Interesting that those pastors with more education were more likely to strongly agree than those with a Master’e degree or above. Education makes a difference. Also no surprise that Evangelical’s were more likely to agree.

No, the pastors with less education (bachelor’s or less) “are more likely to strongly agree than those with a master’s degree”.
I have to say I think it’s more dangerous than Christianity but both have the potential to do a lot of harm to people and to democracy. As does Judaism though I’d put it in line behind the other two. I don’t have nearly enough experience to rank, e.g. Buddhism and Hinduism in there.
Possibly the age of a religion correlates inversely with its danger to people and society.

The significance of citing educational differences and attitudes toward Islam is not clear. As Lifeway president Ed Stetzer inidcates, “dangerous” is a loaded word and is interpreted in a variety of ways. That being said, I would answer something like the following: Islam is as dangerous as we allow it to be. That answer may line me up with those would would not agree that Islam is dangeorus, or it may put me in the other group. I have lived in one Muslim-majority country and visited three others, so have had exposure to the effects of widespread adherence to Islam. I think a better question would be something about whether Islam is a religion that encourages and promotes peace, meaningful compassion (with results) for your fellow persons, and maybe overall stability. I would say that Islam does not promote or encourage peace and stability, and it does a poor job, at best, with compassion.

The biggest problem Islam has is the lack of debate. Without the Questioning of ideas power concentrates power to a few “enlightened”. “Absolute power corrupts absolutely.”

citing educational differences is a divisive tactic most of the professional preachers Jesus was opposed to were the equivalent to your higher than a bachelors degree example. Don’t be fooled by secular insertions. Any everyday person would agree as for right now Islam is dangerous or they would have their head buried in the sand. But I think the bigger point is manipulation and division of the body of Christ, don’t fall for it, it is a systematic evil.

Thanks for the correction, nnmns….Less education were in agreement. I messed up that statement.

So far as a country or government we have did very well with seeing the dangers in hindsight.

Excellent point rmcq: questioning of ideas (and authority) is crucial. And if such questioning of a religion might lead to your death that religion is no good, or at the very least those who administer it are no good. And if it’s easy for that kind of thing to happen in a religion then it is, on balance, no good.

Just a quick note:
I find Islam no more or less dangerous than Christianity or Judaism. Radicals in any religion are extremely dangerous because they believe sacrificing themselves and anyone else within range is a righteous act. Fear and dehumanization will enable people to due anything including kill.
Good luck and best wishes to everyone in the northeast. I hope all the s*NO*w does not dampen your Christmas preparations.

Jestrfyl is so right… I work in a school where our population is predominately Muslim. The worse thing I can say about our families is that they tend to be over indulgent of the kids and bad behavior choices… but then again most of them have come from Sudan. They are so happy to have a safe place for their children to live that they allow them more freedoms than they need. The are rather like the parents of the 60′s who rebelled against the strict rules of their parents.
The parents are polite and wish to make things work in this country. It’s not the African Americans causing problems.. its the Americans who call themselves African that do… hate to say that, but I see it day in and day out. They act like their kids can do no wrong and refuse to do anything about bad behavior.
So it comes down to who I fear… it’s not the Muslims, but those of any religion who think they know it all and know what is right for everyone else… when its not their place to impose.

If this many Protestant ministers feel this way it’s time for them to sit down with Muslim Ministers and talk. To keep putting fear into their congregations is not meeting this problem, and making the Muslims be the bad guys.

Ruairi quote, “It’s not the African Americans causing problems.. its the Americans who call themselves African that do… hate to say that, but I see it day in and day out. They act like their kids can do no wrong and refuse to do anything about bad behavior.”
Much like all racist this is typical they see what they want to see, and I don’t believe you have any trouble saying it at least in cyber-space where you have cyber-stones. In today’s America black kids are no better or worse than white kids. The educational system is a little tilted but as for bad behavior on the kids part and poor parenting it is across the board. but keep seeing what you want to see, it’s a free country.

This country as we know it today was founded and established by Christians and welcoming to all religions as much as some folk complain about Christians forcing Christianity upon them the country is set up so that there is no such thing as force when it comes to religion and that is why so many religions enjoy freedom here, it’s the Christian thing to do.

Henrietta: “it’s time for them to sit down with Muslim Ministers and talk. To keep putting fear into their congregations is not meeting this problem, and making the Muslims be the bad guys.”
Indeed.
cknuck: “This country as we know it today was founded and established by Christians and welcoming to all religions”
It was founded by primarily Christians and deists as I understand. A lot of the Christians, at least, came over to practice their faith unfettered; not to let other people practice other faiths unfettered. I understand Rhode Island was by far the most open to varieties of faith (thanks, Roger Williams).
There is no legal force to attend a church. In places there’s a lot of social force. And just try to get elected to a public offi ce if you are a professed atheist. Some place in North Carolina I understand there’s even still a law against it. Fortunately it will surely be thrown out but some people have sued to have it enforced.
But, yes, the US is pretty good about letting people do as they choose. Let us keep resisting those who want to declare it a “Christian nation” and require laws based on that.

nnmns you can’t resist history as much as a lot of folk try to omit some of it and by the way there were only a couple of deist everyone else were Christian. But your are right about laws they should not be based on religion but if I remember right they should not also be against religion.
H22 I don’t think people are fearful of most Imams we are fearful of the next follower of Islam that will try mass murder were we work, or play, or dine, and that fear is based on real events, or are we in denial about events now.

nnmns you can’t resist history as much as a lot of folk try to omit some of it and by the way there were only a couple of deist everyone else were Christian. But your are right about laws they should not be based on religion but if I remember right they should not also be against religion.
H22 I don’t think people are fearful of most Imams we are fearful of the next follower of Islam that will try mass murder were we work, or play, or dine, and that fear is based on real events, or are we in denial about events now.

“that is why so many religions enjoy freedom here, it’s the Christian thing to do”
Religious freedom- like so many other rights established in the Constitution- was put in there in our foundational document in reaction to oppressions suffered under the British Crown (which has had a Christian church as its state religion for centuries). Throughout most of history, Christian nations have suppressed religious minorities within their jurisdiction. This is an inescapable fact of history. Furthermore, the colony started by (more or less) religious refugees in New England was extremely oppressive of variant religious expression. Hence the formation of the Maryland and Rhode Island colonies.
While I love and value Christianity, I must say that the tradition of religious freedom can hardly be attributed to this institution. It is devout conservative Christians in this nation who insist upon letting everyone know that Christianity is the only acceptable faith in this country and obviously enshrined in our government.
Just because Christians founded this country does not mean they intended the government to be Christian. To state otherwise is utterly ignorant.
Also, shame on these ministers. They know the power of their words. They should take the opportunity to sow understanding and love, not ignorance and hate.

i think you are the one ‘resisting history, CK.
“by the way there were only a couple of deist everyone else were Christian”
Sorry, to correct you here, but Jews came over here with Columbus and have been present in American history every since, Revolutionary War (whose biggest funder was Jewish) to the present day Jews have played an integral part in the history of this country. So not, ‘everyone else were Christian’ as you would claim.

kauko it only goes to support what I said obviously we are not speaking Hebrew and no Jewish signers. thanks, oh yeah, just a suggestion but if you want to hurt someone’s argument you would want to come up with facts that dispute their claims not support them.

“by the way there were only a couple of deist everyone else were Christian”
Those were you’re words, in that sentence you are saying that aside from a trivial number of deists everyone was a Christian in early America. My response: No there have always been Jews here. If there have always been Jews here in America, Jews who have taken part in every stage of American history, that refutes your claim, period.

And why would we be speaking Hebrew, no Jews spoke Hebrew as an everyday language until its modern revival in Israel. So, hint, hint, Jews tend to speak the language of whatever nation/ culture they live amongst. And if Jews had to be among the ‘signers’ to be legitimate, then I’ll ask were there any non-White people among them? Does the lack there of in anyway diminish the contributions of African Americans to American history?

Funny that if there were “only a couple of deists”, so many of the important founders of our country were deists.
And your pointlet about us not speaking Hebrew is just silly. You are papering over your lost argument. Christianity is certainly not inherently pro freedom of religion except for freedom to practice their religion. The freedoms we have were hard won, partly by different kinds of Christians, e.g. Catholics in protestant areas and no doubt vice versa.

Muslims are the 7th head of the beast.

Wow interpreter that was off the wall. A few questions:
What beast?
What are the first six heads?
Are there other heads?
Have you seen this beast? If so, did you wake up sweating? What did you ingest or inject before you saw it? Is it a friendly beast? If it licks your face does it do so with more than one head at once?

Among the founders who created this nation through documentation there were only a couple of deist, the majority were Christians. I’ve got to make it simple for you lawyers who try so hard to re-write historical facts. nnmns yes I do lose arguments but not any that matters, (e,g. God is good, or God is great.)

I’m in favor of documentation but I don’t credit it with creating the nation.
Here’s an article on the founders and their religious thoughts.
Now I’m still curious about interpreter’s beast. Do you know about this beast cknuck?

no clue maybe some interpretation of the book of Revelations, or simply something they ingested or injected as mentioned.

Henrietta22
December 19, 2009 1:52 PM
“If this many Protestant ministers feel this way it’s time for them to sit down with Muslim Ministers and talk. To keep putting fear into their congregations is not meeting this problem, and making the Muslims be the bad guys.”
I agree Henrietta22 but the problem I see in this is when you those who believe that ‘they’ and ONLY ‘they’ have the ‘truth’, why bother? Their dogma and beliefs blind them from communicating to others, especially those who believe differently than they do.
As someone has already mentioned, reactionary, fundamentalism, regardless of the religious, is dangerous to all. While a religion may not teach such, these individuals learn it from someone and the problem I see is no one wants to take responsibility for that.

If you would like to learn more about Islam, please take a moment to look at this website: http://creepingsharia.wordpress.com/
While elected officials, the media, and law enforcement officials continue to ignore the reality that “jihad” is an imperative in Islam, sometimes the great equalizer is watching members of, what Barack Obama refers to as, the “Muslim world” in action.

I didn’t look at your link z but I can guess what it’s about. I think we could put together a montage of Christians doing bad things in the name of Christianity if we wanted to. What’s the point.
Now what’s your problem with the term “Muslim world”?

For all these fearful Protestant pastors I recommend reading the Quran, Sura 19, introductory note 139 and section 2 (“verses” 16 – 40). Maybe these pastors in question are simply daunted by the size and scope of the book. Or maybe all they know are the scary bits about which other people have told them. So start here and see what more they may want to read. The greatest source of fear is ignorance. Perhaps if they chose to ignore less and learn more then there might not be so much poorly thought though misinformation floating around.

nnmns,
The evil beast of the Revelation with 7 heads represents the 7 non-Judeo-Christian entities that have ruled Jerusalem. John tells us that the 6th head is the pagan rome of his day. The 7th head is said to trample Jerusalem for 1260 years, which is how long Muslims have ruled Jerusalem.
The 1260 year reign of the 7th head is over with, but Muslims want to rule Jerusalem again, and the beast is said to start the Battle of Ar Mageddon when the Euphtrates dries up. The Euphrates was dry on 9/11 when the first shot was fired.
I hope that helps.

Thanks Interpreter, I thought that’s what you meant; the injection thing threw me off a little. the book of Revelations is called that for a reason, many just won’t get it or believe.
For those with puffed up pride who what to just put these pastors down saying they are afraid and lack reading skills that’s just nonsense every pastor I know have read the Qu’ran and have it on their shelves. I fail to see how someone who claim to be on the same team but take every opportunity to put teammates down to appease the world can be anything other than prideful. And as for Christians doing terrorist things, I haven’t heard that or seen anybody like that in my travels. I know somebody is going to go way back to the Crusades and compare it to today, get out the dredger.

interpreter
Your Biblical guess work is lacking. Islam was more than 500 years and thousands of miles away. The author was writing about his time and hiis immediate expectations.
ck
I don’t buy the team metaphor. Attached to it comes the notion of winning/losing. Faith is not a race, a game, or a contest. It is a way of being. That there are other people – including you – who believe and live differently does not offend or scare me.
Christians and terrorism – how soon we forget. Ireland, Serbia, religiously sanctioned violence against blacks and homosexuals – the list is long and scary.
Perhaps if we all realized how much we need each other to live, and that this is not some twisted competition then all of our lives would be more safe and pleasant. But if you prefer to spend life huddled in fear then continue to preach and teach that “they” are out to get YOU! BOO!!

Excellent post, jest.

jest I know you don’t believe in the bible but I do and in it Paul described our Christian walk in metaphors including “the race, the prize, using examples of an athlete an farmer and soldier and I think it must have been important for him to use such examples less we forget and become just like the world with no need for God. So it’s not surprising that nnmns would be the first to agree with you because your assertions are basically godless. And as for fear, there are healthy fears but the fears you try to present are for the weak so I can understand your obsession with them.

Jestrfyl, I’ll second nnmns. For a Bible teaching UCC Minister you’re the best!
Merry Christmas, and a Happy New Year, friend.

Jestrfyl, I’ll second nnmns. For a doubt teaching UCC Minister you’re the best!

henrietta and nnmns,
Thanks – this time of year comments like yours help a lot.
ck,
I take your remark seriously – for a jester. I do teach doubt. I teach that self-aggrandizing evangelists should be doubted. I teach that people who work from fear and sell nothing but guilt should be doubted. I teach that people should doubt anyone who simly yells that they are right with nothing more than ever increasing vloume, os flash and funk without substance. I teach that doubt is the test of faith, and that faith is the greatest reward. But don’t believe that God only loves and welcomes some people, that there is only one way to approach God, or that it is up to us to decide who is in God’s good graces. Doubt hones the blade of faith, making it easier to slice through the balogney that so many people serve as religion. So thank you for appreciating my efforts. So thank you for your complement too. Merry CHRISTmas – seriously, friend.

Oops, The posting above from 11:43 pm was mine, your ever lovin’ jestrfyl. Sorry for the slip up.

Merry Christmas Cknuck, and everyone else!

“Doubt hones the blade of faith” meaningless distractive drivel, typical of professional churchmen certainly not biblical or productive.
A jester wears a costume and uses deceptive comedy to amuse a usually bored master.

ck
Surely you know that doubt is as much a part of faith as dark is part of light, zero is part of infinity, and death is part of life. Denying doubt is foolish. Examining it and determining just what you DO believe is fruitful.
Your anti-intellectual attitude is exactly what this article is about. Trite, repetitious, easy to recall slogans, appropriate for bumper stickers and t-shirts does not make a theology or a religion. But if that’s all you need, then fine enough. Swallow all the mythology and celebrity idol worship and “fast food” religio-isms you want!

I’m not anti-intellectual nor anti-knowledge I am however anti-misuse of intellect, knowledge and deception.