Were there any real “facts” in this “news” article? Where’s the journalistic rigor? If the number of uninsured Americans is called into question, why is it not the journalist’s job to do the research and give a real number?
What exactly did this “news” article illuminate? That lots of people don’t research the issues they care about?
Jesus, what a waste of good code.

So basically what does a value constitute for the ‘Value Voters’? So some retired guy who made toys for the rich (yachts) does not think fixing the world’s most expensive yet least effective health care system of any industrialized nation is a priority BUT dealing with those darn Mexicans and making sure we don’t let homosexuals have secular rights and equal access to benefits are?? Wow, I’m ashamed to be a registered Republican. What happened to the true conservative notions of small government and even smaller government interference in our lives and commerce?? Keep your nose out of my life and hands off my wallet. Libertarian party here I come!!! (Because democrats suck too.)

I, too was a registered Republican but back in the day it was more defensible. It’s a very different, rotted party now. Get out. These people are living in a fantasy world.

I’m a registered Independent…I refuse to belong to any political party.

My voter resistration card just says unafiliated

All the political labels are meaningless. No one is a conservative in the sense of wanting to conserve (that is, maintain) the status quo. The only meaningful labels would be “progressive” (a desire to move forward and try something new and different and hopefully better) and “reactionary” (a desire to return to a supposedly better past era).

So exactly what kind of values are expressed by a woman who refers to sick human beings as “cluttering up our emergency rooms”?

I suspect most people pick parties because of certain people that have represented the party and most people have no idea of how the politicians of all parties consider them as things they can and must manipulate.
I suspect that Obama is trying to rush this legislation through knowing it is flawed with the idea that once he has forced the change through his people can work out the bugs. there are huge concerns with this type of tactic in that the clean up and fallout may outweigh the good in the project long after Obama is gone.

Sort of like Bush did?

yes H22 exactly

I don’t know why these folks won’t acknowledge that the health insurance companies are way out of control and need to be brought under control; the only way this will happen is if the government does get involved.
10 years ago, I had “good” health coverage (Kaiser Permanente), and their death panel almost killed me. One night, in so much abdominal pain that I was literally writhing (I could not stop moving or the pain completely overwhelmed me), I was taken into their emergency clinic. They gave me a “gastric cocktail” which contained lidocaine; they said if it was anything to do with my stomach, that would stop the pain right away. It didn’t. The doctor told me I would have to return in the morning for an ultrasound, gave me an injection of Demerol and Phenargan, and sent me home. The next morning I had the ultrasound done; the doctor looked at it, told me it was acid reflux, and gave me more Demerol. We returned 3 more times with the same result before, on the third day, I saw a nurse practitioner. She took one look at my ultrasound and sent me to a surgeon; she said my gallbladder was very inflamed, and I would need to have it removed. I saw the surgeon right away, and he looked at the ultrasound and told me that he needed me on the table “yesterday.” He sent me over to the hospital and operated that afternoon. Apparently my gallbladder was packed with stones, badly inflamed, and in danger of rupturing. So…why didn’t the doctor send me over to the surgeon in the first place? I later learned that Kaiser paid their doctors incentives to NOT send patients to specialists.
Now I have BC/BS Anthem, and am floored by the things that they deny payment for. According to them, any kind of cold therapy following major joint surgery is “not medically necessary.” They will pay any amount of money for pain medication, though.
I could go on all day. So what I want to know is do these people have health coverage? And if so, do they like it? I have nothing good to say about any provider that I have had over the last 20 years.

Thank you NM for some truth about “death panels”.
There seems to be a concerted effort to not seriously consider the best solution, which is to extend Medicare to everyone thereby putting us all into an effecient system and also getting rid of the majority of overpaid executives in the insurance industry. If someone wanted additional coverage they should be able to buy it for themselves.

NM it matters little what coverage you have doctors still will make mistakes and having the government take over will do little to improve that. As a matter of fact taking a look at our government I can’t see it doing any better but maybe worst.

Well as it is thousands of people don’t have insurance and because of that many get poor health care and many die unnecessarily. And insurance executives get paid ridiculous salaries and our insurance payments fund the people whose job it is to deny our claims. And as you can see private insurance does have what amounts to “death panels”.
I feel confident the government can’t do worse and is almost certain to do better. Remember, the government is answerable to us if we get really upset.

nnmns quote, “the government is answerable to us if we get really upset.”
HA, oh great and mighty nnmns take the govnment to task your kung fu is great.

I didn’t say “me”, I said “us”. I think where our medical care was at stake we’d do a good job of keeping them on their toes.

The government wouldn’t be taking over at all, they will be straightening out what has been broken for the people who want a Health Insurance they can afford, for some the first time in their lives. The naysayers and Obama attackers would rather cut off the ends of their noses than to admit Obama is right. For the people who are satisfied with what they have it will keep the Insurance Companies from raising their premiums higher, and giving them less coverage all the time. What I find amazing is the people in this article who think that they don’t need Insurance and Health Care changed think nothing of giving huge amounts of money to organizations to feed the poor, and people who are having a down period in their economic lives. Then say that it isn’t important for these same people to be able to be covered by health insurance in some way that only the magnitude of our Government of the U.S. could give them. They truly lack common sense and charity.

Get some facts H22 I have never seen anyone denied medical needs if they take the right approach and as for the government fixing anything that is a laugh some of the worst hospitals are government run like V.A. hospitals where patients are neglected and over medicated. Government take taxes they don’t fix and they get the coverage that is breaking our tax paying backs.

Our government is borrowing money from China for failed management.

Actually cknuck a lot of people are denied treatment and a lot never get treatment. You are way, way out of that loop.
Our government has been borrowing money from China for a long time. That comes from, just for instance, invading Iraq without raising taxes to pay for it.

More dark gloom, and old tales of woe, Cknuck?
I don’t think people should have to have a dire emergency and have to go to ER for health problems. They should have doctors they know, and offices to go to before they have a death dealing problem. You simplify to win your own argument. Prevention is the future of medicine all over the world ck. Our government is not a laugh, never was and never will be. If you don’t like your country why don’t you move to another one? Social Security, Medicare, and Medicaid is run by the govenment, and helped all of us for many years. We have friends who are retired Military and they have never had problems with the VA Hospitals. You shouldn’t jump on an occasional bad experience and paint everything bad because of them. The old cry of taxes is just that, the same old cry everytime something needs to be changed.

Cknuck,
If you have never seen any one denied medical needs then you live in a very small world indeed. Your “right approach” just doesn’t cover everyone I think. I know your “Jesus complex” makes you think you’re the be-all end-all to anyone in need but step out of that delusion for a moment and realize that people are actually suffering every day because there is NO WAY for them to get the medical care they need.

Fact: No one is suggesting that the government run medical care (as in, decide how doctors should practice medicine); a completely government-run reimbursement system would be socialized insurance, not socialized medicine.
Fact: We spend an inconceivable amount of money on paperwork for countless insurance providers; individual medical practices and hospitals have to employ people full-time to do nothing but handle insurance paperwork.
Fact: Relying on the emergency room is the most expensive and least efficient way to provide medical care for uninsured people; ER services are extraordinarily expensive, because they are set up to handle true life-threatening emergencies, not routine medical care.
Fact: The VA hospital system usually works pretty well. Certainly, there are exceptional cases of neglect, waste, incompetence–just as occurs in private hospitals.

Yesterday I heard a discussion of the VA as it relates to the health care debate. It was pointed out the VA had been a real mess but it was cleaned up, largely during the Clinton administration. Now it’s apparently considered the best medical system in the country by several measures. And it is socialized medicine.
cknuck I understand you were in the military. Do you go to VA for anything? If so, how do you justify taking socialized medicine but wanting to deny efficient, available medical care to large numbers of people? On the other hand, as a professed Christian how do you justify taking socialized medicine but wanting to deny efficient, available medical care to large numbers of people?

no nnmns I do not use VA hospital services how do you justify making assumptions concerning my life although it is kind of flattering that you think of me so much.
H4C do you really think a government take over will eliminate paper work?

cknuck what part of “if” don’t you understand?

nnmns the part of “if” I don’t understand is why, why “if” when “if” is illogical and the only reason for “if” would be incitement.

One reason it would eliminate paperwork is that it would be put into a computer for each patient with all their tests and be available to whatever medical office that needs them, stat. This will enable the patient to have treatment started right away and will have a chance to have a good conclusion for their problem.

H22 you are optimistic, I have no recall of any bureaucratic dealing that run so smooth especially with the government. Never the less I do believe the system can be improved and our government should as it already does have sanctioning but I also believe that Obama’s way is not thoroughly thought out and the glitches will hurt more than they will improve. All of the loopholes are just to hard to cover and will be expensive. Not to mention the fact I believe he lies about the abortion.

I think it’s a bad idea to require a lot of people to buy insurance who don’t think they need it. It’s a far better idea to just provide that insurance for everyone (or everyone who’s here legally or under, say, 18.

When you think about it, cars are nearly as essential to a healthy life because the vast majority of American workers would not be able to get to their workplaces without a car.
No job is bad for anyone’s health.
How ’bout a nice, reliable car, my big-government friend?
The audacity of redistribution.