, everyone keeps talking about the fact that McCain and Palin support abstinence only sex-ed, and this situation is somehow hypocritical...was it part of the announcement that Bristol and the father of her baby did NOT use contraception? Not that I support the use of contraception, but wouldn't it be interesting if it turns out that the pregnancy was due to a defective condom? Not the best story line for dems promoting "safe" sex, eh?
Finally, comparing THIS situation to a low-income, unwed teenage mother in the inner city, with no father to support the child, and a family who might already be ON welfare is completely without merit. Is it a good thing that Bristol had premarital sex? Of course not. Is it a good thing that she's keeping the baby? Of course it is. Is it a good thing that she's likely getting married to the father, and that he's taking responsibility for his parenthood? Definitely. Is it a good thing that she has a family willing to support her and help her? Yes. Congratulating the Palins on their good choices is in no way hypocritical.
Just like maybe we should have waited for George W. Bush to coach a high school football team to a championship before electing him President, which now seems like a reward to him for having kicked alcohol, Sarah Palin shouldn't leap onto the national stage when she has some pretty big things to take care of at home. It's what's best for the kids... all our kids...
Sure, John, nice word game, but the grownups here know we are talking pregnancies that have actually begun.
This is her stunning profile in courage? Now if she we're homeless, dirt poor, and disabled, yeah it might be something more than a burden, certainly no picnic, but something families face all the time.
She's having a baby not going to the guillotine.
Way to stay classy, pentamom.
I know that we as Christians ought to be forgiving and understanding and willing to support those who bear children and make sacrifices on their behalf, but there's a pretty big difference in my book between giving someone moral support and giving them power over the lives of other human beings.
Sure, let's support Sarah Palin and her family, they, like all families are deserving of our prayers and hopeful wishes.
But it's a totally another matter to place those in need of such understanding in a position of power over us. Understanding is not the same as rewarding.
Finally, comparing THIS situation to a low-income, unwed teenage mother in the inner city, with no father to support the child, and a family who might already be ON welfare is completely without merit.
Well, she does live in government-subsidized housing. The Alaska Governor's mansion.
All kidding aside, I'm not sure you can completely ignore the comparisons. People are often quite willing to question the dysfunction of dependency that leads to teen girls to get pregnant despite everything they know. In fact, it's described as being part of a moral crisis in our culture.
So what does it say that a privileged girl living in the governor's mansion gets pregnant as a teenager. What kind of dysfunction creates this kind of situation. Isn't it a statement about our culture that girls from good Christian families and with all the advantages end up as pregnant teens?
So what does it say that a privileged girl living in the governor's mansion gets pregnant as a teenager.
Posted by: Daniel | September 1, 2008 4:46 PM
Not enough to do in Alaska?
I love this no end the moral double-face of your beliefs--your spirituality, your faith, and your inspiration. "Kind of a bombshell," "gets pregnant, choses life." When it's one of your own, then it's God's blessing and he wants us to support this "shouldn't have happened" but "not unheard of in this country" event. But if it had been Obama's daughter, then it would have been proof once again that we're dealing with appalling ghetto culture that threatens to bring this country down. White folks could never bring this country down. They just occasionally run into indiscretions. What I've always enjoyed about the religious right is their hypocracy. It's moral rectitude no matter what or how they do it justifies any lapse in their superior morality. Their God also sanctions the killing of people in God's holy wars. Bravo God's people! You have so much to teach. One of the greatest industires in the US is the entertainment industry. And in this great play there are no trained actors involved. It just all comes naturally to God's feel-gooders. So, anything for politics, and screw the morality.
Please help me to understand Republican Family Values, Morals, and Ethics
1) John McCain divorced his first wife and married his second even though the divorced papers and marriage license were within a month of each other.
2) John McCain’s current wife was addicted to drugs
3) Sarah Palin’s daughter is 17 yo, unmarried and pregnant
4) Sarah Palin has 5 kids, one recently born and with downs syndrome, has had less than 18 months experience, and a pregnant teenage daughter but will be able to be an effective and FOCUSED VP and step in as president?
5) John McCain knew all of this but still moved forward selling America that she is perfectly qualified to be Vice President of the United States of America
6) No homosexuals because they undermine marriage and the moral fabric of society just because they are gay
Am I missing something? Please help me right wing religious conservatives so that I can understand why you feel this is the dream ticket to run the nation from a moral and ethical view point. This these people represent wholesome American values.
I am BEGGING you to help me understand republican thinking.
"Posting from the People's Republic of China, are we? No one in this country would deny anyone the choice to go through with a pregnancy. It's only killing off the inconvenient people that we would deny as a 'choice.'"
People's Republic of China, uh, yeah right - why don't you call me a Muslim while you're at it? Let me make it clearer, I hope:
I find it amazingly ironic that Palin thinks that what her daughter does with her uterus (chooses to keep the baby versus chooses to have an abortion) is a matter for private choice, while my daughters' or granddaughters' bodies should be subject to HER choices alone for them.
Francis writes: There is a certain irony in all this: Ann Dunham (b. Nov. 29, 1942) was 18 when she gave birth to Barack Obama II on August 4, 1961. Thus, it is likely that Ann was pregnant at 17 with a child sired by a 24 year-old Kenyan exchange student.
What's the irony, Francis? Children don't get the choice about how they're conceived and neither Barack's mother nor Palin's daughter are running for office.
The only irony is see is how rumors still abound questioning Barack's standing as a Christian because he has a "funny" name and a non-Christian father.
Turmarion writes: Still waiting to hear what Palin thinks about:
[...]
add,
Evolution and science? Well, we already know she's not a big fan of inconvenient data. Kinda Bush-like in that manner.
I applaud them and the family. I found myself in the same position years ago and we chose a different path and I have regretted it ever since.
"What I've always enjoyed about the religious right is their hypocracy [sic]."
What I've always enjoyed about liberal whiners is their creative spelling.
When the "ghetto culture" starts encouraging good role models and holding up a standard of behavior befitting young women, and requiring fathers to step up to their responsibilities instead of eschewing the need for for fathers, and taking care of their own, instead of relying on government and other handouts...THEN they can complain about hypocrisy.
BTW Rod, I just realized what bugs me about your post title. Where's the skeptical journalist in you? The only evidence we have for what Bristol has chosen is the brief words of her mother, hardly an objective source. Isn't it at least plausible that Bristol would very much like an abortion, but is being forbidden from choosing one by her parents?
Bless,
Doug
Wait Riley -- you included a lot more than this in your rumors. I remember particularly that you said that the daughter had already had a "Quickie" wedding (apparently not); and that it was common knowledge in Alaska that the Palin children were not parented but instead farmed out to various relatives (possible, but not proven; also, I think for this to matter, those relatives need to be unwilling and incompetent, which again is possible but unproven.) That's what I remember off the top of my head. So no, everything you said is not now confirmed, and in any case, it was still rumor-mongering, and I doubt you'd appreciate the same being done to you.
What kind of mother lets a seventeen year-old get married?
A bad one, that's what.
I found myself in the same position years ago and we chose a different path and I have regretted it ever since.
Thank you for sharing this. You and your baby will be in our prayers. Don't know if it applies, or not, but have you heard about Project Rachel?
Check it out.
God bless you.
Whoever wrote "When the 'ghetto culture' starts encouraging good role models and holding up a standard of behavior befitting young women, and requiring fathers to step up to their responsibilities instead of eschewing the need for for fathers, and taking care of their own, instead of relying on government and other handouts...THEN they can complain about hypocrisy." isn't listening (of course) to Obama, who routinely enourages just the behavior you are suggesting they should. If you recall, Jesse Jackson got mad at him for it.
What I find interesting is that the Christian right wing, despite their undoubted cognitive dissonance over this, is finding a way to find something wonderful about it. If the tables were turned--if it were Biden's daughter for example--the Republicans would be all over this as evidence of the Democrats' lack of morals.
Another example of the failed logic of teaching abstinence only. A 17yr old high school drop out makes for a good example of how a mother has failed. The morning after pill was an option in the 21st century. Too bad the right to lifers live in the 18th century
I respect Sarah Palin, as much as I know of her. However, she may be a heartbeat from the presidency, while trying to take care of 5 children -- including a special needs infant and a pregnant teenager. Perhaps the Superhero here will be the husband. Seems kind of ironic when you think about it.
Too bad the right to lifers live in the 18th century.
Yeah, cause it would be so much better if they would just slaughter the child and be done with it -- you know, like we moderns like to do. No muss, no fuss -- just suck the blood and dismembered remains down the ol' memory hole.
The two serious issues raised by the illegitimate pregnancy of Sarah Palin's minor daughter don't have anything to do with whether she and her family made the correct choice when faced with an illegitimate pregnancy. The issues are:
1. John McCain has demonstrated impulsiveness and very poor judgement in choosing the un-vetted Palin as his choice for vice president. Is this who we want as President? Nope.
2. However brave a face is put on it, pregnancy in unmarried minor teens is not something to flaunt or celebrate. McCain and Palin have put this "in the face" of all Americans -- and illegitimate pregnancy in minors is NOT what the majority of Americans mean when they say family values. It looks to me like the ticket for family values this year is the Democrats.
At least preliminarily, I have to give the Palin family credit for trying to do the right thing in response to a very bad situation.
However, the fact that this situation has arisen at all says some things about the VP-Wannabe that are not good. She apparently has not managed to maintain control of her own House and proper discipline over her children. Certainly she is proving less than effective in transmitting her values to them !
At one point in this nation's history, its political leaders were supposed to represent the very best the country had to offer; the people with the best judgment, significant and solid personal attainments, the highest moral and ethical standards, and the closest personal discipline. George Washington comes to mind.
Cut to 2008: One faction has nominated a man who has no known accomplishments, save as a sanctioned extortionist ("community organizer") and associate of racist preachers and unrepentant criminal radicals who are certainly guilty of serious felonies. His second is a known thief (plagiarized his dissertation in law school), guilty of dishonor and probably felony whose primary expertise seems to be in maintaining himself in office.
Their opponents are: a man who cheated on his wife, was involved with an influence-peddling scheme (managing to stay one step ahead of the Federal prosecutors) and a woman who cannot seem to maintain the minimum of control over her family that should be expected of a Head of House.
Our leaders should be people of quality who strive for excellence in BOTH their personal and professional lives; after all, we are entrusting them with positions of distinction that demand competence and excellence. What we seem to actually have is a motley collection of jumped-up trailer trash, barely competent criminals and people who would not know a sense of personal honor and dignity if the said sense came up and bit them on the behind. The really humorous part (in an absurdist sense) of all this is that large numbers of Americans actually seem to think either of these slates is worthy of leading anything greater than a Clown College Alumni Club.
If this is the best that "democracy" has to offer, then maybe getting rid of monarchy and aristocracy was not the smartest move the Founding Fathers ever made.
Your servant,
Lord Karth
I get it. Nothing a Republican does can ever possibly be considered bad. If Palin was a Democrat, she would have already been forced to resign from the VP slot due to the tut-tutting of the moral majority, and the Drehers of this owrld would have had one more piece of ammunition to prove that decadent liberals were bringing on the downfall of America.
Message received. Carry on.
And here's conservative Lawrence Auster, with the best description of the GOP base I've ever read (courtesy James Walcott):
All that the evangelical and Catholic conservatives care about is opposition to abortion. All that's required for them to be happy is an illegitimate or defective pregnancy, followed by birth. They have no vision of social order, no vision of an overarching good, but have reduced all goods to the good of avoiding abortion. Which means that they embrace every kind of disorder, so long as rejection of abortion is thrown into the mix.
http://www.amnation.com/vfr/archives/011313.html
Up until I heard that Governor's Palin's youngest was only four months old, and had Down's Syndrome as well, and that her daughter was pregnant, I was all for her nomination. But there's such a thing as too much, and I think she's reached that. Naturally, it's her own decision to go forward. I just know that instinctively, I couldn't do it. I've put up with five and half years of always putting the mission first, my family's needs and my own needs have to wait in the back of the line. Some people can live like this. God knows they've probably contributed more than their share to life as we know it. But I can't do it anymore. Maybe part of it is cultural, I am a dilute Hispanic, but Hispanic nonethelesss. I will not take a job where that job has to come first again, not for a long time. I need my family, they need me. This year came close to breaking me. I thank God for the gift of clarity the experience has given me. A career, anyway, will have to get at the back of the line for a while.
For everything there is a season, and a time for every purpose under heaven~
Of course, Bristol Palin eschewed abstinence. Now that's good? Teenage pregnancy is now a good thing? I'm just very confused about what the cultural, moral ideals of America are supposed to be. Professional scolds like yourself, Rod, are now praising that fact that Bristol Palin is an unwed, pregnant teenager. This praise will undoubtedly lead to a rise in unwed, pregnant teenage girls - this behavior is being approved in public, and so approval-seeking teenagers will be doing the same thing. That used to be thought of as a moral hazard, now it's a good thing. Do you have any core values, Rod, other than that you value your own opinion over anything and anyone else, even if it changes to suit the situation? Bristol Palin is a teenager, and I don't expect her to have the capacity of responsibility of an adult, but you claim to be an adult. So shame on you.
Sir:
Many fine points have been made by the previous commenters, particularly concerning IOKIYAR. However, didn't you, Mr. Dreher, recently call a bride a "slut" for wearing a dress that allowed a tattoo to be visible? You were quite adamant about it. Now, a teenager will be wearing a dress at her quickly arranged marriage ceremony that will show her to be quite pregnant. I don't know about you, but where I come from being pregnant is a bit more slutish than a tattoo. Actually, neither would cause much of a real stir, since the pregnant or tattooed one wouldn't be a granola hypocrite.
John E., I apologize. I was indeed rude.
Still, I do think you were willfully misunderstanding my point and scoring rhetorical points without adding substance. No one was talking about the unlimited right of women to get pregnant at any time of their own choosing -- we were talking about the choice to bear an already conceived child. I'm fairly sure you were aware of that.
And I really wish everyone would quit with the line that it's the fact of Bristol's pregnancy that's being celebrated and approved. No, the fact of Bristol's pregnancy is a fact, it cannot be changed (even the horrendously evil act of abortion would not turn back the clock to the day before her pregnancy began) and it's the way the girl and her family are handling it that is being celebrated.
I weep for this poor girl and her "choices". Does she have a choice to not marry the young man who is the father? What about the other choice of giving her child to a loving couple to adopt? Not so simple when it comes down to real life is it?
"Unplanned teen pregnancy is not unheard of in this world." That's It? You seem pretty blase about this. Perhaps this is a teaching moment about the shortcomings of "abstinence only" programs.
i love how conservative religionists have created this elaborate illusion that there exists a major difference between "celebrating" someone wrong and *deliberately* doing something known to be wrong. sorry, but it's not there. not every type of action can be honestly called an "accident" and talk is cheap. saying "oh, i didn't meant to" means nothing. this faux distinction is nothing but a ploy to mask the hypocrisy - condemning others' "celebration" of wrongdoing, while pretending their version of celebration is somehow different.
CGW: "Whoever wrote"??? Umm, my name was at the bottom of the large chunk of quote you copied and pasted...talk about not listening (or reading, in this case)
Anyway, that's great that Obama is encouraging welfare moms to marry their baby daddies (or vice-versa), and encouraging teens to dress and behave and interact appropriately, and encouraging people who get pregnant to get support from their families and church communities instead of getting a free government abortion...I must have missed that speech he likely gave while hanging out with all his gangsta rap friends.
Actually, I googled "Obama encourages kids not to have sex" and, funny, no articles came up supporting that statement. Same for "Obama encourages welfare moms to marry."
Although I wasn't originally slamming Obama in my post about the "ghetto culture," I guess he can actually be included now...thanks!
Post a Comment
By submitting these comments, I agree to the beliefnet.com terms of service, rules of conduct and privacy policy (the "agreements"). I understand and agree that any content I post is licensed to beliefnet.com and may be used by beliefnet.com in accordance with the agreements.