Volunteering Works, Vouchers Don't

Since this administration is working to let go of programs that don't work, this sounds like one that should be let go according to your report, Rev. Lynn. I have never agreed with religious school vouchers being financed by the public's tax monies. Let's get a lot of things right during this administration that have been wrong for too many years.

Americans can volunteer for and/or donate to the charity of their choice; the government, however, cannot.

Jerry, I have worked for several non-profit groups in my lifetime. Not one of them received government money to support their mission in spite of the fact that each was filling a need in the community that the government did not fund.

Are you aware that Special Olympics, the group that sponsors high visibility athletic programs for people with disabilities, is a non-profit group and accepts no government money for its efforts?

Are you aware that UNICEF, the group that collects thousands of dollars to fight preventable diseases and abuse of children in third world countries, is a non-profit group that also accepts no government funding?

There are many other examples out there of groups that supply needs minus any funds from the government. If people see a genuine need that is not being filled in the community or in the world they will support a group that works to fill that need. I cannot tell you how many five dollar and ten dollar donations we received over the years right alongside the very few thousand dollar ones. Each donation was accepted with gratitude, including those small ones... and the work went on.

If there is a need for religious schools in your community you need to get busy. Set up a non-profit group to support them, make the case for them, raise funds from the entire community to support them, and be accountable to your donors for their success.

To date, abstinence only education has failed to prevent teen pregnancy, in fact exactly the opposite has occurred. There are still homosexuals coming out of the religious schools too, in spite of the fact that they have not been taught about the "homosexual lifestyle." Refusing to teach evolution has put religious school graduates out of the competition for jobs in science and medicine, but not every child wants to become a scientist or a doctor anyhow. We need good carpenters and plumbers, too.

So, if you honestly believe religious education is important, put your money and your efforts where your mouth is. If you build it, they will come. Right?

I have never heard of any proposed voucher program that would cover 100% of the cost of the average tuition in the area let alone everything else.

"You fear that some might learn about God but not about Homosexual lifestyles?"

It always comes down to sex, especially gay sex, with these religionists. They are OBSESSED with it. In their primitive, antiquated minds, sex is the all-important bugaboo. It never fails, they always bring it up. I thought "morals" would mean generosity, consideration, tolerance, refusal to kill or maim or bully, desire to help the oppressed or the poor...but apparently those are not as important as SEX and controlling SEX, especially GAY SEX, and demonizing SEX and the gay community.

If these religionists want their gawd and their fairy tale book imposed upon those who do not believe in them, they best get off their butts and find solid, concrete proof that their magical man in the sky is really there and hating all the same folks they hate.

Students in the DC Opportunity Scholarship Program have shown statistically significant progress in reading and the longer they are in the program, the better they are doing. And, repeated studies by the University of Arkansas, Georgetown University and others have shown very high parent satisfaction.

Eileen, many studies have been done on voucher programs and the only positive result any of them have cited is increased parent satisfaction. Parent satisfaction is not an academic goal.

So if there are statistics that show improved reading scores you need to cite those studies. You accuse Rev. Lynn of posting information that is factually wrong, yet you have posted statistical results that cannot be verified and please excuse me if I don't just take your word that they exist. Give me a link or tell me the specific name of that study, the date, who specifically conducted it, and the methodology they used.

I'm not trying to be difficult here. It's just that the study or studies you mention flies in the face of every other study that's been conducted on voucher programs and private schools, so if it has actually yielded different results I would really like to see it. And the Department of Education does issue a whole lot of studies!

Well, V, I imagine that parents are also satisfied with the amount of calls from teachers that they get about their child's progress or (more typically) lack thereof. A lot of parents claim that if teachers alert them as soon as the teachers see a problem beginning, the parents can work at home to remedy that problem. I've never seen it work in nearly twenty years of teaching, but that's what parents say. Other parents say that teaching is the teacher's job, and I suspect that is the more common response.

Like you, though, I also wonder what is happening with the "left behind" students. Private and parochial schools can choose not to accept some students who do not meet their standards. They also have no programs for special needs students, including students with disabilities. These days, with so many students being diagnosed as ADD or ADHD, or with a learning disability, one wonders. I'd have felt as if I had been dropped into seventh heaven if I had been excused from the need to teach these special needs kids, but I have to admit that these kids also wound up being among my favorites in the long run. Go figure!

We had a voucher proposal in my state several years ago. The vouchers would have given $4,000 a year to genuinely needy parents so they could have the same opportunities for private school education for their children as wealthier parents have. Thing is, the only schools that had sufficiently low tuitions were the Catholic schools. Private schools had tuitions of $10,000 - $15,000 a year, and the extra $4,000 vouchers would have been a useless drop in the bucket for genuinely needy parents unless they were willing to send their kids to Catholic schools. When that fact was pointed out, the legislator dropped his bill.

I agree with those who note the unconstitutionality of public funding for religious schools. The Court of Errors and Appeals reversed a Supreme Court finding in Evers v Ewing, that kids going to religious schools were entitled to ride publicly funded buses. Justice Jackson, dissenting from the (later overturned)Supreme Court decision, quoted Byron's Julia; "who, while whispering 'I will ne'er consent',-- consented." Such attempted incremental incursions have continued and must be rebuffed.
Beyond that, allowing religious schools to utilize different rules of conduct from public schools gives them a competitive advantage. If rules governing public education need to be changed, then we should do so within the framework of our existing public system. Religious education is to be completely self-supporting, without government assistance.

http://www.discoveringjesusfishing.net

Just because the DC voucher program has not worked the way it was anticipated does not mean that you can generalize the neutralness of this program to the numerous school voucher programs that are successful, Rev. Lynn. In order to generalize the results, the sample size would have to be much, much bigger and go beyond the scope of one program, statistically speaking.

There is no problem with using government funds to support private school programs for a neutral purpose such as the purchase of supplies for core subject areas (e.g. math, english, history) since these would need to be purchased anyways regardless of what type of particular school a child attends. Just because a religious school is chosen does not mean that all government funding should be blocked.

Christian schools are not brainwashing children, Boris. Who are you anyway? Did somebody realy hurt you badly that you have to put others down?
Pippy

No macaroni sales for me thankyou very much. Too many carbs and what about those chi teas with all the cornsyrup?

Pippy goes to church and enjoys long walks with her bestfriend, herself. Seeing how others fell off the turnip truck and decided to go yonder, with the sadistic smiling girl in the frontseat, whatever.
Some people find seeing others in pain, enjoyable. They will get there day

Let us not forget the people who go behind your back and then say that you can't do it because of this or that for whatever reason, while all the while they are trying to take your job away from you.

If people can't see through that, then I don't know what to tell them.

God save the queen and her countrymen.

Pippy L.

Christian schools are not brainwashing children, Boris. Who are you anyway? Did somebody realy hurt you badly that you have to put others down?

Ms. Longstocking, I beg to differ.

I attended a private Catholic school for the first twelve years of my education. Every class began with a Catholic prayer. The textbooks for each subject included references to Catholic teachings and so-called Catholic social principles. I later learned, in college, that a special edition of these textbooks - the Catholic school edition - was offered by each textbook publisher.

I also learned later that Catholic education specifically omitted any mention of the Holocaust in history or under any other disciplinary rubric. Even Catholic priests have expressed their sheer amazement that in their special priestly education they never so much as heard about one of the significant events of the twentieth century and one which might have helped them to understand and relate better in their interfaith work.

I understand that changes have been made more recently. Catholic school editions of textbooks now deal with issues like evolution while still maintaining still that the creation story is factual, and Catholic priests are taught about the Holocaust while at the same time that they are taught that Jews could have saved themselves by sensibly accepting Jesus as their saviour - something that is clearly not true.

Still, for you to claim that religious education does not "brainwash" children is totally false. Religious school education omits a lot, including any mention of the rich diversity of thought that characterizes Western civilization, not to mention the rest of the world. The rationale is "why teach about things that are obviously false when we - the churches - have the truth." This is the very definition of "brainwashing."

Any group that claims to have the final truth is predisposing its adherents to dismiss information contrary to that church's teaching and to label those who think differently as somehow inferior to themselves. And yes, that does hurt people who find out otherwise. They feel betrayed by those they trusted, and rarely learn to trust anyone again.

Believe he said "beat down"

Taylor Anne was what I was going to name my daughter, she would have been beautiful. Too bad they erased her.

Taylor Anne

Your Name
August 9, 2009 11:27 PM
Taylor Anne was what I was going to name my daughter, she would have been beautiful. Too bad they erased her.
Taylor Anne

Boris says: Who erased Taylor Anne exactly and why? What are you talking about? Who is Pippy? You remind me of Tony Perkins talking to his dead mother in "Psycho."

Okay I get it. You're nuts. I thought so. Everybody does.