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Scot McKnight is a widely-recognized authority on the New Testament, early Christianity, and the historical Jesus. He is the Karl A. Olsson Professor in Religious Studies at North Park University (Chicago, Illinois). A popular and witty speaker, Dr. McKnight has given interviews on radios across the nation, has appeared on television, and is regularly asked to speak in local churches and educational events. Dr. McKnight obtained his Ph.D. at the University of Nottingham (1986). Click to continue reading Scot McKnight's Bio...
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I question her finding that adolescent girls do not have a self-esteem problem. Having been an adolescent girl once, having experienced first hand the textbook drop in self-worth once I hit 13, having talked with many peers and younger women who have felt the same, I don't buy it. I don't have empirical evidence, just experiential, but I've read and seen and felt enough to know for myself that it is true.
Take one look at the advertising industry, designed to make women feel too fat/ugly/inferior/inept in order to make us weak enough to buy whatever crap they are selling, and it's not hard to imagine where a self-esteem problem might come from. Add in a culture determined to value women only for their sexual appeal, tell a girl from the time she hits puberty until she dies that if she's not sexually desirable, she's not worth anything, and, well... seriously? She doesn't think that girls have a self-esteem problem?
Twenge and I would probably have a similar solution to the problem, however. Rather than trying to build a false self-esteem which will eventually fail, it would be better to take kids out of the toxic environment, and build true self-esteem based on something real.
If I recall correctly, she more than thinks we should focus on self-control and self-discipline, she cites data [amidst excessive anecdote, RJS : )] indicating that it leads to better life outcomes.
I think this is foundational to her point that self-esteem should be a product, not a pursuit. She's not arguing that our value comes from achievement, but that developing our gifts and talents makes us feel good about ourselves naturally.
Scot, how do you propose taking kids out of the toxic environment?
I agree with Melissa. Everybody hates middle school, and most of high school, because everyone feels fat and awkward and uncool. Plus, you're supposed to have high self-esteem, so you feel bad about yourself for feeling bad about yourself.
I agree, though, that grade inflation is a problem.
Crops are raised and children are reared. Perhaps Jean's confusion of the two verbs gives some insight into how GenMes view the role of parents. Probably not. :)
While I find minor fault with Jean's grammar, I agree with her on more substantive matters, namely her assessment that self-esteem is best seen as an outcome and not as a cause. That's a good distinction.
I know with our second grade daughter we recently stopped telling her how smart she is and began emphasizing how hard she is working. Intellect isn't something to be proud of, but hard work is something one can control and should feel good about. The parable of the talents comes to mind. I want my daughter to feel deservedly good about her choices and her character.
To Melissa's point about how our society is toxic to self-esteem, I agree. I would add that getting one's esteem from distant sources (from curricula written by some well-meaning educator or from the advertising industry) seems inherently shaky. Building kids' self esteem on something real makes it easier (though not automatic) for them withstand the onslaught of worthlessness that comes from within and from without.
Scot, thanks for making us aware of this book. It is now on my must read list. I have not been able to read all of the comments from previous posts in detail, so forgive me if this has been addressed before:
It is interesting that today we have a Calvin post about fall/depravity and a post on unhealthy self-esteem. I wonder if these two forces are influencing theology today. It does seem that many in the emerging/postmodern/whatever-you-want-to-call-it camp have a hard time with total depravity. In fact many (perhaps Pagitt and S. Burke), hold to the goodness of humanity rather than the sinfulness of humanity. Come Calvinists, as you mentioned yesterday, are strongly reacting against this.
Because the emerging movement is generally younger in age, is Twenge providing us a sociology of emerging that helps explain their theology?
That any human would consider themselves inherently "lovable" - irrespective of any accomplishment or specific "good" trait is a good thing, not a bad thing. Why is it so important to the author that entering college freshmen know where they stand in the academic rankings? Of course an inexperienced "new student" will have an over-inflated sense of their own ability - that is what we should hope for them. Just as a sense of accomplishment comes with life experience, so does the virtue of humility. One should not expect a sense of humility from a baby first learning to walk. Indeed, we hope the baby just knows they can do it, despite all evidence to the contrary. It sounds to me like this author has the idea that self esteem is something that can or should be earned. I think that is wrong minded. - does God love you because you are good? - does God want you to be good because God loves you? - when you are good are you "earning" God's love?
I think Brian (5) is on to something worth thinking about, as is Patrick (6).
When I read the excerpt from Calvin, my first thought was, "Wow, he goes way beyond the text (esp. for a Calvinist! :))." No more image of God left, huh?
The issue of "made in God's image" is relevant to Scot's question: "How do we teach self-esteem without it turning into self-preoccupation, self-importance, or narcissism?" If the "we" is public schools, they cannot. People--not just me--matter because they matter to God. This also fuels the right approach to what we do and how well. Of course, how are schools run by the state going to teach this foundation of value? They cannot. And performance alone is not a sufficient substitute--not even close. Who wants to adopt (or give to one's children) a self-value based on performance alone? Do I want my children's teachers to only value children based on the child's performance? How can this lead to proper love of self, of neighbor, of enemies?
Yet more evidence showing that the state as we've constructed it is simply a very poor choice to operate schools, yet we persist.
T,
This has permeated our church though. When my kids were younger I worked in and led a Wed. evening program for K-1 kids - for 9 years. The curriculum we used emphasized that we should play no games with a winner or a loser in any fashion - because this damaged the self-esteem of the loser.
Even Duck, Duck, Grey Duck (which I found that uninformed Michiganders thought was Duck, Duck, Goose - who knew?) was out because it entails an element of competition. Relay races and team competitions were forbidden. Now I do think that it is important that we don't overemphasize winning and losing - but come on.
We did not follow the curriculum on this but did play some games with winners and losers (even had Candy Land and Mousetrap on game nights).
She is exactly on target with this. I remember when our four kids, all 80s children, were being taught this self-esteem stuff in school. I told them then, "Yep, you're special-- just like everyone else in the world."
This, coupled with a theology that still teaches children (& adults) that they should "expect God's favor" has helped create the entitlement mentality that saturates our culture in and out of the church.
Real esteem comes from serving others, not inflating our own self worth.
Brian @ 5,
I don't think you can chalk the emerging church up to age. I suspect the militant neo-Reformed folks Scot had in mind with that earlier post are in fact young people. And many if not most of the faces of the emerging church (for the moment) are middle aged.
As far as total depravity, if it means what Calvin says here, that the image of God is totally obliterated, then I don't believe in it. Damaged, marred, infected by sin, sure. But not destroyed. To bear the image of God is what it means to be human. To bear the scar of sin is what it means to be fallen. T (7) is on the money here. "Total obliteration" -- that's just not what the text says.
T, I get that public schools may not be the best of all worlds, but are they really worse than a world where only the rich are educated? I agree, we shouldn't be leaving it up to schools to instill our children with self-worth. But you don't have to home-school (which comes with it's own set of problems) to do that.
RJS,
Duck, Duck, Grey Duck?
It's Duck, Duck, Goose.
RJS,
No doubt, the Church often attempts to incorporate at least what the social sciences are telling us, for good and for ill. :) But I don't think that changes the fact that the answer to Scot's question re: teaching the proper value of self, others, etc. lies in a proper understanding of God, or even reality as a whole, and no where else. Even though the Church herself often fails in this proper understanding, or even in appreciating its centrality to this and other issues, where else can we go for answers for proper human value than the One who made it all?
Travis,
I'm not at all opposed to the state taking from all via taxes and paying for every child's education; I'm actually quite for it. It just needs to get out of the business of operating schools (with state actor-teachers, due process concerns, first amendment content issues, political games, bureaucratic inefficiency, long or incoherent lines of accountability, etc., etc.) and into the business of giving over-funded scholarships to each child. The state is a fantastic subsidizer of industries. It's a terrible operator of industries, especially where the industry necessarily involves values, idea/content selection, and the discipline of children. We've given the state a job it is terribly, terribly hampered to perform, like teaching children how to properly value themselves and others (but, P.S., don't violate the First Amendment!).
Travis (#10). You are correct, emerging is not primarily an age thing (Robert Webber was proof-positive). But many of the faces are my age (36) which means we were educated in the 80s so the timeline may fit.
Regardless, the emerging theologies really resonate with younger generations (young and white) which are the subject of this concern for narcissism. I'm just wondering if that is a contributing factor for both many of its leaders and how well emerging theology has been accepted by young people. No sin preaches!
Travis and Brian in 5, 10 and 14 - if the iGens are the way they are in part because of emphasis by their Boomer parents on teaching them self esteem, focusing on their individuality, etc. . . . wouldn't it make sense (rather than be disproof of the generational theory) that some of the visible "parents" of the emerging movement would be Boomers? The emerging "theologies" being roughly analogous to the "theories" of education such as self esteem movements - initially started by certain Boomers but then picked up on by the next generation?
Brian,
You may be onto something as far as the correlation, but I suspect the relationship is more complicated than it may seem. I think emerging theology is drawing us younger folks because we're sick of the individualism and self-centeredness of our culture (sadly, including many of our churches) and hungry for authentic mutually-submissive community, not because we're all narcissists clutching our participation trophies and whining about our needs.
T,
Good point, although I'm wary of the extreme school choice/voucher position. I'd like to see it experimented with on a small scale some more. But my point remains the same: sending your children to public school means giving the state the job (with your help) of teaching your kids about math and literature, not the job of teaching them "how to properly value themselves and others". I agree that if we're doing this, we're putting too much trust in public education.
Karl, same as with Brian, I think you have the causal relationship backwards. Individualism/focus on one's own needs are symptoms of the modern church. The postmodern/emerging church is partly a reaction against that, in my opinion.
Travis, I didn't mean to focus on particular traits as much as point out that the fact that the initial tone-setters for the emerging movement were Boomers, doesn't automatically mean that the sociology of the emerging movement isn't also closely related to at least some of the sociology of iGens. The broader socialization of iGens was so influenced by Boomer trends - yes iGens (and emergers) are often in reaction against certain Boomer traits but they also unavoidably influenced by the choices Boomer educators and culture-shapers made when creating the millieu they grew up in.
I'm not saying Brian McLaren et al are just peddling self esteem curriculum for the church. It's a lot more complicated than that.
I don't think anybody has mentioned Chap Clark and his research--especially the book "Hurt" I've heard him speak several times--the latest was last month. He finds that our youth feel abandoned.
Melissa,
I don't think she denies that girls have low self-esteem; she just says their situation is no different than teenage boys.
I recently read Augustine's thoughts on the subject. He said we need to see how valuable we are to God lest we fall into despair and how sinful we are lest we fall to pride.
"To God" is the key point there. If our kids "feel good about themselves" because they're pretty or smart or talented, it leads to pride. If they are taught that they are of inestimable value because they are created in the image of God and personally loved by Him, that leads to seeing your worth as nothing inherent in you.
Karl @ 18,
Then we agree.
ChrisB, "we need to see how valuable we are to God lest we fall into despair and how sinful we are lest we fall to pride"
Exactly.
Whenever I hear talk about self-esteem, I think of the Disney movie "The Incredibles". There is this wonderful exchange between the mother and her son Dash - whose super hero power is super speed. She is reminding her son that "everyone is special" and his response, complete with a pout, is "which means nobody is special".
Perhaps she uses "raised" intentionally? I see many parents wanting to be friends with their children, giving the youngest members of their family multiple choices and equal say in what the family will do. People really are raising their children to equal status.
Over-inflated grades matter. My daughter is in middle school, and I am frustrated to no end. She has had teachers give her extra credit for bringing in her supplies. I am completely serious. She received extra points for bringing in Kleenex. Isn't that special? So she raised her grade a bit. Does it matter? Does she feel better about herself? At least there is Kleenex in the room.
Travis and Karl, thanks for your input. And I agree with Travis that the primary impetus of the emerging church is a reaction to the many errors of the modern church. So I'm not sure how strong the correlation is between igens and the emerging church, but I think there is something there. Just as there is something about Hybels and his generation that influenced Willow Creek. Culture impacts how we think of God and the church...on this point postmodern thinking is spot on.
I am not sure I understand who the audience is for this book? It sounds very "white bread" or "suburban" to me, and like there are some broad general statements applied to "everyone." This sounds like one of those books by and for white people. From my standpoint, it only addresses part of the K-12 American culture.
I have not read the book; have only read this discussion board. So, I do not like to think this is an exhaustive study either. Correct me if I am wrong.
Further, I know from my studies in higher education, significant numbers of young women decline in their self-esteem/self-worth/self-confidence during their college years. Many do not persist through in the math and sciences...so I do not agree with her broad swath statements.
God looked at what he created and called it good. There's the foundation for self esteem.
I've been critical of some of the discussions in other posts on Twenge's book, but I found this one helpful -- particularly the points about teaching our kids to find self esteem in being created in God's image, and in doing the things he has tasked us with doing. My wife and I have young kids, and we struggle with how to balance the way we build self esteem in them. We try to do things like following the rules of board games, even if it means our daughter loses. And praising them for a job well done, but not all the time, and not excessively. We worry that we won't get the balance right, or miss issues.
It is interesting to juxtapose this post regarding self-esteem along side the other post regarding Genesis 2 and 3. My thoughts:
Some worry that the emphasis on self-esteem taught to the “Generation Me” (where we only play games with no winners, etc.) discourages achievement and undermines “real” self-esteem based on performance and outcomes. While this may be true from a worldly perspective, it misses the point from a Christian perspective. From a Christian perspective, whether or not my self-esteem is healthy or appropriate depends on the extent to which my self-esteem corresponds with this two-fold reality:
Reality # 1 (The Fall):
I am a sinner. The feeble arrow of my life “falls” pitifully to the ground. It does not even hit the target, much less the bulls eye in the middle of the target. In broader anthropological terms, the Fall is a metaphor for the enduring distance between the human condition in its evolutionary struggle to transcend its animal instincts and the teleological bulls eye of the human condition “in Christ”. In terms of Creation as a whole, the Fall is a metaphor for the distance between the state of the Creation in its frustration and futility (waiting with eager expectation) and the teleological bulls eye of the Creation “brought into the glorious freedom of the children of God”.
Reality # 2 (The Garden):
God loves me. As a member of the human race, I am the beneficiary of a Creation Covenant pursuant to which: (a) in addition to lovingly and graciously giving to Creation the ongoing gift of existence, God would give to Creation the perfect gift of God’s Self; and (b) all of Creation, by and through the “sons of God”, by and through Christ as their representative, would accept God’s gracious gift of God’s Self in perfect and transparent obedience and love, all to the glory of God. The Garden is a metaphor representing the fulfillment of this covenant -- the teleological bulls eye.
The only absolute value is God. The only value that exists in Creation is the purely subjective value that attaches to Creation by virtue of God’s covenants and dealings with Creation. God chose to enter into the Creation Covenant in sovereign freedom (i.e., “election”), from the foundation of the world (i.e., before I existed), knowing that the fulfillment of this Creation Covenant would come at a cost to God. Thus, my value, as a created being, is grounded in the sovereign, free and gracious election of God himself. Accordingly, my subjective value to God is impervious to the petty judgments of any created being, including the judgments of Satan and/or myself (which may be indistinguishable). This includes any mental exercise by which I attempt to define myself as “good” or as “evil”.
Thus, my attempt to get self-esteem by eating from the Tree of the Knowledge of Good and Evil is completely off the mark. When I judge myself as “good”, I deny Reality # 1. When I judge my self as “evil”, I deny Reality # 2 (for God does not love evil). Moreover, my attempt to get self-esteem from the Tree of the Knowledge of Good and Evil is inappropriate and unhealthy. It leads to endless cycles of self-serving judgment, self-defeating judgment, self-preoccupation, guilt, self-importance, defensiveness, self-hatred, and narcissism. It leads to death.
However, if my self-esteem is grounded in God’s love (the Tree of Life; Christ), I have no need to judge my self as “good” or “evil”. I can embrace the truth of Reality # 1 without feeling the need to defend myself. And I can stop searching for something in which to ground my worth or value or “goodness” and simply accept the truth of Reality # 2.
Thus, healthy and appropriate self-esteem, from a Christian perspective, is grounded in God, not in achievement, performance and outcomes. But this sort of self-esteem is not completely divorced from outcomes. Self-esteem that is properly grounded in God results from accepting God’s gracious gift of God’s Self (which includes the gift of God’s Spirit dwelling in us) which results in works of Love.
"In 2006, the average college student scored higher in narcissism than 65% of students in 1987."
I can't figure this out. How significant is it? If the average in 2006 is skewed by just a few highly narcissistic students, there could be fewer 2006 students rating themselves highly than the 35% who apparently did so in 1987. Can you give more details?
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