The "Palin promoting her family" shibboleth
Tuesday September 2, 2008
Categories: Family, Republicans
In the comboxes, Daniel continues to flack a line we're hearing a lot from the left re: Palin: Did Gore put his family and family moral decisions front and center in his appeal to voters? The idea here is that...
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Rod Dreher is an editorial columnist for the Dallas Morning News, and author of "Crunchy Cons" (Crown Forum), a nonfiction book about conservatives, most of them religious, whose faith and political convictions sometimes put them at odds with mainstream conservatives. The views expressed in this blog are his own.
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Can we discuss something of substance? Like the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan, the national deficit, energy independence, healthcare for all Americans, rebuilding the nation's bridges??? Frankly, this voyeuristic obsession with a pregnant 17 year old is absurd. Blech!
Here are five of the first seven paragraphs of her coming out speech in Dayton:
First, there are a few people whom I would like you to meet. I want to start with my husband, Todd. And Todd and I are actually celebrating our 20th anniversary today, and I promised him a little surprise for the anniversary present, and hopefully he knows that I did deliver.
And then we have as — after my husband, who is a lifelong commercial fisherman, lifetime Alaskan — he's a production operator. Todd is a production operator in the oil fields up on Alaska's North Slope, and he's a proud member of the United Steelworkers Union, and he's a world champion snow machine racer. Todd and I met way back in high school, and I can tell you that he is still the man that I admire most in this world.
Along the way, Todd and I have shared many blessings, and four out of five of them are here with us today. Our oldest son, Track, though, he'll be following the presidential campaign from afar. On Sept. 11 of last year, our son enlisted in the United States Army. Track now serves in an infantry brigade. And on Sept. 11, Track will deploy to Iraq in the service of his country. And Todd and I are so proud of him and of all the fine men and women serving the country in uniform.
Next to Todd is our daughter Bristol; another daughter, Willow; our youngest daughter, Piper; and over in their arms is our son Trig, a beautiful baby boy. He was born just in April. His name is Trig Paxson Van Palin.
Some of life's greatest opportunities come unexpectedly, and this is certainly the case today. I never really set out to be involved in public affairs, much less to run for this office. My mom and dad both worked at the local elementary school. And my husband and I, we both grew up working with our hands.
I was just your average "hockey mom" in Alaska. We were busy raising our kids. I was serving as the team mom and coaching some basketball on the side. I got involved in the PTA and then was elected to the City Council and then elected mayor of my hometown, where my agenda was to stop wasteful spending and cut property taxes and put the people first.
A quick reply as I have a client deadline.
Didn't Al Gore make his son's auto-crash tragedy (or something along those lines) a key piece of his 1992 VP acceptance speech? I recall his tearfulness during the speech was panned as a bit maudlin -- if not gratuitous -- by a lot of folks.
Can we forget that long, slow kiss by Tipper and Al at the 2000 DNC during his Presidential nomination acceptance speech? Good heavens, whose benefit were they doing that for? What message about wholesomeness and "family values" were they sending out to the voters with that?
And, of course, we all remember back in 1988 (during AlGore's first run for the top job) the great crusade that Tipper Gore launched against immorality in Hollywood. The Hollywood folks hated it, but it definitely "played in Peoria."
But that's not something Palin has said; it's what Palin supporters have said about her.
So you are going to stop with the "Lightworker" and "Obama Messiah"?
Daniel, are you proving Rod's point or do you really think that a pretty boiler plate, "here's my family. Here are their names and a bit about me and my husband" qualifies as "promoting her family" or using them to campaign? I'll ignore the record and give you points for a modicum of logic and assume you were simply proving Rod's point. Thanks for that.
Rod undercuts his argument when he points out her main attraction to social conservatives is her commitment to the pro-life agenda by not having an abortion. She joined the ticket to appeal to social conservatives. Her main cred--her only cred--is her views on abortion and her personal testimony. We know the story of Trig because she has told it.
She walks the walk, which is what makes her attractive. That walk is her family, which she has put center stage.
Daniel:
Re: your post at 12:43 PM, what Palin did is NO different than what any other top-ticket candidate does, They all bring out the families and talk about the who they are and where they come from. "A Man from a Place Called Hope" (Clinton) -- "A Father from Kenya and A Mother from Kansas" (Obama) -- etc., etc.
At the DNC, we had Michelle's brother describing their childhood. And we had Michelle and the Obama children waving to their Dad (on the big screen, with the youngest daughter crying out, "we miss you Daddy!"). By the way, call me ham-hearted, but that actually brought a few tears to my eyes. Yup, call me a sucker for this stuff -- Democrat or Republican.
We aren't just electing public policy wonks (heads of government) ... but also national symbols that reflect who we are as a people (heads of state). Thus the interest in all this bioraphical stuff -- regardless of the party -- makes sense.
Try this one on for size.
The he's my high school sweetheart, PTA, look at my kids schtick is valid when running for mayor.
The my husband is a fisherman and oil worker, we both work with our hands schtick is valid when running for governor.
Neither matters in a campaign for federal office. They are valid as footnotes and sidebars, not the opening focus of a press conference. I see nothing wrong -- and there should be nothing wrong to see -- in having her family on stage as mute support for her ambitions, but that is where they should remain.
Skip over whether she was properly vetted. She's started out with a lousy campaign staff making stupid decisions and letting her make mistakes right from the start.
Reaganite, I sorta stomped on your latest post before seeing it. I wanted to say that I appreciate your balanced approach here, and I invite your rational view of my latest post above.
Biographical data is of interest: no argument.
Biographical data should be of primary focus: see my previous post.
Daniel, so are you saying that the only way for politicians to protect their families from nastiness is by NOT walking the talk? So any decent person who actually lives what they believe when it comes to family doesn't belong in politics unless they want to subject their family to the likes of you? Yup. Makes perfect sense to me.
Actually, when you think of it, one must wonder how many good, decent people who would be a benefit to the country in public service don't enter because they don't want their family subjected to this sort of stuff. Daniel's "logic" wins out and we're all the worse for it, I suppose.
All stupidity aside, I really think that the only decent, humane way to handle families, particularly children, of politicians is to just accept that when they work well, it can be a bonus. When they do not, we should all look the other way. And yes, I think that applies to Edwards as well - I said then and continue to say that regardless of what nonsense he had previously spouted about character and private lives, his affair was a not news.
Boy, this is some pretty thin gruel. Has Obama not talked about his family? (I seem to remember some interviews...).
All of a sudden, simply having a slightly larger than average number of children (for this day and age), and having a high-visibility working career is now a political statement?
I guess it truly is perceived as such, and that is what has "progressives" so completely unhinged about Palin. She doesn't even have to say or do much over the next few years; just her existence as a working mother, raising a non-aborted Down's Syndrome child, and being in the top leadership of the Republican Party (win or lose in November) is obviously some type of deep political and personal affront to many. This must not stand. Losing in November will not be sufficient, she and her entire family must be humiliated and disgraced.
After a lifetime of the Republican party giving us the same-old, same-old types to rally behind (Reagan being the only notable exception), McCain has up-dumped the apple cart, not just for now, but looking forward. The federal government is not only a complete cesspool, but the economic system that fuels it is collapsing on itself. Could we be looking at the beginning of a new generation of conservative-libertarian reformers, who actually live out their prinicples? Real change instead of changey platitudes? There's a tiny glimmer of hope.
I sure hope that the McCain people aren't panicking and succumbing to the cynical and disingenous mau-mauing by Sullivan, the main-stream media, and the other Usual Suspects. If for no other reason, I fear for the future of this country if people are now effectively disqualified for elective office or public service as a consequence of the sins of their children.
We aren't just electing public policy wonks (heads of government) ... but also national symbols that reflect who we are as a people (heads of state). Thus the interest in all this bioraphical stuff -- regardless of the party -- makes sense.
I don't disagree. But when you are the hockey-mom from Wasilia who has been sold as the bridge to social conservatives because of your family decisions, your family becomes a focus. Maybe it's unfair that McCain has put her in this situation. Maybe it's unfair that social conservatives turned her into a symbol of their pro-life hopes and dreams. But here we are.
It wasn't her accomplishments that got folks like Rod excited. It wasn't even her alleged reputation as a reformer. It was her pro-life bona fides, her life story, her hockey-mom crossed with Annie Oakley persona, that fact that she--wait for it--even homeschooled, is what whipped the base into a frenzy.
If Palin's family is getting on the front page, it's not because Sarah Palin is using them or promoting them. It's because the mindless, desperate, and venomous extreme left is preying on them for ammo against the McCain/Palin campaign.
Quite honestly, if Palin were the Democratic nominee and had give children -- including one disabled young infant and one pregnant teen -- the right wing would be pillorying her for being a lousy mother. Is that fair? No, not from either side. But that's politics, and BOTH sides do it.
With that said, as a woman, a Republican, and a mother, I am deeply disturbed by Palin's selection. I believe she is wholly unqualified to be VP, particularly behind a presidential candidate who is 72 years old and a four-time cancer patient. McCain was irresponsible to choose her, and she was irresponsible to accept. There have to be at least 100 women in the Republican party who have the gravitas to be on the ticket. No one will ever be able to convince me she was the most qualified choice.
And as a mother, I simply cannot comprehend how she thinks she can do this job well, and handle her home responsibilities well. As another mother said to me over the weekend, "You can juggle a lot of jobs with a Blackberry and a breast pump, but Vice President isn't one of them." I heartily agree. Gov. Palin would be doing the best thing for her family by putting off higher office aspirations until her children are older -- and she is more experienced. I am 47 years old, and I came of age in a time when women were told they could "have it all." What we found out through hard experience is that we can have it all -- we just can't have it all at once.
It was Al Gore who, in his 1992 convention speech, dragged out the story of his son being hit and nearly killed by a car. He used this story for purely partisan reasons, to promote universal health care.
So Daniel, are you saying that she didn't live out her pro-life credo in her family? Or are you saying that because this one aspect of her family has been held up by conservatives, every part of her family life is therefore open to discussion and judgement? Because if it's the use of her pro-life credentials or even her homeschooling that is being held up, shouldn't discussion be limited to those areas and not what ever is going on with her family in general? But I guess that's just no fun, huh?
Palin really has the liberals running scared. She is everything they hate: She hunts, didn't attend an overpriced university, has a husband with no college degree that works with his hands for a living, didn't abort her child because it wasn't going to be born perfect, didn't have her child abort her grandchild because child got pregnant at a young age, goes to church. She is appealing because she and her family sound like your average American family and liberals hate the average American family.
"Our beautiful daughter Bristol came to us with news that as parents we knew would make her grow up faster than we had ever planned. We're proud of Bristol's decision to have her baby and even prouder to become grandparents."
X----------------------X
Would anyone here feel a sense of pride if your teenage unwed daughter came to you and said she was pregnant ?
Daniel wrote:
It wasn't her accomplishments that got folks like Rod excited. It wasn't even her alleged reputation as a reformer. It was her pro-life bona fides, her life story, her hockey-mom crossed with Annie Oakley persona, that fact that she--wait for it--even homeschooled, is what whipped the base into a frenzy.
At the risk of sending Daniel into a seizure, I have to say that he's hit the head on the nail. Palin had the same exact problem as did Jindal. She's not seasoned. Given a term or two in office, like Jindal, she promises make a great national candidate (provided no other bombs go off in her home life). Now she's looking at being the female answer to Dan Quayle, a talented guy pushed too far too fast.
Yes, Obama is also inexperienced, but so what? That's an empty tu quoque, made even emptier by the fact that he was actually elected by his party's base, whereas Palin has been anointed, and anointed solely on the basis of her having an ovary and a kid with Downs (anyone who says otherwise simply isn't being honest). There's nothing in her political record that you couldn't find more of in a number of other politicians. She is a token candidate, and McCain picked her solely for her ability to appeal to a certain demographic. And if that demographic actually finds this pick enough to convince them to put aside their reservations and vote for Johnny Mac, then they're every bit as stupid as he apparently thinks they are.
Sigilaris, to her credit, has maintained a philosophical consistency on this issue by saying that all politicians face time away from the family, but I think this case is entirely different, even from the Algore situation. In that case, His Greenness only needed to take the car keys away from his brat. Here you have a woman with two major-league sized crises: a pregnant teenage daughter and an infant with Downs. Both of these require hands on management from the parents. I wouldn't trust a man or a woman in this situation with the Presidency of the United States. Either they'll be terribly distracted, or their utterly cold-hearted. I don't care for either one of these people being in office. The only thing that could justify her running, is if she was the ONLY person capable of doing the job, and she clearly isn't. In fact, if there's a list of those capable, she's not even in the Top 20.
Bingo Steve-o!
She introduces her family with herself and libs charge she's pimpin' her kids.
Yet it was only two days ago that the charge was that she wasn't transperant enough about her personal family matters regarding her son's, Trig's, parentage.
Damned if you do; damned if you don't. Sound familiar?
Face it. Dyed in the wool libs hate conservatives. Most really believe the poison they spew about us. The don't understand who we are or what we stand for. They look at the absolute extreme examples of hate on the right (remember, there's hate on both sides) and take that as the exemplar of conservatism. I really have come to believe that they BELIEVE this blatherskite of their's.
It should not come as any surprise to conservatives that there is nothing you can do to please liberals. Nothing.
Don't moderate your principles to get along with them. They give no quarter.
Example?
A woman should....
1) Always have the right to choose...
and
2)...is always confronted with the glass ceiling, and needs to crash through it.
Oh, but wait. That is as long as the choice isn't life and family AND career (cf. all the complaints that Palin shouldn't enter the race because there are...
WAIT FOR IT!
...little children in her family AND has a grandchild on the way!
Libs hate us. They hate Palin. They hate.
Don't compromise.
Seems like John Edwards, while running for the Democratic presidential nomination, and fathering a baby while having an extramarital affair against his cancer-stricken wife, is a much bigger deal than an Alaskan teenager getting pregnant. Where are the media's priorities?
Gretchen: If Palin chooses not to share with the whole world the entire spectrum of emotions she likely went through with the news of her daughter's pregnancy would that mean she's a bad parent or bad VP candidate?
Steve,
I work with my hands. I did not attend an overpriced university. I'm a regular blood donor and a volunteer with handicapped people. I love my first and only wife. I live in a small house and have a garden. I guess you could say I'm from the average American family.
But in your world, there's something terribly, terribly wrong with me. I'm a liberal and a democrat. I can assure you, I am not scared of Sarah Palin. I do feel sorry for her.
Would I feel proud about what, Gretchen? I would not feel proud that my teenage daughter was pregnant. I would feel proud that she had made good choices after the damage was done, and you bet I'd be proud of being a grandmother, though I'd probably use the word thankful instead (the alternative is to reject the grandchild -- who's up for that as a right response?) Should they be ashamed of both her failure AND her positive response to it? Is that what you're suggesting?
She is appealing because she and her family sound like your average American family and liberals hate the average American family.
Posted by: Steve | September 2, 2008 1:56 PM
Since the most recent Presidential elections have been very close to a 50-50 split between the Democratic and Republican candidates, do you think that there might be a logical flaw in your assertion?
Take your time...
Dyed in the wool libs hate conservatives. Most really believe the poison they spew about us. The don't understand who we are or what we stand for. They look at the absolute extreme examples of hate on the right (remember, there's hate on both sides) and take that as the exemplar of conservatism. I really have come to believe that they BELIEVE this blatherskite of their's. Bolding by FE.
Um, Max? Just transpose "liberals" and "conservatives" and their variants in your statement. Pot. Kettle. Black.
Would anyone here feel a sense of pride if your teenage unwed daughter came to you and said she was pregnant?
I wouldn't feel proud at all. I imagine that I'd feel embarrassed for her, I'd be heartbroken, and above all I'd be concerned. Oh, and I'd be grateful that she chose to have the baby; a 17 year old girl, I think, has the liberty to abort her baby without her parents' consent.
But I would never, ever, ever let anybody in public think I was anything but 100 percent supportive of my daughter and her unborn child. And I would think any good parent, liberal or conservative, would feel the same way, and act accordingly.
Steve:
"Liberals running scared"? Please! The Democratic nominee is now enjoying a bigger "bump" than he got from the convention. No, the problem is Palin's lack of qualification for being "a heartbeat away" from the highest office in the land, and McCain's foolish shoot-from-the-hip choice of a running mate apparently without having done his homework.
"Liberals hate the average American family"? Again, please! There is no such thing as the "average American family". June Cleaver only existed on TV. Okay--you wanna go there, let's go there: Which of the two major party candidates for president is still married to the first woman he married and has never been unfaithful to his wife that anyone knows of (and we certainly would know it by now), and which of the two, as it is well-known, stepped out on his first wife and had an affair with the woman to whom he is now married?
"Gilead then cut Ephraim off from the fords of the Jordan, and whenever Ephraimite fugitives said, 'Let me cross,' the men of Gilead would ask, 'Are you an Ephraimite?' If he said, 'No,' they then said, 'Very well, say Shibboleth.' If anyone said, 'Sibboleth', because he could not pronounce it, then they would seize him and kill him by the fords of the Jordan. Forty-two thousand Ephraimites fell on this occasion."
I don't think shibboleth is the right word for what Rod is saying. Smear? Lie? Let's not muddy up such a cool word by misusing it.
"Canard" is probably the best word in the situation.
Ah, Republican family values on display.
Soon to join the second family hopeful's clan, Levi Johnston. I know it makes me so much more disposed to the GOP to know their VP pick's future 17 year old son-in-law describes himself as a 'f**king redneck'.
"Would anyone here feel a sense of pride if your teenage unwed daughter came to you and said she was pregnant ?"
We don't know what Gov. Palin said to her daughter when she was told of the pregnancy. Do you? Inquiring minds want to know.
I do know that virtually everyone would rather have that daughter than a fully-contracepted one who sleeps with the football team but walks away without pregnancy or an STD. For there is no prophylactic for the soul.
BTW, how do we know the boy didn't use a condom? Of course, either way, it's none of our business.
Richard Bottoms (or, should we call you "Dick"), most reasonable and thoughtful people realize that the thoughts of one kid, no doubt high on youthful bravado, don't speak for the entire Republican Party. Obviously, you aren't part of that group of people.
I would suggest against misusing big words in the titles of your posts. It tends to prejudice your readers in to one of two camps: one who automatically grants greater weight to your post because its title contains a big, impressive word they don't understand; and, the other, who disregards the rest of your post as likely being both 1) unduly pretentious and 2) wrong.
"Liberals running scared"? Please!
When the New York Times has three front page articles on the daughter of the vice-presidential candidate, then yes, the liberals are scared.
The Democratic nominee is now enjoying a bigger "bump" than he got from the convention.
Andy, that ain't saying a whole lot considering he's had one of the smallest post-convention bumps ever and if you account for the polls margin of error, he hasn't really changed at all.
There is no such thing as the "average American family"
Maybe where you come from in liberal la-la land where everyone is happy, the birds are always singing, and abortions are always on demand, but there are plenty of them in my neighborhood.
Jim,
But in your world, there's something terribly, terribly wrong with me. I'm a liberal and a democrat.
Yes, I do see something terribly, terribly wrong...you do that whiny, patronizing thing liberals do when they have trouble making a point.
John E,
do you think that there might be a logical flaw in your assertion?
No, the logical flaw was in your response. Think about it. Take your time, I think you'll need it although it is quite obvious.
I know it makes me so much more disposed to the GOP to know their VP pick's future 17 year old son-in-law describes himself as a 'f**king redneck'.
Well, we know for a fact that his choice of adjective is technically accurate, if nothing else. ;-)
See:
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/chris-kelly/im-falling-in-love-with-s_b_123180.html
lol. if you aren't seeing the clear pander to both women and the conservative christian base than I'm not surprized you don't get it.
Barack is right -- You just don't get it.
btw if she were a Democrat we wouldn't be so nice. If her family is part of her qualifications then its fair game. Or is McCain going to all of the sudden start running an honorable campaign like he promised?????
If Gov. Palin dudn't want the bad to come with the good than she shouldn't have accepted.
Richard Bottoms: "Republican family values on display...I know it makes me so much more disposed to the GOP to know their VP pick's future 17 year old son-in-law describes himself as a 'f**king redneck'.
You mean the ramblings of some kid, no doubt high on youthful bravado, on his blog completely make up the platform of an entire political party?
I hope they fix that at the convention!
You mean some kid about to marry the daughter of someone who might ,on any given day after inauguration, be the most powerful person in the world? Sure, as a family what do I care what they think?
Perhaps Ms. Palin is a f**king redneck redneck too?
I certainly grew up around enough of them, but darn if they didn't seem to call me names. Well not names, really just one.
I cannot begin to describe the disgust I feel towards the creepazoid conspiracy nuts who have turned a family matter into a political football, right down to examining the belly of a teenager via pictures posted on the internet. Bristol's life will forever be defined by her mother's ambition.
Never would I put my daughter into this position...never would I have permitted my baby girl to endure this nightmare in the interests of my political ambitions. Never. Never. And here is the kicker...no Dad would either.
Susan Collins? No. Olympia Snowe? No. KB Hutchinson? No.
Right here, right now, I loathe Palin. I would have protected my daughter.
"You mean some kid about to marry the daughter of someone who might ,on any given day after inauguration, be the most powerful person in the world?"
It's nothing more than some kid with a MySpace page, not thinking about what he posted. He's one of millions. This is a non-issue.
If you want something to worry about, how about your party nominating for President someone with less experience in elected office than the Vice-Presidential nominee of the opposing party!
"You mean some kid about to marry the daughter of someone who might ,on any given day after inauguration, be the most powerful person in the world?"
Oh gimme a break here. How many presidents have had some low-life member of the immediate family running around being embarrassing? Billy Carter, anyone?
Billy may have been embarrassing, but he had nothing to do with his brother's performance as a president, good, bad or indifferent.
"Our beautiful daughter Bristol came to us with news that as parents we knew would make her grow up faster than we had ever planned. We're proud of Bristol's decision to have her baby and even prouder to become grandparents."
Gretchen, you said:
"Would anyone here feel a sense of pride if your teenage unwed daughter came to you and said she was pregnant ? "
You are misreading the statement, either deliberately or out of ignorance. Nowhere in that statement did she say she was proud of Bristol for being pregnant. She is proud of her for making the right decision once she became pregnant - to have her baby, marry the father and accept responsibility for her decisions and actions.
My 21-year old son called me a few months ago to tell me he was going to be a father. He is not married to the mother. My boys were raised in church, and we have talked a lot about sex outside of marriage and the consequences, but he went ahead and did what he wanted.
Was I proud of the fact that he was fathering a child with a woman to whom he is not married? No. But I was proud of his determination to do everything in his power to be a good father and to support his child and the mother. And while we are not thrilled with the circumstances, my wife and I are now looking forward to being grandparents. Regardless of the circumstances of conception, that child will be our grandchild, and we will love him/her with all of our hearts. So I can understand Palin's statement perfectly.
If the Vice-Presidential pick of the opposition party sees herself as a Redneck, I'd like to know.
Ms. Palin, your daughter is marrying a redneck, are you a redneck too? What do you think of rednecks? What would you tell you soon to be son-in-law, the f**king redneck, about America?
Freebird!
"If the Vice-Presidential pick of the opposition party sees herself as a Redneck, I'd like to know"
Perhaps you would prefer her seeing herself as a messiah like other nominees do?
Honestly, Richard, you aren't making a lick of sense. I'm embarrassed for you.
Ms Palin...the father of your grandchild appears to be seriously taken aback by your declaration of marriage. Did you actually check with him, or did you just pull out the 12 gauge for the shotgun wedding?
Personally, I'm all over the 12 gauge, but for wildly different reasons.
Let me get this straight -- the sexual indescretions of the President were supposed to be irrelevant, but the promiscuity of the V.P. nominee's daughter suddenly disqualifies her from office?
Is that what's being argued here?
Not only are those of you who defended Bill Clinton and are now piling on Sarah Palin a bunch of hypocrites, I suspect a little bit of mysogyny as well.
If her name was Steve Palin and HE had 5 children, one of them about to go to Iraq, one with a potential handicap and another pregnant, would his experience as a governor of a big important state and knowledge of significant energy issues be irrelevant?
That is a bit too hypothetical a scenario for me. Alaska is only a large state if your counting the square miles.
And some other states are only large if you're just counting people. Twenty percent of our energy comes from Alaska. I'd call that important.
Care to share with us where you confirmed the opinion of "marriage" by the future son-in-law of Palin came from?
"Ms Palin...the father of your grandchild appears to be seriously taken aback by your declaration of marriage. Did you actually check with him, or did you just pull out the 12 gauge for the shotgun wedding?"
Today it's more likely to be a cheque book then a shotgun.
Oh well - at least as Vice-President it will be easier to destroy Levi when this whole thing goes into the toilet, which is exactly where it's headed.
I just googled the "future son-in-law" and am assuming you took your opinion from his "my-space" or was it "face-book," either way, if what was released before making the site private is true, I have two comments...one, if they do wed, hopefully this young man can grow up quickly and be more responsible than he "sounds" on the web, or, as the mother of a daughter, I'd support her not marrying him at all! Better to be a single Mom in a loving Christian family, than to be the wife of a immature jerk!
Ann, 3.5% of American energy production comes from Alaska. That puts it in the same ball park as Oklahoma.
http://tonto.eia.doe.gov/state/state_energy_profiles.cfm?sid=AK
http://www.eia.doe.gov/emeu/states/sep_prod/P2/P2.xls
"Um, Max? Just transpose "liberals" and "conservatives" and their variants in your statement. Pot. Kettle. Black."
Franklin,
You are correct, to a point.
But it is important to remember that it is conservatism that ultimately champions the individual's freedom to strive and to excel.
Liberalism today is marked by what Thomas Sowell called, in his book by the same name, "The Vision of the Annointed."
Liberalism is by its nature condenscending and snobbish. At its heart is a disdain for others, especially others who disagree. And none disgree more than conservatives.
The true home of hate is on the left. It is found on the right is spades, but it reaches its zenith on the left.
I'd support her not marrying him at all! Better to be a single Mom in a loving Christian family, than to be the wife of a immature jerk!
Pretty much...I saw the page before it went dark, and I'm thinking this young woman ought not to compound her mistakes. Pretty genes all around...but the kid came right out and admitted that bambinos were not in the cards.
I cannot begin to describe the disgust I feel towards the creepazoid conspiracy nuts who have turned a family matter into a political football, right down to examining the belly of a teenager via pictures posted on the internet. Bristol's life will forever be defined by her mother's ambition.
So all this patently HORRIBLE behavior by a whole host of Democrats and lefties is the fault of the mother of Bristol Palin?
This is most absurd and idiotic logic I have ever witnessed here.
Even worse than Daniel's endless confusion.
This is most absurd and idiotic logic I have ever witnessed here
Because logically...mothers and fathers are too stupid to see the incoming, directly targeting thier child?
You don't think "her life will be forever defined by" is a little over the top? Twenty and thirty years later, how much do you think Tricia Cox's, Julie Eisenhower's, Amy Carter's, and the Ford kids' family and friends -- the people who matter to them in real life -- define them by "the Checkers speech," "lust in the heart" and "walking and chewing gum," which are the approximate long-term equivalents of Democratic operatives fussing for a few weeks over Bristol Palin's pregnancy?
In the interest of semantic clarity, one should pay attention to the small-c and small-l in the labels being used. ;-)
But it is important to remember that it is conservatism that ultimately champions the individual's freedom to strive and to excel.
Max, that is -- unwittingly, I feel sure -- an egregious example of claiming the high ground in the face of contradictory evidence.
By your logic, the conservative Tories should have supported the colonial revolution.
By your logic, every conservative in the antebellum South should have supported abolition of slavery.
By your logic, every conservative in 20th century southern states should have supported civil rights regardless of race.
Need I go on?
I respectfully and sincerely submit that neither liberals nor conservatives are validly defined by the high profile rhetoric from either side. For one side to push that invalid definition on the other side is, if you'll forgive me, a passle of lies dressed up as a rallying cry. Once the poison sets in, and it will if we let it, what chance do you think there will be that they can sit down at the same table and get anything -- anything at all -- accomplished?
To emphasize the point: liberals and conservatives both get the same criticism, as far as I'm concerned.
Self-reflection, as Mr. Beckwith ironically accuses me of lacking in the "Palin is a Christian" thread, is the only cure. The ego must let the criticisms in, strip them of their emotional content and pay attention to the truths they carry.
And the left wing payed to fly Levi down to the convention? And the bloggers bought him a suit and put him on the tarmac? And the elite liberal media took the pictures of them all greeting McCain.
Do you really thing young Bristol and Levi asked to become poster children for the antichoice movement?
Wouldn’t a simple, my daughter is flying back to Alaska to be with her future husband have been a more sincere expression of “the children are out of bounds?”
And isn’t it funny that liberal elite mediaman Bill O’Reilly said that when Jaime Lynn Spears became pregnant and announced she would wed the father O’Reilly said it “reflected on the poor morals and obviously loose values of the household” and then ran continual followups on the situation.
That’s why people can’t take your positions seriously, you are hypocrites.
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