According to more than 130 Muslims scholars the basis for peace between Muslims and Christians is for Christians to renounce the Trinity:
Muslims and Christians together make up well over half of the world’s population.
Without peace and justice between these two religious communities, there can be no
meaningful peace in the world. The future of the world depends on peace between
Muslims and Christians.
The basis for this peace and understanding already exists. It is part of the very
foundational principles of both faiths: love of the One God, and love of the neighbour.
These principles are found over and over again in the sacred texts of Islam and
Christianity. The Unity of God, the necessity of love for Him, and the necessity of love of the neighbour is thus the common ground between Islam and Christianity. The following are only a few examples:
Of God’s Unity, God says in the Holy Qur’an: Say: He is God, the One! / God, the Self-Sufficient Besought of all! (Al-Ikhlas, 112:1-2). Of the necessity of love for God, God says in the Holy Qur’an: So invoke the Name of thy Lord and devote thyself to Him with a complete devotion (Al-Muzzammil, 73:8). Of the necessity of love for the neighbour, the Prophet Muhammad ? said: “None of you has faith until you love for your neighbour what you love for yourself.”
In the New Testament, Jesus Christ ? said: ‘Hear, O Israel, the Lord our God, the Lord is One. / And you shall love the Lord your God with all your heart, with all your soul, with all your mind, and with all your strength.’ This is the first commandment. / And the second, like it, is this: ‘You shall love your neighbour as yourself.’ There is no other commandment greater than these.” (Mark 12:29-31)
Which includes rejecting the deity of Christ:
In the Holy Qur’an, God Most High enjoins Muslims to issue the following call to
Christians (and Jews-the People of the Scripture):
Say: O People of the Scripture! Come to a common word between us and
you: that we shall worship none but God, and that we shall ascribe no partner unto Him, and that none of us shall take others for lords beside God. And if they turn away, then say: Bear witness that we are they who
have surrendered (unto Him). (Aal ‘Imran 3:64)
The words: we shall ascribe no partner unto Him relate to the Unity of God, and
the words: worship none but God, relate to being totally devoted to God. Hence they all relate to the First and Greatest Commandment. According to one of the oldest and most authoritative commentaries on the Holy Qur’an the words: that none of us shall take others for lords beside God, mean ‘that none of us should obey the other in disobedience to what God has commanded’. This relates to the Second Commandment because justice and freedom of religion are a crucial part of love of the neighbour. Thus in obedience to the Holy Qur’an, we as Muslims invite Christians to come together with us on the basis of what is common to us, which is also what is most essential to our faith and practice: the Two Commandments of love.
(via)
So, if Christians want to be at peace with Muslims, we have to reject what it means to be a Christian by rejecting our Lord and Savior even though we know if we did we would not be at peace with God:
Mark 8:38 For whoever is ashamed of me and of my words in this adulterous and sinful generation, of him will the Son of Man also be ashamed when he comes in the glory of his Father with the holy angels.”
James 4:4 You adulterous people! Do you not know that friendship with the world is enmity with God? Therefore whoever wishes to be a friend of the world makes himself an enemy of God.
Though it’s true that Jesus said that God is one, he also said that he is one with the Father:
John 10:30 “I and the Father are one.”
Jesus is clearly saying that he is God here and the Pharisees understood him as saying that:
John 10:31 The Jews picked up stones again to stone him. 32 Jesus answered them, “I have shown you many good works from the Father; for which of them are you going to stone me?” 33 The Jews answered him, “It is not for a good work that we are going to stone you but for blasphemy, because you, being a man, make yourself God.” 34 Jesus answered them, “Is it not written in your Law, ‘I said, you are gods’? 35 If he called them gods to whom the word of God came- and Scripture cannot be broken- 36 do you say of him whom the Father consecrated and sent into the world, ‘You are blaspheming,’ because I said, ‘I am the Son of God’? 37 If I am not doing the works of my Father, then do not believe me; 38 but if I do them, even though you do not believe me, believe the works, that you may know and understand that the Father is in me and I am in the Father.” 39 Again they sought to arrest him, but he escaped from their hands.
Other passages make Christ’s deity clear as well:
Isaiah 9:6 For to us a child is born, to us a son is given; and the government shall be upon his shoulder, and his name shall be called Wonderful Counselor, Mighty God, Everlasting Father, Prince of Peace.
Matthew 1:23 “Behold, the virgin shall conceive and bear a son, and they shall call his name Immanuel” (which means, God with us).
Luke 7:16 Fear seized them all, and they glorified God, saying, “A great prophet has arisen among us!” and “God has visited his people!”
John 1:1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.
John 5:18 This was why the Jews were seeking all the more to kill him, because not only was he breaking the Sabbath, but he was even calling God his own Father, making himself equal with God.
John 20:28 Thomas answered him, “My Lord and my God!”
There are many other verses that I could quote that demonstrate quite clearly that Jesus is God, that’s why we worship him. We do so because the word of God states it.
When we say that God is one it’s with the understanding that the oneness includes God the Father, God the Son and God the Holy Spirit. Even though Muslims, Jews and Christians read the same verse we all have a different meaning and there can be no unity in the phrase.
My question to the Muslim scholars is this: instead of asking us to give up our faith and submit to your’s, why not just tolerate our faith? Then we can be at peace with each other.
Updated: Listen, to those who read this and think I’m being harsh or I don’t understand what they’re saying or that I’m spinning what they’re saying, I linked to the article and quoted so that you could read it for yourself. If I was trying to spin, then I wouldn’t have done that. What I did was cut to the chase and explained why there can be no agreement between Muslims and Christians over this issue. The one word that we supposedly agree on, the Shema means something different to Muslims and Christians. To Muslims it means a unitary God but to Christians it means a triune God that includes the Father, Son and Holy Spirit. How can we come to an agreement? Go read their suggestions. I haven’t represented them.
posted October 15, 2007 at 1:58 pm
First, let me introduce myself. My name is Seth and I am a current seminarian who, to be fair, has left leaning tendencies. I ran across you post while looking for responses to “A Common Word.”I think you have misunderstood this document. This is a call for dialogue, which is very important not only for peace but for Christianity to remain relevant in the world. Dialogue asks the parties to come together and talk. Not to water down a tradition, but to find common ground from which a a peaceful coexistance can occur. While it is true that Muslims reject the divinity of Jesus this letter should not be read as a call for Christians to give up this core doctrine. In fact, as Christians we would have to agree with statement that God is one since it is at the heart of the doctrine of the Trinity. Nowhere in this document does it say we have to reject Christ to be at peace. I know very few Christians that would jump on board with such a document and the writers most certainly would not have expected to have been taken seriously by as many Christian leaders as this document was sent to.In no way are the Muslims endorsing this letter calling for all the Christians in the world to convert. That would be rediculous. This is a call for mutual understanding, which, I think, is a large part of the fear that both sides of the table are feeling.Well, I have gone on long enough. Thank you for reading.Peace of Christ,Seth.
posted October 15, 2007 at 2:36 pm
Seth, I would suggest that you reread the document because when they say that God is one and when they say “we shall ascribe no partner unto Him” they are clearly rejecting Christ and inviting us to do the same. They desire for us to find common ground with them over the fact that God is one but God is one means something different to each of us.I actually didn’t take this document as a threat even though they say somethings that can be taken that way (others think it’s a submit or die document). I actually think they think we can find commonality in the “God is one” and the commandment to love God with all your heart, mind and strength but we can’t and this post was explaining why. To do so would be to reject Christ. Shema means one to them and to us it means unity in the Trinity. Even that “common word” can’t unify Muslims, Jews and Christians because it means different things to each of us. Muslims and Christians don’t worship the same God because Jesus is God and the Muslims refuse to worship him.
posted October 15, 2007 at 3:55 pm
“According to more than 130 Muslims scholars the basis for peace between Muslims and Christians is for Christians to renounce the Trinity:”You have illustrated that you are capable of spinning and taking things out of context for your own agenda, but you haven’t proven your point!People can choose to understand or view things in infinite ways/perpectives so why don’t you understand the letter the way that it was intended to be understood by the writers!As aaron said, such dialoge was intended “Not to water down a tradition, but to find common ground from which a a peaceful coexistance can occur.” No where does it ask you to renounce your beliefs, you chose to spin it that way!Salaam (that means peace, so chill!)
posted October 16, 2007 at 11:15 am
No where does it ask you to renounce your beliefs, you chose to spin it that way!A good discussion on “spin” and “taking things out of context” is given here:A Common Word Between Us and You is a Call for ConversionIn the article, it notes that the letter’s citing of the passage:Say: O People of the Scripture! Come to a common word between us and you: that we shall worship none but God, and that we shall ascribe no partner unto Him, and that none of us shall take others for lords beside God. And if they turn away, then say: Bear witness that we are they who have surrendered (unto Him). (Aal ‘Imran 3:64) sounds wonderful, but when shown in context of the entire passage:3:65: Ye, People of the Book! Why dispute ye about Abraham, when the Law and the Gospel were not revealed till after him? Have ye no understanding?3:66: Ah! Yes are those who fell to disputing (even) in matters of which ye had some knowledge! But why dispute ye in matters of which ye have no knowledge? It is Allah who knows and ye who know not!3:67: Abraham was not a Jew, nor yet a Christian, but he was true in Faith, and bowed his will to Allah’s (which is Islam) and he joined not gods with Allah.3:68: Without doubt, among men, the nearest of kin to Abraham are those who follow him, as are also this Apostle and those who believe: And Allah is the Protector of those who have Faith.3:69: It is the wish of a section of the People of the Book to lead you astray. But they shall lead astray (not you), but themselves, and they do not perceive.3:70: Ye People of the Book! Why reject ye the Signs of Allah, of which ye are (yourselves) witnesses?3:71: Ye People of the Book! Why do you clothe Truth with falsehood, and conceal the Truth while ye have knowledge?the verse is anything but a call for understanding and common ground. Michelle nailed this one (as have others.)
posted October 16, 2007 at 11:33 am
I think you understand perfectly what it means. Islam respects power. So why not speak to the ignorant to try dividing nations on those whom seek peace at all costs. Clever ploy really and this does test the waters for them.. Suras 2-9 keep them quite safe for keeping promises with those not of Islam.
posted October 16, 2007 at 11:37 am
t shouldn’t be outlandish to thin that there is a group of Muslims that wants to start a dialogue. Again, with dialogue one must not water down his or her faith. Muslims don’t believe Christ was divine. But, the point of this document was not to call for us to reject Christ, but a call to come together in love. The dialogue portion is where they don’t compromise their beliefs.Yes, the Qur’an does reject Christ’s divinity. This is no surprise. Muslims will never accept Christ. What must happen is people of different faiths have to get together, discuss their differences and find a way to reconcile them so we can find peace. As long as we are suspicious of all Muslim attempts to find a peaceful outcome there will be suspicion on the Muslim side.I think, and read this document as, Muslims are trying to start a dialogue. This is a start to finding reconciliation. And yes, there can be reconciliation netween Christians and Muslims without conversion on either side.-Seth
posted October 16, 2007 at 12:40 pm
It shouldn’t be outlandish to thin that there is a group of Muslims that wants to start a dialogue.I agree. It should not be that outlandish to want to start a dialogue.But, the point of this document was not to call for us to reject Christ, but a call to come together in love. You were doing so well up until this point. One of the most important basis of love is truth. We can argue all you want about the validity of different faith’s beliefs and the veracity behind those beliefs. Yet the fact of the matter is that the letter presents the idea of “see? We agree on things like the nature of God!” as a “common ground” when in fact, the nature of God is one of the very things that divides and separates the two faiths. To present the idea that Christians and Muslims believe in the same God is not truthful. To try and establish a dialogue based on a lie is not productive, and certainly not done in “love.”
posted October 16, 2007 at 12:42 pm
True a dialog would be a good start BUT a dialog from the very beginning dishonestly present what is in the Quran. Conversion, funny you mention that. In most of the countries with Sheria Law in place as the model of government Conversion to Christianity is punished by death. The battle unfortunately is not about faith but in the arena of ideas. I find it wrong to kill innocents because they are easier targets and make them look really mean. 130 Muslim scholars don’t speak out and condemn suicide bombers. They don’t speak out against what Iran is doing to the region in promoting death in the NAME of ISLAM. Why all of a sudden do they want peace? Why is it that we (America)are identified as Christians? The conflict was defined (for them, by them) as that between Islam and Christians way before this war started by Asama Bin Ladin. Way before the current president was in office. Why not redefine this conflict as against the radicals of Islam against civilization? I mean really, defining us as the ‘great Satan’? I guess they watch Jerry Springer too. Forgive me for being pessimistic about doubting the scholars whom seem to be consistent at telling us one thing but not really meaning it. The past tells us a lot about the future. When I see something like this is see as stated above – an opportunity for division. I would talk to them to see if they mean what they say but I wont expect anything, I don’t see them being truthful.
posted October 16, 2007 at 1:19 pm
130 Muslim scholars have defined this war as between Christians and Muslims, it is not. The war is about countries DEFENDING themselves against radical Islam whom have already declared war against us. Who is us you ask? Those not of Islam and not practicing Sheria Law.
posted October 16, 2007 at 10:11 pm
“You are now with child and you will have a son. You shall name him Ishmael, for the LORD has heard of your misery. He will be a wild donkey of a man; his hand will be against everyone and everyone’s hand against him, and he will live in hostility toward all his brothers.” – Genesis 16:11-12Islam is the religion of the spiritual descendants of Ishmael. It is good to strive for peace, but you can’t undo what God has decreed.