So says President Obama in an interview with French media on the eve of his Middle East visit, according to this, by the UK Telegraph's US Editor Toby Harnden:
As ABC's Jake Tapper and Sunlen Miller astutely outline here, the Obama administration is embracing the new president's inner Muslim, as it were, with deputy national security adviser that Obama had "experienced Islam on three continents...growing up in Indonesia, having a Muslim father -- obviously Muslim Americans [are] a key part of Illinois and Chicago".So that's once, twice, three times a Muslim?
Just in case the Arab world hasn't yet got this message of inbuilt tolerance, Mr Obama himself has gone a step further. In an interview with France's Canal Plus released on Tuesday evening, he suggested that the United States might be a Muslim country. (...)
But then, as is his habit , Obama turned the concept around. "Now, the flip side is I think that the United States and the West generally, we have to educate ourselves more effectively on Islam.
"And one of the points I want to make is, is that if you actually took the number of Muslim Americans, we'd be one of the largest Muslim countries in the world. And so there's got to be a better dialogue and a better understanding between the two peoples."
Hmm. America needs to understand Muslims better, because America is one of the largest Muslim countries in the world?
But is the claim true? It's difficult to estimate the number of Muslims in America--which is true of other religions, too, of course--but estimates range anywhere from one to eight million. That doesn't really compare to the Islamic population in the twenty countries with the largest number of Muslims, which range from 16 million to 200 million; even accepting the largest estimate of eight million American Muslims the United States would place around 28th. And the lowest number would put us close to 70th place.
So no, America does not appear to be one of the world's largest Muslim countries, though a president about to embark on a trip to the Middle East might be excused a bit of hyperbole. Still, given how excited the tinfoil-hat crowd can get over the "Obama-as-secret-Muslim" meme, I think it might have been better to have stuck with the usual sort of platitudes about tearing down walls and building bridges and so forth.
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I thought this comment of his was really wierd.
First, he announces to the world some weeks ago that "hey, we are SO NOT a christian nation!!" And now, "but we ARE the biggest muslim nation in the world!"
Does he even know how weirdly inconsistent he sounds on this?
Anon: "Also Rombald and David, the history of Islam is not on your side."
After a reputation on this blog as the no.-1 Islamophobe, it's a change to be accused of being soft on Islam (LOL). However, I think you slightly misunderstand me. I was not saying that the USA should accept Islamic rule. I was saying that, if there is any hope for coexistence between Islam and non-Islam, it lies in the intra-Islamic victory of those who define the Dar-al-Islam as places where Islam is permitted, ie. that secular democracies constitute Muslim countries.
I agree that "the history of Islam is not on your side", but in my original comment I said that "I therefore hope that Obama is right, but I very much doubt it." If the above liberal-democratic interpretation of Islam does not succeed within the Muslim world, the alternative scenarios are either the victory of Islam, or (i) extermination of all Muslims on earth; (ii) conversion of all Muslims on earth to Christianity, atheism, Buddhism or whatever; (iii) complete separation of Islam and non-Islam, with all Muslims expelled from the West, and all trade links cut; and (iv) permanent dictatorial military rule of the entire Muslim world by a non-Muslim country or alliance. I see all these alternatives as difficult, unpleasant, and requiring severe rstriction of the very freedoms they would aim to save. Therefore, I wonder if it would be worth holding out for a more optimistic scenario, at least for the moment.
Anon: "I'd say western media simply doesn't report, or downplays much of what is happening within Islam all over the world. If most westerners knew exactly what was going on in "the hearts and minds" of most Muslims they'd be scared shitless."
I certainly agree that Islam is, to generalise, far more vicious than any other religion/worldview with a mass following today. I don't agree with any of that nonsense equating "Christianistic" opposition to gay marriage, say, with Muslim behaviour. However, as I said above, I'm just trying to think of alternatives that don't involve, say, building gas chambers for Pakistanis in the next town, or paying taxes for the micromanaged rule of Arabia for the next 1,000 years.
When you're talking about things further in the past, I think that Islam probably does have a worse record in terms of humane behaviour than any other civilisation. However, others don't exactly have shining records either, and a lot of the examples you gave could be applied to Christianity.
What about Andalucia. Did you ever wonder why the great mosque at Cordoba became a church?
Ever wonder what happened to all the marble statues in the Greek temples?
Remember the Native Americans, the Australian Aborigines?
DavidTC, you said:
"If part of their premise is 'The US is at war with Islam', and we can say 'We have plenty of practitioners here, who are able to worship freely. So really you're sorta at war with yourself.'"
This is a better statement of what I was trying to say. Exactly.
If anyone has been following the news about the latest audiotape from Bin Laden, it is clear that he sees Obama's popularity as a real threat to Al Qaeda's image in the Muslim World. For those who think Obama is making the U.S. appear weak (frankly, I think those who think that are the weak ones) I offer Bin Laden's latest missive as a counterexample.
The other news story I hope you have been reading about is the Muslim shopkeeper in Long Island who gave $40 and a loaf of bread to a would-be-robber, after the man tried to rob him, was repelled, and collapsed in tears. Those are the kind of Muslim values we should all be applauding.
Is it possible that he simply misspoke? That we might have one of the larger Muslim populations outside the traditionally understood Muslim world seems more plausible and was probably at the heart of what he was trying to illustrates. The President seems pretty well informed and even lived in Indonesia, so is there really anyone out there that truly thinks that he lacks a sense of scale on this topic? Yes, he should try a thought in his head before says it perhaps. Certainly, this is a problem our past leaders (even the conservative ones) could relate to.
trying to illustrate
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