The Company is removing all the scripture #’s and letters before they leave the factory, and not inscribing any new ones. They are also sending kits so the troops can remove the ones on their gun sites. Some troops have been removing them with whatever, since they were made aware of them. A 660 million dollar contract is nothing to fool around with.

Whatever possessed them to put Bible verses on the weapons they produce in the first place??? What a stupid idea. Seems obvious they never considered all soldiers AREN’T Christian…or perhaps they didn’t care. My guess, they didn’t care. Pushing that “ole time religion” to them was more important than the feelings of the non-Christians. Also perhaps they were under the illusion that this country is a Christian nation…WRONG!

From pretty much every angle and every side, this whole thing is just plain ridiculous. It’s ridiculous to put Bible verses on weapons of war, it’s ridiculous to worry about religious discrimination because references to someone else’s sacred text are on your weapons of war…the whole thing is just ridiculous on every level.

What would Jesus have Said?
(Assuming he’d existed and knew this would have happened “in his name”.).

Btw my life was first my parents’ project then some of my teachers’ and relatives’, now my families’ and mine. I object to repeatedly having to read some idiot saying it belongs to an imaginary being. What an insult

Hurrah for the Military Religious Freedome Foundation and its founder Mikey Weinstein http://www.militaryreligiousfreedom.org for sounding the alarm and exposing this blatant violation of the 1st Amendment and the separation of church and state as well as military rules.

Why cant we unite together and console each other.. Set aside
all those precarious mind. And let us all be a emissary of peace.

silly nilly

RtR you are absolutely right about the MRFF. There are some bad things going on in parts of the military we rarely hear about (and likely some we never hear about) and those folks are on the front lines fighting them and preserving the rights of our fighting men and women to their own beliefs and to not being proselytized while a captive audience.

It’s another example of the war on Christians. I’m dissappointed with Trijicon.

I got to get me one of them there “Jesus Scopes” for the coming Civil War!!!

JESUS say’s in matt. 10:33 but whoever denies Me before men, him I will also deny before My Father who is in heaven. hmm. you have to stand for something, or you will fall for anything.

I think it’s exactly what our military needs.
This company has the right to put the verses on the weapons. If our government or other governments chose not to purchase them that is their choice.
I think this is taking away from the company’s freedom when they are told not do this.
I find it very offensive to try to remove every bit of what our country was and is founded on.
Once again, we are letting people use this countries rights against what we know was intended for us by our fore fathers.

Uh, putting Bible verses on rifles when we’re trying to keep most Muslims from buying the radical Islamists’ anti-US propaganda. There’s stupid and there’s religiously stupid.
And of course the government in fact can tell a company what goes or doesn’t go on things it buys, as can any large buyer.
Now, were you guys resting easy in the knowledge some company was putting Bible verses on the army’s scopes and now you see that right of resting easy in that knowledge taken away from you? Or had you, like most people, never heard of it but now you’re happy there’s a high horse you can get on and yell and stomp your feet? I’m guessing it’s the second.

YN, the company has NO right to take advantage of their government contract to put their religious views on anything they make for the US Government…much less military! This contract was for the US Government, separation of church and state…ever hear of that? Our nation is as great as it is BECAUSE we are NOT a theocracy. And you know what our fore mothers and fore fathers intended for us? It seems as if the company is smart enough to comply with the orders of the government so they don’t lose all the good old government money. If they were all that gung ho with preaching, they’d agree to cancel the contract, huh? Sorry God, we want to continue to make our money seems to be what they are saying.

to the pagan sister- there is no such thing as seperation of church and state. read the constitution. ever hear of that?

I hardly think that when Jesus said carry the message He meant carry it on a rifle.
At the same time Mikey Weinstein, is a creep, to use such hostile language concerning this incident is declaring war, it is not only not unconstitutional it is not a disgrace. Distasteful yes but we must lay down the gauntlet and address all who would put this country at war with Christians with such language.

Keith:
Check out the First Amendment to the US Constitution: “Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion etc.” (yes, I have heard of the constitution, have you?)The separation is a legal and political principal derived from that First Amendment. It is part of our historial, legal, and political/social heritage, and preserves and protects our religious liberty.
Check out Thomas Jefferson: His conviction was that religion was a personal matter, one which government had no business getting involved in. Danbury letter, 1802…might explain it to you.
Don’t feed me the “no separation of church and state” crap. There is and always should be a LARGE separation. TJ agreed. He was a wise man.

cknuck:
“I hardly think that when Jesus said carry the message He meant carry it on a rifle.”
Good point. Killing wasn’t exactly what JC stood for, IMO.

“, to use such hostile language concerning this incident is declaring war… we must lay down the gauntlet”
No, cknuck, Weinstein is just right. That’s one of the stupider things we could do when we want to keep most Muslims neutral or on our side. It is a disgrace to the military because it’s irrelevant and dumb and it does give additional incentive and emboldenment to recruiters for our nation’s enemies. It’s a no brainer.
Weinstein is on the good guys’ (our) side. Don’t mistake a friend’s reaction for a declaration of war against you.

Weinstein is no friend of mine anymore than you are nnmns there are other approaches to that situation which by the way I disagree with posting scripture on rifles it makes no sense but it is not a constitutional issue.

I wonder if Trijicon has any connections with Focus on Family and Dobson.
There is almost no misuse of scripture as bizarre as this. It surely shows that whoever came up with the idea has not read the whole book – especially that back part with that Jesus guy all over it.

Aww, cknuck. .

Seriously, cknuck, unless you are actually in favor of our men and women who are serving our country being proselytized through intimidation then you should recognize Weinstein and his group are serving a good purpose.

Mr. Weinstein is Jewish, Ck, can’t you understand that is why he doesn’t believe in proseylytizing in mixed groups like The Air Force Academy, etc. He didn’t like what his son and friends were experiencing. How does it benefit you to call him silly names?

H22 I could care less what Weinstein is the thing that concerns me is the war of words and attempts to declare everything Christian bad. I would not agree with the inscription either but it is not unconstitutional or a disgrace JN8:12 is not proselytizing nor is Christians enemies to the U.S. Why don’t Weinstein criticize Israel for having laws pertaining to religion. Stop sending money to Israel, Christians should wake up and stop supporting Israel now if we offen them so much!

It would elevate the level of discourse here if people would just read before they post.
I don’t believe any evidence has been offered, either in the article or by any participant, that suggests Mr. Weinstein attempts to “declare everything Christian bad”. And I doubt that he does since that would be counter-productive. His goal, I understand, is to reduce/eliminate pressure by higher officers and chaplains to convert to their brand of Christianity or else. (And we’ve had several reports of such pressures.) He would not accomplish anything like that by offending all Christians and I’m sure he knows it.
But maybe a poster or two here likes that kind of proselytization, eh?

yeah and I believe you nnmns, your brand of anti-Christian is to stoop to any low to berate and strike a blow at Christianity. Of course you would defend this type of talk.

The sky isn’t falling Ck, look outside and notice that the world is still there. You jump on any Christian who isn’t of the Pentecostal beliefs, 24-7. Nnmns does not subscribe to fundamentalist beliefs, most of the people who do hurt other people, and our U.S.A., as well as in other countries. To hate as you say is o.k. because nnmns is an atheist, isn’t o.k. If you think it’s o.k. you are doing yourself an injustice, and making bad karma for yourself. Think love and you’ll attract love; think hate and you’ll attract hate. It’s the way God made the world.

H22 you are so full of yourself you condemn Pentecostals (of which I am not) and people with fundamental beliefs which I do have I keep it simple Jesus is Lord that’s fundamental you should try it in stead of being wishy washy. I don’t hate nnmns because he is atheist I hate him because he preaches hate of God and Jesus. I don’t believe in karma and I have no problem attracting love because I serve people in need. I don’t try to attract love with softsoapy words favorable to all ears I walk my talk and serve one Lord keep your karma I’ve got Jesus.

I don’t condem anyone. Study how fundamentalism has played out in the world. And I have tried fundamentalism and it hurt family members. You don’t have to believe in karma, look it up in the dictionary, so you’ll know what it is. You have it and we all have it even if we don’t want it.

I know what karma means H regardless of what your imagination tells you, you may have karma and mix it into your religious beliefs. I know fundamental believers who live on farms, ride in buggies, have made versally no carbon footprint because of their fundamental beliefs I’ll take their beliefs over yours anyday. I fundamentally believe Jesus is Lord I believe in the bible and I am not ashamed and peopel like you hard as you may try can’t make me ashame of the Gospel.

No one wants to make you ashamed of your beliefs, cknuck. However it seems to have made you think you are always right, because “the Bible tells you so.” It is fortunate that not everyone agrees that that book is totally right on everything and that it is subject to interpretation. Lots of interpretation.

ck: ” I don’t hate nnmns because he is atheist I hate him because he preaches hate of God and Jesus.”
Show the words where I’ve done that cknuck. I challenge you to document that claim.
You won’t be able to do it because I don’t believe in any god or any Jesus. I try to show others the wisdom of that position and in fact the foolishness of your position so I think I understand why you dislike me. But to make people hate “God” or “Jesus” they’d have to first believe in them and I don’t want people to believe in them.
So logically your claim makes no sense, and you won’t be able to find any words I wrote to support it, but I’ve found logic is lost on you and you lie when you can’t make your case so I fully expect you to huff and puff and tell more lies in response to this.
So sad.

nnmns you would love people to believe you are emotionally detached from God but that’s does not ring true your passion to defame God exposes you.

interpreter,
“It’s another example of the war on Christians.”
Balderdash! Unadulterataed poppycock. I’m a Christian and I always feel deeply ashamed at the outrageous demands of other self-described “Christians”, requiring the imposition of their faith on others.
Not every soldier is a Christian.
The sheer, utter audacity of inscribing weapons meant to kill other human beings with Bible verses serves to do nothing other than inflame hatred toward Christians by people around the world who think Christians are meant to be bullies, if what they see from American ‘Christians’ is any example.
And to do it in the name of the Prince of PEACE is more than ironic, it is damaging.
You don’t want freedom of religion. You want all people to adhere to your religious views. Well, we DON’T. So get over yourself.

“I know what karma means “
I am always amazed that people revel in their ignorance – are PROUD of it.
If you don’t know what it means, ck, then fer cryin’ out loud, GOOGLE it.

YN if I say I know what karma means why would you then say I don’t? It has nothing to do with Christianity so perhaps you should google it. pretty petty if you ask me you waste a lot of space on needless arguments see a doctor.

YN you ought to google “I Know”

Because you lie to suit your own purposes, cknuck. You’ve done it repeatedly and there’s no reason any of us would believe anything you say. Especially anything you claim.

Karma: Simple process of cause and effect.
“Whatsoever a man soweth, that shall he reap: Galatians 6-7.
Has nothing to do with Christianity, cknuck? That sounds like Karma to me…but then, I’m not a “Christian” so what do I know!?:o)

pagan I may not be the most educated person I grew up with a lot of disadvantages, but I’m not dumb either.
“Karma’ is an Eastern religious concept in contradistinction to ‘faith’ espoused by Abrahamic religions (Judaism, Christianity, and Islam), which view all human dramas as the will of God as opposed to present – and past – life actions.”
look it up before you jab next time.

AND? cknuck?
No one is accusing you of being dumb, BTW.

“contradistinction” cknuck? Sometimes you have trouble stringing letters and words together and sometimes you come out with polished sentences like that one.
Curious.