I feel bad for the Mormons having to suffer persecution because they voted, they made up a minority of voters who believe marriage is for one man one woman and this attempt of bullying is just grossly nasty and does absolutely nothing for homosexuals.

Martin Luther King, Jr. said in a letter from Birmingham jail:
Will we be extremists for hate or will we be extremists for love? Will we be extremists for the preservation of injustice – or will we be extremists for the cause of justice?
The gay are the extremists for love, and they need to do what they need to do, just as anyone who has to fight for equality justice.

If I recall correctly, it wasn’t until gays took to the streets that we’ve ever received anything in this hateful country. The right to exist and the right to congregate where and when we wanted to weren’t granted to us because we tommed our way into the hearts and minds of middle Americans. They were wrested from the grips of pathetic hate filled heterosexual America by any means necessary.
And so it will go with marriage.
Remember – on a long enough timeline, the survival rate for any bigot is ultimately zero.

“Gay Activists Rally Outside Mormon Temple in NYC”
GOOD! Non-violent protests won’t hurt anyone.

cknuck-
“I feel bad for the Mormons having to suffer persecution because they voted, they made up a minority of voters who believe marriage is for one man one woman and this attempt of bullying is just grossly nasty and does absolutely nothing for homosexuals.”
Mormons have not been targeted because they voted in favor of Prop 8. They have been targeted because their hierarchy asked the faithful across the country to donate as much money and time as possible to support Prop 8. Mormons make up ~2% of the population in CA….yet, they donated ~50% of the money used to support Prop 8.
Do they have a right to do this? Of course. Do gays, lesbians, and straight people who support equal rights for gays & lesbians have a right to protest outside Mormon Temples? Of course.
It boggles my mind that any religious group would campaign to take away rights of any group of tax-paying, law-abiding citizens.
Peace!

ckncuk,____What were you thinking when you voted to take away a right that gays and lesbians had in CA when you voted for Prop 8 — to TAKE AWAY a right that they previoulsy enjoyed. You voted to to take away a right. You, who claim to have always fought for Americans and their rights, voted to deny a right to your fellow citizens, to fellow children of God, to your fellow brothers and sisters. You, who marched with Martin, voted to deny basic human rights to others based, not on the content of their character, but on whom they chose to love. When were basic and fundamental human rights ever subject to a vote of the majority? It’s not Mormons who suffer persecution, its gays and lesbians whom they choose to marginalize and deomonize.

A couple of radical judges went against the wishes of the people does not constitute a right, homosexuals and the right to marry never existed that’s what the vote was about that a few crazy judges do not speak for the people. No rights were taken same sex marriage is an contradiction in terms.
JohnQ if I were Mormon I would protest homosexuals who raise money to try to promote homosexuality as normal and block the entrances of churches.

cknuck-
The CA Justices did their job. Their job, when they accept a case, is to evaluate the law/action to determine whether of not it conforms with the CA constitution. That is what they did. The CA constitution did not contain any definition of marriage that included limiting marriage to mixed couples.
I have/do/will protest any group that advocates taking away or limiting the rights of: women, blacks, Hispanics, Asians, LGBT people, Catholics, Mormons, Jews, etc.
While I think it is unfortunate that you hold the beliefs you do against LGBT people…..I fully defend your right as well as the right of any church to hold what ever belief they wish. However, as I do with you….I will continue to challenge any individual/group that advocates taking away the rights of any group of law-abiding, tax-paying citizens.
That said, I still hold you in my prayers. BTW, while I disagree with some of your beliefs….I have never prayed that you change your beliefs.
Peace!

Best sign seen a recent Mormon protest rally:
“Jesus Had Two Daddies”

The question that must be asked is what you are basing your definition of marriage on…if it’s on the bible, then it should not be considered for our laws.

Nothing good will be accomplished by pitting one minority against another. We need, instead, to find creative ways to network and combine efforts in a united coalition to make gay marriage seem like it has already been accomplished rather than plowing new ground. Granting the LDS this much attention gives them some undue authority. Instead work around or past them and more will be accomplished.

Granting the LDS this much attention gives them some undue authority. Instead work around or past them and more will be accomplished.____You’re right jestrfyl, but you have to work around all the rest too, such as the Knights of Columbus, CT, who gave a huge amt. of money, Groups of the Pentecostal variety, and people who feed into these beliefs and either gave money or their vote to destroy. It is kind of funny that the Knights of Columbus gave so much to abort the Supreme Ct. in CA, and then had their own state Supreme Court in CT find that equality in marriage is for the SS people, also.____Have you heard of the Dec. 5th do without the Gay day? Kathy Griffen is the spokesperson for it. Funny, and I can’t wait for the results. Read LA Times.

The K of C is all but defunct anyway. They are now as toothless as many of the other old fraternal groups. If we grant them authority they will take it. If we act as if they are not there they will only stomp and storm like toddlers. They do have some money to use, but not as nearly as much as they would have people think. Much of their funding goes to maintaining aging buildings – or monstrosities like the K of C headquarters in New Haven (I grew up near it). If we determine a path rather than react to what other people say, it is more likely that the entire goal will be achieved. Otherwise it will never be any more than an endless stream of bickering.

jestrfyl-
Wise words as usual!
Peace!

‘If we grant them authority they will take it.’
Just what kind of authority do you think we’re in search of?
‘They do have some money to use, but not as nearly as much as they would have people think.’
You make it sound like K of C tries to make people think we wield power when all we’re doing is trying to uphold causes we believe in, like traditional marriage among others. Have you had personal bad experiences with members of the organization or encountered ‘blowhards’ lording their power over the hapless ‘peons’?
I’d like to give you the benefit of a doubt, as these statements hardly seem typical coming from a ‘Christian’ minister.

Tom no they are not typical as a Christian minister in love with Jesus Christ I can assure you they are not typical of how we feel. Actually the Knights of Columbus have been pro-action in helping the homeless in this area with thing like obtaining glasses and mentoring, they do have a heart for those less fortunate and I mean by that the poor, that’s one way I see them using their money not to mention helping people with medical bills. These in my opinion are much better pursuits than promoting homosexuality.

The Knights of Columbus have done many fine and good jobs to help people down through the years. I think what bothers us is how can the the K of C living now do what they have, by taking the Californians Constitution and deliberately destroyed peoples equal rights that were given by the Supreme Court of CA. This is unethical and quite possibly will be proven to be illegal.____They say this is for the good of all, as Roman Catholics beliefs go and the rest of the religious who believe with them, but they can have their beliefs, as anyone can under our freedom of religion. The issue here is not about religion it’s about the freedom to be equal in our rights in America. The Blacks worked to have equality, and even now the groups that continue to hate blacks are threatening Obama. The GLBT are fighting now for their equality that shouldn’t have to be fought for, just as the Blacks shouldn’t have had to fight for theirs. It’s time in our nation for ALL to be equal if we are citizens of American and paying our taxes to America’s governmnet.

Jestrfyl is a fine and good Christian minister, he just happens to not be a pentecostal minister. He isn’t programed to think and preach like a CD. He expresses himself in a way that gives you pause to think. ____The Dalai Lama said: Anger and hatred is like a fisherman’s hook. It is very important for us to ensure that we are not caught by it.____Great advice.

Tom, as a very liberal person, who was originally a Methodist, I might have stayed with Christianity had I had a minister like jestrfyl.

Pagansis,
I don’t know that there’s a brand of Christianity invented yet that can satisfy your liberalism. If I be wrong, then God help us all!!

Thanks for the compliment, Tom.

Pagansister is more Christian in her love for others than a good many Christians I know and their Ministers. She never deliberately hurts people with words when they are nasty to her.

To say that a self professed pagan has Christian love is not a well thought out statement, it is in fact misinformation, maybe to create a new religion maybe to confuse but certainly it denies Christ as Lord and Savior. Maybe some folk just don’t know you cannot be a Christian and deny Christ at the same time.

H22 it is not even funny how folk who are not Black decide for Blacks that our heritage, history and even our status should be associated and overshadowed by homosexuality. It’s cheap misdirection shall game at our expense. Homosexuality cannot shoulder it’s own truths because of what it is, sexuality not race so some people try to relate a sexual situation with the noble struggle of a race of people who were enslaved, sold, tortured, raped, lynched, and bred in this country, non of which needs to be in the shadow of homosexuality. It is a low and selfish tactic to acquire sexual legitimacy and I will make this statement every time I see an attempt to equate our race with homosexuality.

That was my post I forgot to post my name but also I meant “shell game” not shall game.

It might deny you of having Jesus as your Lord and Saviour, but it doesn’t me. Goodness in anyone is a reflection of Jesus whether they believe it or not.
You should read more Ck, a huge part of political people, academia, and many more see the parallel of the struggle for Civil rights of the Blacks and Gays.

I read enough to know what to believe, I can assure you of that, I’m still in school. To assume I don’t read is brazen.

Henrietta,
Thanks for the comments. They mean a lot coming from you.

You are so welcome pagansister. I don’t suffer my friends to be trod upon.

Just FYI Henrietta, my earlier comment was genuinely meant in good humor, not spite. It may have not been interpreted in that fassion. Hense, no one was being trod upon.

Thanks for explaining Tom, a smile after it would have indicated humor, but actually I forget to use a smile after humor myself. Actually it was ck’s words that I thought trod on ps. Oh you’re talking about Jestr. It’s hard to keep up with all the slights, sorry. Most of the time I let them slide by, because people can take care of themselves very well. I guess these annoyed me because I consider them my friends.

The truth is the truth and it does sometimes feel uncomfortable but it still is the truth.

cknuck:__Christianity has a monopoly on love? It is different than say…pagan love, or Buddist love, or Jewish love or Hindu love etc.?

Many people including Christians don’t know how to love.
God so loved the world that He gave His only Son…

cknuck, If a parent loves his child why would he/she “give” his only child? (as mentioned in John 3:16) Guess that was supposed to impress the followers of Christianity. Apparently it has.

“all we’re doing is trying to uphold causes we believe in, like traditional marriage”
Tom, traditional marriage isn’t under attack (at least, not from gay couples). Heterosexuals are still allowed to marry now that gay couples can too. Nothing has been (nor will be) taken away from you.