Here are some more thoughts on that paragraph on love I quoted from Andrew Sullivan’s “blogalogue” with Sam Harris.
A decade ago noted evangelical author Phillip Yancey wrote a book called What’s So Amazing About Grace. As the title suggests, it was about that monosyballic word – grace… the freely given and unmerited favor and love of God.
Yancey opens the book with a story told to him by a friend who worked with the poor:
A prostitute came to me in wretched straits, homeless, sick, unable to buy food for her two-year-old daughter. Through sobs and tears, she told me she had been renting out her daughter – two years old! – to men interested in kinky sex. She made more money renting out her daughter for an hour than she could earn on her own in a night. She had to do it, she said, to support her own drug habit. I could hardly bear hearing her sordid story. For one thing, it made me legally liable – I’m required to report cases of child abuse. I had no idea what to say to this woman.
At last I asked if she had ever thought of going to a church for help. I will never forget the look of pure, naive shock that crossed her face. “Church!” she cried. “Why would I ever go there? I was already feeling terrible about myself. They’d just make me feel worse.
Yancey continues:
What struck me about my friend’s story is that women much like this prostitute fled towards Jesus, not away from him. The worse a person felt about herself, the more likely she saw Jesus as a refuge. Has the church lost that gift? Evidently the down-and-out, who flocked to Jesus when he lived on earth, no longer feel welcome among his followers. What has happened?
Yancey’s sweep is too broad – there are so many “down-and-out” who do find their love, comfort, and grace in the arms of churches. But not enough. That should be a greater conviction to the church of Jesus Christ than fighting against abortion, gay marriage or any other “social issue.” Paul said it well – you can do anything but if you don’t have love your work is useless.
posted January 23, 2007 at 2:03 pm
David, your biggest problem like every Liberal/Progressive, is your picking and choosing of what Jesus fits your politics and social causes and which one doesn’t.People like Sullivan are less honest than Harris. Harris simply rejects God out of hand. Bingo it’s over. Let’s do lunch. Sullivan and his progressive ideology, says that Jesus was OK with going and sinning some more. Says that it is OK to support and encourage others to go and sin continually. Try to feed, clothe and help a person like Sullivan (the common humanist no matter what he “says”), and then tel him he’s got to “stop” sinning.You know WWJD. You will be labeled a homophobe, a bigot and a civil rights violator. No Christian is rejecting anyone David. Sinners reject repentance. Should we continue to feed, clother and “LOVE” these kinds of people? 100% yes! Should we allow them to influence and teach others??? Absolutely NO!!! Wake up David. Sam Harris is an honest skeptic. An honest rejecter, so to speak. A goof-ball no doubt. But at least he cannot hide in the Church and bring destruction on the brethren.Watch out for the yeast of the modern day “Progressive.”
posted January 24, 2007 at 4:16 pm
“That should be a greater conviction to the church of Jesus Christ than fighting against abortion…” I understand what you’re trying to say. But the fight against abortion is the fight to defend human life at all its stages and in all its forms. The sanctity of life, of creation, is an idea at the very heart of Christianity. We can’t ignore that.
posted January 25, 2007 at 8:14 am
One again the comments don’t refer to your entry at all but hijack the discussion. This post is not about Andrew Sullivan but about grace and a possible lack of it in the church today. To say that grace is lacking in the church is, IMO, a vast understatement. I grew up in the church, and we talked about grace all the time. Grace was the beginning and end of our theology. Grace made the top five list of right answers in Sunday school, along with Jesus, God, sin, and donuts. Just kidding about “donuts.” We talked about grace, but we didn’t really experience it and share it freely. Just to be clear, I haven’t walked away from my faith. The difference these days is that when I talk about grace I really find myself living in the midst of it (and hurting when I get caught up in old habits of guilt, manipulation, and power. It’s a dirty little secret (not so secret) that these are driving forces in churches, just as they are in (liberal, progressive, and conservative) society.Jesus seemed foolish the both the religious and political power brokers of his day, and between then they mowed him down. But Jesus was a haven and friend for sinners, who recognized that his place in society (being mowed down by everyone else) was very close to theirs. Check out a book by Stanley Hauerwas called “Resident Aliens.” He argues in one chapter that both Jerry Falwell and Reinhold Niehbur (a socially liberal theologian) function as two sides of the same coin. Society must have it’s extremes. The far right theologians and the far left theologians together balance and maintain the status quo. The way of Jesus is neither right nor left but radically different. It doesn’t merely make sense in society or balance with another opposing view.We cannot define ourselves by what we oppose except at risk of becoming part of it. I think you are on the right track by seeking to re-identify with Jesus.
posted January 25, 2007 at 8:16 am
Sorry about all the typos. If something doesn’t make sense, try changing a letter, e.g., “then” to “them” etc.
posted January 25, 2007 at 2:44 pm
Andy, Progressives, and especially “Liberals” do not believe in the Jesus of grace. They believe in “anything goes.” Grace covers a multitude of sins. It comes from a real Jesus, that really died for our real sins. Something Progressives and Liberals do not agree with. Their Jesus can not only change into a different person, with modern society, but can alter his gospel for social and political causes.Like for example, “marriage.” Jesus didn’t really mean for today what he meant for all-time.And sin and sinning? That all depends on your political party designation. In Liberal and Progressive minds (Democrats), you can be born with a congenital excuse to commit sins and not really sin.It’s all in the orientation you get about what Jesus really “is.”
posted January 25, 2007 at 3:28 pm
I believe the point of the post, and my comment, is not whether those of us who claim to follow Jesus “believe” in grace but about whether we live it out. Whether it’s a reality or just a theology we affirm for our own sake. As for me, the more I perceive the reality of God’s love, the more fearlessly loving I become. The more I see it’s all about Jesus and not about me. I don’t have any need to defend or wall myself off from sinners. The truth is, I feel a lot in common with “sinners” — more than I have in common with most religious people who seem so unaware of their sin (the reality of it) and therefore unaware of the reality of Jesus’ love. Paul said he was the worst of all sinners. I don’t want to claim that distinction, it sounds like bragging to use Paul’s words, but I get it. It’s not pretty either. But Paul’s point wasn’t to feel guilty; he was just in awe of genuine love. I know I’ve nothing to brag about except Jesus.I’m not “there” yet. For one thing, fear is like a bad habit that surfaces constantly — probably related to my focus drifting back to myself or when I compare myself to others. Nor am I always loving. But I can say honestly that this reality of God’s perfect love casts a glow on everyone I see.
posted January 25, 2007 at 9:45 pm
Andy, it’s so ironic that you accuse others of defining sin by their own set of standards, rather than hewing close to those standards that are (somewhat) clearly laid out in the bible. What else would you call throwing out half of the 10 commandments (“thou shalt not kill, unless the person does something *really* bad or you suspect they might become a terrorist someday”), while laser-focusing on one lower-level sin that is treated as a mere pecadillo in the Bible, and treating it as a high crime that merits excommunication. Look in the mirror, dude.
posted January 26, 2007 at 12:58 am
Who said I throw out those commandments? I can only assume you have lumped me with abortion, although I have said absolutely nothing about that. Dave made a statement at the end of his post that perhaps you are referring to. My comment is about knowing the reality of God’s love in Jesus. Please read my comment again and ask yourself what offended you so much.