Now, will they embrace clean nuclear power? Or is that just for Iran?

God sure has a sense of humor and she s just getting funnier every day. Hilarious! I pray God will protect us from Satan and all her minions.

The KKK is proof that Republicans and Baptist interbreed. BTW my former church! I do think the Southern Baptist have been taken over by a few nut bags, of course they wouldn’t be in charge without support. I’ve never been able to reason with Baptist after they dig in their heals where they feel the moral question is settled. They have to feel the effect of their position before they change.

Watch out or someone will tell you that you should follow the beliefnet rules of conduct. But, I guess calling Baptists and Republicans inbred nutbag Klansmen are acceptable here where Liberation Theology and Marxist Christianity are cool.

butch | 02.09.07 – 4:07 pm | #The KKK is proof that Republicans and Baptist interbreed. OH – PLEASE… I have read this site for months and have only commented the past few weeks. You are so off base – didn’t you forget the ‘Republ-Nazi’ in the DNA-pool? If – if you thinking is true…how do you explain the KKK Grand Wizard Sen. Byrd? -

Wizard Sen. Byrd is the head of my clutch! I’m sorry for your deficit, sometimes it is hard to find humor especially if you take yourself or me to seriously. Although all of the KKK i’ve met were Baptist and Republicans, I just drew the obvious conclusion mostly my cousins in Ga.

PS they didn’t have much of a sense of humor either!

butch You can draw that conclusion about Baptists, but If I say Muslims are responsible for chopping off heads and blowing up innocent Israelis (ie, terrorists), I would be out of line and violate the rules of conduct…. blah blah What’s your solution to this (namecalling isn’t a solution BTW)? Nuclear plants? Sounds good to me.

Faster go off in a corner and pinch yourself. Real hard!

“Faster go off in a corner and pinch yourself.” Are you advocating violence against me?Come and see the violence inherent in the system. Help! Help! I’m being repressed!

butch | 02.09.07 – 5:14 pm | #I enjoy a good joke just as much as the other guy. But what I have read over the past few months and how you have handled others on this site – I saw no humor. Nazi – KKK, thats bushleague. later… -

fasternu426 | 02.09.07 – 5:37 pm | #Bring on the Nuclear Power Plants – cheap, effecient energy source. Off to a high school basketball game – double hitter tonight…varsity boys and girls. Later .

Butch, are you a baptist? That would solve the problem right there. Then you can claim self deprecation or religious self deprecation. p

I think calling attention to the rules of conduct ought to occur… and I tried it for posts that were from persons who are liberal and others who were conservative… But, I admit it doesn’t work… Allowing it to go on does detract from the value of the blog in the eyes of anyone who happens upon the blog… and my guess is that there many persons who do do that and who do not post messages…

” I saw no humor. Don’t laugh.

“self deprecation” I have noticed that sometimes after posting here that hair grows in my hands?

“I have noticed that sometimes after posting here that hair grows in my hands?” Did it afffect your vision?

Keep Waco Green? God sure has a sense of humor and she s just getting funnier every day. Dear Sojo, You can see that most of the comments on this blog that are supportive of what you’re doing come from people who come from more liberal mainline denominations (they are not evangelical). If you are really trying to broaden your appeal and win evangelicals over, you will not make references to the “she-god.” Most evangelicals (not just the conservative types) will find it offensive.

Jesse, I don’t mean this as a taunt… I’m very disappointed that this blog has turned out to be so pathetically filled with taunts… I just wonder if God “the Father” is properly typified as male? Isn’t God “the Father” a spirit… and wasn’t God “the Son” a spirit prior to becoming a human?

Exxon Mobile still doesn’t believe in Gobal Warming and niether does the devil. So how soon can we start putting solar panels on the hood of our cars or filling up at the greesy spoon with our diesels. You know that that is what the diesel engine was originally designed to do until it was deep sixed by the petroleum industry. And it runs cleaner and quieter than a gasoline engine. On top of that the vegi oil gets the same millege and even smells better. I saw it on CA Green on KCET. Look at what Texans like to eat. They could run a fleet on recycled fast food oil. Don’t you get any Sun or Wind out in Texas? Go Baptist Go! We could use about 2.3 mill Texans who claim to be the sons of Noah.

How was the diesel engine deep-sixed by the petroleum industry? It’s not popular for cars because of soot and the fact that American car manufacturers made lousy diesel models. Why does everything have to be a conspiracy?

I owned a 5 cylinder Deutz diesel that ran 24/7 365 for 5 years, the only time we stopped it was to change oil. After 5 years we rebuilt it mainly with new sleeves and back to work. The US auto makers did not have to build poor diesel engines, in fact Cummins and Detroit Diesel produced fine diesel engines. What was the disconnect with auto manufacturers?

The disconnect was that we, the consumer made no demands for better vehicles; we’ve gotten exactly what we deserve.

Mike, I don’t believe God is literally a male. Nor do I believe he is human, for that matter. However, God chooses to speak of himself with human qualities, Father being one of them. I don’t mean to say that God has no feminine qualities (he does), but referring to himself as “Father” relates to his personal-ness and desire for a relationship with us. I refer to him as Father, firstly, because that’s how the Bible refers to him (including Jesus, who was breaking social conventions left and right), and something of such great importance should not be messed with.I also believe that referring to God as “she” or “mother” detracts from his personal-ness. It is impossible for us to conceive of someone/something as both Father and Mother, she and he. God chose to call himself “Father” because it gives us an idea of what he is like using concepts we know and see. It affects how we can interact with him. As I said, I’m not going to mess with that.

“The disconnect was that we, the consumer made no demands for better vehicles; we’ve gotten exactly what we deserve.” Toyotas?

jesse, Thank you! My approach is to go with what I can make sense of, factoring in all that I’ve been taught and all that I’ve experienced in life. I think the text of scriptures reflects human thinking at the time it was written. By saying that I mean no disrespect. I’m just sharing how I think. I value what my parents thought, which probably coincides with your thinking on this aspect of beliefs. And I value your thinking on this and your openness in sharing that thinking. Everyone, I hope this blog can do more and more of that. And less and less of the mean spirited things that have been said up to this point… by liberals and conservatives. And, thinking of my Irish father and his humor, we can’t try to figure out “who shot John”. We’ve all written things that we wish we hadn’t.

Consumers do make demands with the money they spend. I will not buy a Prius just to make me feel good. I believe they cost more to produce, drive like heck, are too small for my needs (can’t pull a 20′trailer full of equipment) and, what are they going to do with those batteries when the car is junked?”diesel engine was originally designed to do until it was deep sixed by the petroleum industry” The diesel was designed by Otto Diesel to originallly run on coal dust or peanut oil. A diesel is great for long haul and fleet vehicles that stay on the road constantly, but a gas engine is best for most daily uses. Gas engines are better and cleaner than ever. The new HEMI from DaimlerChrysler shuts off four cylinders when at highway speeds to save fuel, but runs on all eight when accelerating. The coal fired plants burn cleaner than they used to. They are not the old nasty plants spewing thick, black smoke from ominous looking smoke stacks. Clean coal technology is doable and on the horizon. Many of the coal fired plants from the 50′s and 60′s are nearing the end of their lives and something needs to be done. Unless you’d rather sit in the dark looking at a blank computer screen? Again, I ask what about nuclear power? I used to work at the South Texas Nuclear Project. And after seeing how the place was built, I’d say without a doubt (and considering the US has a pretty good safety record) that I would be behind the construction of new nukes! All of this doom and gloom to scare me ain’t working. I have a 71 GTX in my garage that gets about 9mpg and you’ll have to pry the shifter from my cold, dead hands!!!

fasternu, Maybe I’m wrong. I don’t know whether the areas of Texas where these new power plants would be built meet air quality standards and whether current planning shows that they would continue to meet standards for the future with the construction of these new power plants. Is the the Texas power industry planning to demonstrate that air quality standards will be met at design operation and also planning to use control technology required by the Clean Air Act in these new power plants? If Clean Air Act requirements are satisfied, can’t the power industry build these new power plants? Hasn’t there been a problem with getting communities to accept nuclear waste disposal near them? I’m not sure whether the site in Nevada has passed all the hurdles… I do hope no one will deny you the right to tow your trailer or to take away your car! As Big Russ would say… what a country!

Toyotas? No we have big fat gas guzzling cars. Manufacturing and capital are leaving the country like rats from a sinking ship and we are spending our wealth and reputation on silly if not illegal war.

I expressed my concern about our future to my youngest son. He said being 3rd or 4th in the world wouldn t be so bad sort of like France is now. Not what we were but not so bad so don’t worry about your grand kids.

Not on topic, but… If you have the chance, watch “Tim Russert” (not “Meet The Press”, but the program named “Tim Russert”) this weekend. Tim has Frank Luntz on the second half of the program, the author of “It’s Not What You Say, It’s What They Hear”. This is a way that most of us can get the concept from this consultant about messaging. It helps us understand how important the choice of word is… for framing issues. He is as close as a conservative side of liberal George Lakoff (Moral Politics: How Liberals and Conservatives Think”) comes. It’s very helpful, for our understanding of messaging and framing and words. He is passionate about use of language… his most memorable speech was Bobby Kenedy upon the death of Martin Luthe King. Don’t miss it!

butch, Your youngest son sounds like a very wise person… as you suggest, may his son be wiser yet!

Being 3rd or fourth? Is that the goal of the left? To be 3rd or 4th? Let’s just give up all together and become 50th! Then we won’t feel guilty. Who would you rather see 1st? China? Russia? The EU? What is so wrong with being the best you can be? It’s like playing sports and not keeping score, why bother? Guilt is not a good motivator, being the best is. Not at the expense of someone else mind you, but there is nothing wrong with it. Is there a passage in the bible I missed where Jesus says “blessed are the last for they shall receive a consolation prize”?? “No we have big fat gas guzzling cars” Please don’t try to modify my behavior so you can feel like you have accomplished something.Texas actually has pretty good air quality. Houston has lots of industry and, yes, it is worse that other ares of the state, but we gotta make the fuel you guys use in your Prius! Worse than Houston’s air, in the spring, there’s a large plume of smoke that comes over our area and they give warnings to those with respiratory ailments to stay inside. The cause, Mexican farmers south of the border burn their fields so they can plant. It’s so big you can see it from space. Weather satellites show this grey smoke trail coming north. Now, Why isn’t anyone up in arms about that? I think it’s Dick Cheney and Halliburton’s fault.BTW has anyone said anything about Nancy Pelosi wanting us to buy her an airplane?? So much for her “carbon footprint”

fasternu, I think the possibility of ending up third or fourth happens just because other nations grow stronger over the course of time, as history shows, over and over. It’s not a case of slacking off, it’s a case of one nation’s best not continuing on forever to be the best best. People in France are pretty comfortable… and Britain… and Italy… and Greece… and on and on… The Irish apparently never were number one… but they’re doing quite well, also!

“Please don’t try to modify my behavior so you can feel like you have accomplished something.” Our behavior is the future, so stay on a bad course. but we gotta make the fuel you guys use in your Prius!You also make the fuel we waste! No one changes course until they get in enough pain on the path they are on.

“I think the possibility of ending up third or fourth happens just because other nations grow stronger over the course of time, as history shows, over and over.” Our position changes because of forces outside our control is one thing, if we bring it about by our behavior is another.”Waste not want not.”

Mike Hayes, People in France are pretty comfortable… Some are, but many aren’t, and those that aren’t are growing increasingly hopeless. My niece married a Frenchman. Once they married, she moved there and they had two children. After intending to stay and raise their family in France, they have now moved to the US. My niece’s husband has some very interesting things to say about why he would leave his native country for the US even though he speaks little English. They don’t bode well for France’s future, if half of what he says is true.

timks, Thanks for the information. Also, some persons in the US have no home and have a shortened lifespan from exposure to harsh weather. My point is that there is a wide span of experiences in western economies… but we all have access to safe drinking water. All the western countries have a great proportion of citizens who are very comfortable… compared to citizens of countries which have a daily per capita income of less than $1… so, being in France or Britain or Italy and so on is not much different than living in the US… today… Being third or fourth isn’t a problem… Everyone, Not on topic… Mike Huckabee of Arkansas who is a candidate for the Republican nomination for president in 2008 appeared on “This Week” today and speaks of the need for communication by the US government with moderate Muslims to counter the influence of radical Muslims. He also supports reverence for life after a child is born… assistance to women who need help because they are not getting adequate support by the male who impregnated them, for example… And… he has a great sense of humor! My point is… we might have a great opportunity to select from some great candidates for president for 2008… if we get out there and vote in the primaries… I take a ballot for one party and my wife takes a ballot for the other party… and then we switch places in the next primary… to keep the party pros guessing… May I live to see the day that primaries disappear and we get to vote for all the candidates and vote by ranking all the candidates… I can hope…

“May I live to see the day that primaries disappear and we get to vote for all the candidates and vote by ranking all the candidates…” How then, would you determine the candidates? Do you want a ballot featuring the names of 1,000 some odd folks who have an interest in being President?

“My point is… we might have a great opportunity to select from some great candidates for president for 2008…” I am intrigued to see how Giuliani will do. He’s the one candidate from either party who has a track record of real, demonstrable change. Obama has better stop babbling about hope and start meaning something, or Hillary’s going to chop him up and feed him to that crazy Edwards’ blogger. Personally, I wanna see Kucinich take the Dem nomination. That little dude is bananas.

[I also believe that referring to God as "she" or "mother" detracts from his personal-ness. It is impossible for us to conceive of someone/something as both Father and Mother, she and he. God chose to call himself "Father" because it gives us an idea of what he is like using concepts we know and see. It affects how we can interact with him. As I said, I'm not going to mess with that.] It is also impossible to truly understand God as ‘One’ and also as ‘Three’. Yet, Christians have mostly accepted the doctrine of the ‘Trinity’, even though we don’t ‘understand’ it. God as ‘Father’ works well for me; but ocassionally, ‘Son’ shakes me and reminds me that what I think I know and what I choose to see is not what the’Father’ knows and sees. In God’s image we were created male ‘and’ female. Truly, God speaks to us in ways that we can understand. The true message of Pentecost is that when we follow the ‘Spirit’ we will also communicate to others in ways that ‘they’ understand. To see God as ‘Father’ ‘Son’ ‘Spirit’ ‘Wonderful’ ‘Counselor’ ‘Mighty’ ‘Love’ or even ‘She’ are all ways that, in my opinion, God gets personal with us. God uses concepts we know to show us what we don’t know; to renew our minds; to help us start thinking as God thinks.

Mike, Being third or fourth isn’t a problem… I agree. There’s always some level of subjectivity with these rankings, anyway. My point was not who’s number one, but to encourage all of us to understand what the highest ranking countries have in common that resulted in their high rankings, if anything. I believe they do have certain things in common. I’m not saying this applies to anyone in particular, but I have seen some here endorse the idea that the US should become “more like Country X” in many ways without understanding or thinking about what that really means. Regarding the 2008 (off)topic: personally, I am taking a vacation from all the Presidential fol-der-ol until this time next year.

“Being third or fourth isn’t a problem…” I think it would be good for the US.

“Regarding the 2008 (off)topic: personally, I am taking a vacation from all the Presidential fol-der-ol until this time next year.” By which time the nominees of both parties will be determined.

Mike Hayes | 02.11.07 – 12:10 am | #3rd or 4th – so who would be 1st, 2nd and 3rd?If we are 4th – does that mean we don’t have to be the major contributor to the UN financially? We don’t have to be the world bread basket? We don’t have to be the world’s police? This might be an OK… Later .

By which time the nominees of both parties will be determined. kevin s. | Homepage | 02.11.07 – 7:01 pm | # I’m pretty sure I can live with that, and enjoy myself in the meantime.

kevin, Californians didn’t have much difficulty ignoring the 150 or so candidates in the recall election several years ago and focusing on the few serious candidates in a “select one of these” type ballot. A ballot based on voting by ranking is in use in a number of places… the advantage is that everyone gets to make a choice among all the candidates… not just those who are selected by the party faithful in the prinaries… which (I think) results in less of a choice. For example, in 200 we could have had a choice among Bill Bradley, George W. Bush, Al Gore, and John McCain, plus the third party and independent candidates, instead of a choice just between George W Bush and Al Gore and the third party and independent candidates. http://www.fairvote.com/ explains the process for persons who are interested.

timks, Thanks. I think it is difficult for us living in wealthy countries to appreciate how fortunate we are. I do hope more of us will think of ways to beat the system (that requires us to declare party affiliation in many states) in order to vote in primaries… I think alternating between a republican ballot and a democratic ballot (in those states which allow that to occur) prevents party pros from nailing us one or the other, when it is important to do that… and when spouses do that it makes it even more difficult for the “gerrymanderers” to do their job and create “safe” districts…with no real competition among candidates in elections…

Mike, But then our president is essentially determined by whichever prominent ideology has the least representation (if you limit the rankings to 2-3 candidates), or a complicated backdoor bargaining game combined with the vagaries of game theory (if there is no limitation). No system is perfect, but I don’t see how this is inherently better. This is a popular issue on the left, of late, because many Democratic candidates have fallen victim to third party candidates who have taken a disproportionate number of votes from their party.

Will we embrace nuclear power? You mean like the South Texas Nuclear Project? Caroll Rylander said, ” it will make electricity too cheap to meter.” “It will be the last power plant South Texas will ever need.” Now Coal proponants are telling us that a bunch of new Coal plants will be cleaner? BS The STNP hasn’t even generated enough power to pay for itself. It doesn’t even generate enough power to power one city the size of Corpus Christi much less CC, Houston, and Austin like ti was supposed to. We’re gonna miss you Molly.

It is obvious the author has a problem with Texas and Texans. It is also obvious that she has never been to Waco or the South Central Area of Texas. Texas is hot but a huge portion of the state is not dry.Shame shame Sojourners for allowing this unintelligent biased article to be released. Have some integrity. We are progressive Christians, but that also means not judging a whole state of people or pointing the finger at other Christians just because we are unhappy with some politicians that have come out of there.

The Bible was written in a particular culture and time. Jesus called 12 male disciples because that was the cultur of the day. However, he valued women and taught them as in the story of Mary and Martha, the woman at the well. When women were allowed in seminary and to be ordained and when women were allowed to be teachers in seminary and to be bishops, no longer were our voices silent in the shadows as unnamed women, someone’s sister, mother, daughter, wife, concubine. We had a name and a voice. Thank God. Up until that time we had only the male voice interpreting the faith for us. When women were allowed to sit at the tables of discussion, preach from pulpits and write in theological publications, then light poured into the texts and it was never the same again. Our voice has been heard. So yes She has a sense of humor and those who sense it, know it, feel it, see it, like Molly Ivins and Rose Marie Berger, take their shoes off because they know they stand on holy ground. Rev. Sara Hardaway

Kevin, Those of us who wish we could avoid the influence of the two party system would welcome voting by ranking. With the primary system we now have, we “two party system opponents” do not have a “full vote” for selecting all the candidates we will have a chance to select from in the final election. In most states we can only vote for a candidate of one party or the other. In Illinois we have “half a vote” in the primary. A few states allow voters to select two candidates from all those running in the primaries. I would prefer voting by ranking all the candidates, because then I can choose from among all the candidates.And, a winner will get a majority of the votes cast. http://www.fairvote.com/ explains the process for persons who are interested.

“Jesus called 12 male disciples because that was the cultur of the day.” On what evidence do you say this? Are you saying that Jesus denied the opportunity to better qualified women just to fit in with culture? That doesn’t make any sense at all. Just throwing “oh that’s just culture” at something doesn’t make it so.

kevin s. | Homepage | 02.13.07 – 12:46 pm | #Just throwing “oh that’s just culture” at something doesn’t make it so. Well stated – with that type of logic – we could dismiss all of scripture. Later .

It was the culture of the day. Why not have the savior be a woman? Jesus operated in the culture he found himself in and yet at the same time challenged its prejudices and unfairness and lack of equality. In that culture he called women in the way he found accessible to him and in challenging ways as well. Today I think God would have come as perhaps a woman. who really knows for sure. Do the critical investigation and literary criticism. Geeeee

No one is saying dismiss all of scripture based on “that was the culture of the day” but you cant deny the fact jesus was born in to a particular culture and that is the reason he did not pick women as part of his first line disciples and the reason the catholic church refuses to ordain women – the disciples were men. Because you say Jesus operated in his culture does not imply you dismiss him, his mission or scripture at all. you have to know why the texts were written, to whom, the original intended meaning and then ask how does that speak to us today in a different culture and climate.

Jesus was not of the culture at all. He would have made women disciples if women were to lead the church. The notion that God simply made gender decisions to please people is absurd. God’s goal was not to please people, but to redeem those who come to repentance through his son on the cross. Believing so does not mean I have not engaged in critical investigation or literary criticism. There is no compelling evidence that Jesus chose his disciples based on a desire to remain consonant with cultural norms.

Kevin – of course he was. God used that culture to bring forth the savior which does not mean jesus did not challenge cultural norms. Jesus was a male Jew – not a nongender nonrace entity from out of the sky. God did not make gender decisions to please the church. It is obvious you have only been exposed to and open to a one sided male biased reading of the text and yes it is important to the historical cricital context work of the scriptures or else you end up with isogesis instead of exegsis. and at best a very distorted picture of Jesus and his mission.