The archbishop of Canterbury seems to have as much arrogance and unacceptance as a certain leader in Rome, the great Benny. How is it going to ruin a conference by having a gay bishop attend?? Isn’t Minn a part of the religion and a leader, since he is a bishop?
Politics is a mess, isn’t it? Actually Williams is just plain rude.

Williams is choosing political expedience over spiritual possibilities. He is saying that being gay is a greater modifier than being a faithful Christian, an ordained priest, and an authorized Bishop. I expect that Robinson would not agree with that prioritization. He has lost any chance at convincing the opposition that Robinson has any credibility. That is very unfortunate. I expected much more of Williams. It makes me wonder how long it will be until Archbishop Schorri will also be dis-invited and asked to stay home. I think that Archbishop Williams has simply further unraveled the cincture that once held them together.

Now, to be fair:
“Archbishop Rowan Williams’ office said he had also not changed his mind about refusing an invitation to Martyn Minns, a traditionalist U.S. priest who was consecrated as a bishop in the Church of Nigeria.”
So he’s being fair: both are breaking the Anglican Communion’s rules and traditions, both are being kept away. Though I don’t know if the Archbishop is taking the right approach to his attempted peacekeeping on the issue—not that I can tell what he _should_ do. The issue will have to be addressed sooner or later, in any event.
God bless.

Archbishop Williams said two interesting things: First, He said he has recruited professional help in trying to reach greater understanding between the U.S. Episcopal Church and its critics both at home and abroad.
Second, “I have said that a refusal to meet can be a refusal of the cross and so of the resurrection.” This being said for Archbishop Peter Akinola’s benefit.
Who are the people with the professional help he’s enlisting? That gets your imagination going. Some of his critics might say of the refusal of ‘cross and so of the reurrection’ statement that it could also apply to Archbishop Williams holding adamently to not inviting Bishop Robinson and Minns to the session held only every ten years. It would be good if they could handle this conflict as a sign of maturing as pastors and disciples as the American Episcopal leader Bishop Shori has.

This would all be funny if it were not so serious. Oh, wait, it’s serious to some people but not to the vast majority of people in the world. I’m sorry for those of you for whom this is serious, but this is funny.

The problem with Rev Minns is that in the USA, bishops are elected at diocesan conventions by representatives of each parish from within that diocese. And then, the bishop-elect must be confirmed by the House of Bishops which is made up of all the active and retired US bishops.
Rev Minns was consecrated as a bishop in the Church of Nigeria…yet, he is here in the USA.
So, there is a question as to his validity as bishop.
Peace!

Joey-
+Robinson was elected by his diocese and confirmed by the House of Bishops. So, there is no breaking of any rules.
Each province has it’s own set of rules that apply to the membership and clergy within that province.
Peace!

Rowan Williams is one of the best, most faithful denominational leaders that Christianity has seen in a long time. To be clear, the man personally has no moral opposition to homosexual unions, which is one of the reasons that many conservatives were afraid when he was first taking office a few years back. But Williams has proved to be no simple liberal, and he refuses to impose his own private opinion on communion as a whole. His handling of the whole incident has reflected his commitment to the tradition rather than to a political agenda, since his conviction is that the whole gay issue needs to be decided in councils and in conversation with the tradition, and not in any other way.

I can see why you would think it is funny, nnmns, actually it is pitiful-funny, if you believe in Christ. The reason I said that Minns and Robinson should be invited is that if they are looking for maturity in growing as Christians, this would be a good place to start. The rules an regulations from hundreds of yrs. ago in most Church Denominations need a severe updating.

Actually I am confident that one cannot be both an active homosexual and a Christian despite the opinions of the liberal new age Christians who are blind to the backlash of sin in the world today.
The mere fact that Williams figures he has some sort of command of the cross and the resurrection he flaunts his vanity.
The Bible says the gates of hell shall not prevail against the church, and right now the U.S.E.C. seems to be the gates of hell.
Whata confused bunch.

Actually I am confident that one cannot be both an active homosexual and a Christian despite the opinions of the liberal new age Christians who are blind to the backlash of sin in the world today. The mere fact that Williams figures he has some sort of command of the cross and the resurrection he flaunts his vanity.
The Bible says the gates of hell shall not prevail against the church, and right now the U.S.E.C. seems to be the gates of hell.

“Actually I am confident that one cannot be both an active homosexual and a Christian…”
Fortunately they can be an active homosexual and a good person, especially if they practice safe sex, as we all should.
As to being a Christian, no doubt some are as sure they are as you are sure they are not. I’d urge anyone to wise up and stop trying to be a Christian. When you realize there’s no invisible judge up there you find you have moral resources of your own and surely great relief that you don’t have to meet ancient mores like those made up millennia ago by people in a whole different situation and interpreted by people who want power over others.

cknuck-
No offense….however, it is not up to you to judge who can and can not be Christian.
My children would be hurt to know that you believe that their father can not be Christian. The children in the Sunday school class I teach would be very surprised that you hold this beief about me.
Let me assure you I am Christian….not by your grace…but, by our Holy Father’s grace.
I am by choice and faith…Christian. I am by God’s creation gay. The two are not mutually exclusive.
Peace!

cknuck: In your way of thinking it isn’t possible to be both a homosexual and a Christian. Fortunatley that isn’t the way it is. There are MANY men and women who are both Christian AND homosexual and are just as Christian as you seem to be. Some post on this site, and I totally believe that their god loves them just as much as yours does you.

I’m a priest, gay but celibate. I have chosen that life-style not because it conflicts with my faith, but because I view celibacy as a vocation. Some of my friends are also priests and living with gay partners. I support them wholeheartedly.

Malcolm-
That is great. I respect your choice to be celibate.
But, the question of the day is….are you Christian?
Peace!

The bible for those of us who are Christian and actually give credence to it is very clear and it is not a matter of judging. A celibate homosexual is not in sin but a practicing homosexual no matter what people might desire is in deliberate opposition to the word of God. And if you believe in the eternity my Lord spoke of it will never profit you, nor will it profit this world. It’s plain and simple just a little too hard for some to follow so they make adjustments.
John you are a pleasant fellow and probably a delight to your Sunday school kids but following Jesus is the only way to get into heaven and His instructions on marriage is very clear “A man, A woman. It’s Old Testament but Jesus felt need to say it again “for this reason…. A man his wife.” Ignoring it will not change it.
I can see a pagan disregarding His Word but not a true Christian.

Back when i lived near Washington DC there was a sure way to start up a conversation. That was to ask two different people who drive from there to New England how they get through New Jersey and New York City. Everyone had their won theories, explanations, justifications, and rationale. There were times when one of the drives or navigators would start to defend their choice and insist it was the best, evne the only way. Often we would simply remind them that each drivers and navigator makes their choices based on many pieces of information. Sometimes even interpretation of maps varied. None of them were wrong, simply different ways to get to generally the same place.
So why does relgion have to be more complicated than driving from DC to New England. cknuck, it is all well and good that you do not accept homosexuality. But it serves no one good to get dismissive and angry because someone else does. I think you would benefit from realizing that just as there are many routes to a given destination, the path toward god/God has many routes as well. Yours is not the only one. So it accomplishes nothing to be tell some people they are simply wrong. Otherwise you are like so many of my kindred on the Florida highways, driving slowly and blissfully down the road with your turn indicator flashing – obstructing the flow and misleading other drivers.

cknuck-
The verse to which you are alluding was a response to a question on heterosexual marriage. So of course, out Lord’s response was appropriate to the question.
The is no known record of a follower asking our Lord’s thoughts on gay marriage.
We can go in to the probably societial reasons he was not asked…but, neverless the question he was asked had to do with heterosexual marriage.
Peace!

Actually jest, I know your religion says there are many ways to God but the Bible does not and that is what Christians base their faith in the bible or they are something other than Christian.
Jesus said, “I am the way” He makes it very clear that “no man sees the Father but though Me.” So I don’t know what kind of religious potpourri you may be referring to but Christianity is clear and there is an instructional manual just in case folk try to put in their own stuff.
JQ you know all of the passages by heart that pertains to relationships and if Jesus didn’t say anything about bestiality because he never mentioned it, then does that mean it too is permissible? What HE did is to leave clear instructions on relationships, period. There is enough information to know what God requires of us. People will always try to capitalize on some perceived gray area to promote sin.

Malcom:
It is your decision to be a celibate priest and you happen to be gay, just like you have friends who are priests, and are also gay and have chosen to not be celibate. But there are those who feel that a gay man, who isn’t celibate isn’t Christian. Often wondered how those folks can speak for their God. Personally I think all priests should have a choise to remain celibate or not to be celibate, whether they are gay or straight.
Thanks for writing in. Is good to get the prospective of a person who is living the life of a gay priest.
cknuck:
It is interesting to see how differently you interpret your bible and how others do, on this subject. You are so sure you are correct and leave no wiggle room. No gay person is going to a sinner because they act on their love (or choose not to, like Malcom). Adult love encompasses all, no matter whether it is heterosexual love or homosexual love. Personally I think your god (as I have said before)loves all Her children. She doesn’t pick and choose. I’d prefer jestrfyl and JohnQ’s (and Henrietta’s) version of the Bible as well as my sister’s and a few other Christians. I don’t think God is hateful and condemming.

Your confirmation is appropriate. No need to interpret the Bible on this one ps its clearly stated. I only need to quote.

cknuck, that bible was interpreted in writing way before you started reading it, by someone who put his way of thinking into it, then a few decades some other little monk copied a copy he had and probably put his view into or accidently ( or on purpose) left something out, then some decades another little monk did the same…and this has gone on forever. How do you know that what you are reading is indeed what is TRUE! There is no way. Humans are fallible, and their coping skills are not accurate. So to rely on an ancient book to make your points on this and other godly subjects doesn’t prove that anyone’s god has been “quoted” accurately. I personally think that you use the bible, (that you think is accurate) is indeed your opinion, not your gods. She is your rational for thinking that homosexuality and homosexual priests are wrong .

When I 1st became a Christian, I had a hard time believing the verses on forgiveness applied to me, given the things I had done in my life.
Then I heard the testimony of a serial killer named David Berkowitz. (AKA Son of Sam.) And I heard God say: “If I can forgive him, what makes you think that I can’t forgive you?” And my relationship with God grew dramatically after that day.
So what does that have to do with this discussion? Simplly put, if you can’t be a sinner, and still be a Christian, then we’re all doomed. So if someone professes to be a Christian, I’ll believe them, and let Jesus be the judge. After all, he is qualified, and I’m not.
And while I agree that homosexuality is a sin, I’m way too busy addressing the sinful tendencies in MY life to judge the ones that may be in yours.

While it is true that man does the writing it is God who does the inspiring, so disagree with you ps. I have seen God move through the pen of a person way too many times and witness the miracle, it is something that I know. And also I’ve seen as the bible puts things that seemed right to a man be in the long run so wrong. Thank God for His Holy Spirit.

I wish for everyone the wisdom to receive God’s surprising grace this holiday season. I hope you will be open to the possibilities that may challenge you and move you in unexpected directions. You better watch our, your better not cry, you better not pout, I’m tellng you why, God’s “Gotcha” Grace is coming for you.

God does not create anyone gay that would go against his character. People choose to be gay saying God made you that way is your way of justifying your sin. The God you created for yourself may accept your gay lifestyle but the true God of the Bible does not no matter what you want to believe.
I don’t see the difficulty in this situation exclude the U.S. bishop from the meeting and get him out of the church. He is only leading his congregation astray.
Do you not know that the wicked will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived: Neither the sexually immoral nor idolaters nor aldulterers nor male prostitutes nor homosexual offenders nor thieves nor the greedy nor drunkards nor slanderers nor swindlers will inherit the kingdom of God. 1 Corinthians 6:9-10
Flee from sexual immorality. All other sins a man commits are outside his body, but he who sins sexually sins against his own body. Do you not know that your body is a temple of the Holy Spirit, who is in you, whom you have received from God? You are not your own; you were bought at a price. Therefore honor God with your body. 1Corinthians 6:18-20 If you are a true believer and truly saved you have the Holy Spirit and you will not make the decision to be gay. I am not stating this God is.

sarah:
How do you know God’s character? The answer I expect I’ll get is the Bible says. Well, that book was written by men (not women) and is so full of contradictions due to it’s centuries of interpretation, and copying that there isn’t much valid left, if there was anything valid to begin with. (which I doubt)
If your god was the creator off all people, then you must think He/She isn’t perfect and made a mistake when it comes to the creation of homosexuals. Isn’t your god perfect?
With the unfortunate attitude of some folks towards homosexuals, why would anyone choose to be gay/lesbian? Wouldn’t that be asking for trouble from those who find it “wicked?” No, homosexuals were born homosexual just like you were born heterosexual(I assume). They aren’t using any excuses for how they are, anymore than you are using an excuse for your heterosexuality, and they are no more sinners than you are. (don’t Christians think everyone is a sinner?)
Fortunately the U.S. Episcopal church doesn’t see things like you do, and realizes that their god is an accepting god of all Her creations, glbt. The gay bishop isn’t leading anyone astray, just doing his job as a leader in the church. His sexuality has nothing to do with his job.

cknuck,
“I only need to quote.”
It would help if you also understood. And if you were charitable (for the greatest of these is charity).
sara,
“God does not create anyone gay that would go against his character.”
How on earth would you “know” that? I’m gay and it is totally in line with my character.
“People choose to be gay”
Utter and foolish nonsense. Did YOU “choose” to be heterosexual? If so, then you could “choose” to be homosexual. Couldn’t you? Not a single heterosexual I know certainly could.
P.S. I would love to know which version of the Bible you quote from, considering that the word “homosexual” was only coined about a hundred years ago. Couldn’t be that someone’s bias got slipped in there. Or maybe that bias was “inspired” by god, per cknuck.

“The bible for those of us who are Christian and actually give credence to it is very clear”
If it were “clear”, these many discussions would not be happening. And since there is more than one “The Bible (TM)”, we would need to know which version it is that you give so much credence to and why you discount the many other versions that contradict the ‘clarity’ of your version.