I have a co-worker from Pakistan who is pretty religious. He said that the level of religiosity in Muslim societies outside of the middle east is similar to the West. However there are what he called passport Muslims who list Islam on official forms but are not at all religious.
So I find it pretty believable that some parents in Indonesia would list Islam on forms and have marginal participation while not really being at all religious.

That ‘background’ could very well be going to that school, and having a former Muslim for a father.
Its nice that you put a tiny addendum in the form of a link, that you don’t note is NOT to the Spectator, but to a fact checker.
How are YOU defining Muslim? If it is what a person believes, then he was never a Muslim. He never made a voluntary profession of faith, and he never practiced, according to his own words.
If it is the legal definition of some Muslim states (but not here, so not sure why that would count), then simply having a father who at one time became a Muslim (though he was non-practicing by the time he married Barack’s mother) then I’m not an atheist, I’m an LCMS Lutheran.
Personally, in matters pertaining to religion, I (ironic for the atheist, hmm?) think belief trumps legal status.
He has a background that means he knows what Islam is, and what Muslims practice. Doesn’t make him a Muslim (his brother would’ve called him an apostate if he’d actually BEEN a Muslim. There is no simple ‘Muslim background’ for actual Muslims).
Oh, and your ‘Spectator’ post, his own words do NOT state that he was a Muslim. It says he went to their school, and like someone going to certain Catholic schools, learned their prayers.
That makes him about as much a Muslim as my knowing the Lord’s Prayer by heart makes me a Christian. And I guarantee, if my parents were to have marked down anything under ‘religion’ for me, it would’ve been Christian.
Doesn’t make it accurate.
As the saying goes, if going to church (or Muslim school) makes a person a Christian, or a Muslim, then going to a garage makes you a car.

The Koran has plenty to say about Jesus, although denying Jesus as the son of God. With some modernist waffling, there is no telling where Obama really is. A theologian a few months back insisted she was both Christian and Muslim. My understanding is that to become a Muslim, all you need to do is repeat a phrase twice about Allah being one with mohammed as his prophet, which some children have done here in California under multi-cultural studies. After this, it is the death penalty if you convert to something else.
Still, Islam is the most extreme of legalistic religions, whereas Obama’s modernist religion is the most extreme of licentiousness. Certainly modernists will approve of a government funded Islamic charter school while fighting Christian charter schools, but I don’t see Obama as being Muslim.

Outside of Turkey there are relatively few secular Muslims. But as long as he doesn’t put a prayer rug in the White House…
It’s gonna be a long election.

Michelle, sitting in madrassa long enough to absorb a few lines of the Koran no more makes you a Muslim than writing a blog and calling it Reformed Chicks Blabbing makes you a Christian.
There are Jews who think Christmas trees are pretty, there are department stores in Japan that run Easter sales (notably one with a window display of Santa hung on a cross so that Jesus’s rabbit will give all good children Easter eggs), and there are Christians who find the opening words of the Muslim call to prayer phonically beautiful. Why do you not help Obama articulate a real Christian witness rather constantly trying to smear him? The result might surprise and please you.

PS
Thanks for the link to the alternate view.

“But as long as he doesn’t put a prayer rug in the White House…”
how very unamerican of you.

“[N]o religious Test shall ever be required as a Qualification to any Office or public Trust under the United States.

i believe obama when he says he is a christian more than i believe some of the hateful, spiteful, and rude republicans (and so-called conservatives) on this blog when they say the same.
Yes, he says now that he was never a Muslim but that’s not what he was saying last year.”
because he once studied the koran and apparently is smart enough to be able to remember the arabic call to prayer? or because he thinks the call to prayer is ‘one of the prettiest sounds on earth at sunset.’ i like the sound of the birds singing at sunrise, i guess that means that i’m a meadowlark. i can recall the recipe for egg drop soup. i guess i’m chinese, too.
conservative logic is amazing.
“BTW, don’t shoot the messenger.”
why not?
“There are discrepancies in his story that the MSM won’t ask him about but that won’t stop the Internet from asking.”
you’re wild imagination is making up discrepancies on a subject that is of no consequence to the election.
“We’re not in the tank for him and have legitimate questions.”
i’ve yet to see one, because this isn’t it.

Melanie Phillips wrote a good column this week that discusses some of these sorts of quesions about Obama:
http://www.spectator.co.uk/melaniephillips/771896/princess-obama-derangement-syndrome.thtml

He’s a Muslim. His father was Muslim so he’s a Muslim. That’s how they see it. He doesn’t get to choose. In there minds he is an apostate. That’s why hell never be able to travel to a Muslim country, because as an apostate, he’s under an automatic death sentence. Security would be way too risky if he went there.

I took a Yoga class once. Does that make me a Hindu?

Both his father and step-father were Muslim and he studied Islam at his school.
And that makes him a Muslim how? His mother and grandmother, who were by all reports far more influential in raising him, were not Muslim. Why isn’t that “compelling?”
Are you saying that you are in a program that does not study other religious texts? Or if you are and you study the Koran, does that make you a Muslim?
If you are not and you don’t, you may not be a Muslim but you and your fellow students are living in a self-confirming bell jar and I don’t think much of your curriculum.

Oh, for the love of…
Honestly, all this incessant scare-mongering about whether or not Obama is or was a Muslim (hint: he’s not) is beyond tiresome. All of the controversies during the primary surrounded his Christian church and his Christian pastor saying some ridiculous things. And it’s a church that Obama, as many people like to point out, was a member of for nigh on 20 years.
Barack Obama is a Christian. He is baptized in the faith, as are his wife and children. Those are the facts. Anything else is just a bunch of nonsense.

Last I read, the bearing of false witness is a sin…….
not a job description.
There are some people running around calling themselves “Christian’ who would do well to remember this.

LJG, I think what Blabbing Chick is telling us is that Reverend Wright is a Muslim and the United Church of Christ is a division of Islam. And RG, I believe the Reformed perspective could be restated as that their sins don’t count, just other people’s, to whom they are superior by virtue of divine election.

It seems to me that the answer to the question of Obama’s religion is a bit like this:
Christian answer: Mainline-anity.
Mainline answer: Christian.
Atheist answer: Yup, religious.
Sharia law answer: Apostate Muslim.
God’s answer: We will find out eventually.

Isn’t McCain an Irish name? Do you suppose he worships leprechauns? Was he taught about leprechauns in school? I’m sure he was. This can only mean that McCain will give America to the Druids, or at the very least continue tax breaks to pagan mistletoe gatherers.

And I thought the answer to the question of Obama’s religion was what faith he actively professes. The man says he is a Christian, and that he considers Christ his Lord and Savior. And he was baptized in the Christian faith.
As far as I am concerned, that answers the question. He’s not a Muslim no matter how many of his critics wish otherwise.
Trying to raise doubts about his faith, or trying to suggest that he’s a “closet Muslim”, or some other McCarthy-style garbage, is pure political nonsense.

described the call to prayer as ‘one of the prettiest sounds on Earth at sunset.’
I’ll second that …

And Jesus is your hero, Michelle? Somehow it’s hard to imagine Jesus propagating insidious rumors for political purposes. How DO you square that, anyway?

Forget Obama’s background for a minute. There’s some great news on the Evangelical Republican front!
Praise the Republican Evangelical Jesus! Glory to his oil baron elite in the highest!
This just in, McCain is having one of Bush’s Midland TX oil buddies raise money for him. He has incredible values that must be representative of some Republicans because he’s a money changer in their temples. Here’s the rest from AP (You can cut & paste the address below to see it for yourself):
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080614/ap_on_el_pr/mccain_fundraiser;_ylt=ArHTQcm1sHNfCBtjPfydP3Os0NUE
“a Texas oilman (Clayton Williams) who once joked that women should give in while being raped.
The Texan, Republican Clayton “Claytie” Williams, made the joke during his failed 1990 campaign for governor against Democrat Ann Richards. Williams compared rape to the weather, saying, “As long as it’s inevitable, you might as well lie back and enjoy it.” He also compared Richards to the cattle on his ranch, saying he would “head her and hoof her and drag her through the dirt.”
Williams’ comments made national news at the time and remain easy to find on the Internet. Even so, McCain’s campaign said it hadn’t known about the remarks.”
Claytie has raised $300,000 for our conservative friends! Praise the GOP Jesus! Yay!
Soon we’ll be going to war with Iran!

I’ll have to agree with Moonshadow that the huzzein (or whatever they call it), is quite beautiful. Everyone knows Satan is attractive.

Michele: “We’re not in the tank for him and have legitimate questions.”
LOL. I wonder what those questions are? Obama says he’s a Christian and McGinty says she Reformed. I don’t know who to believe. But as far as Obama being a Muslim, the issue on the right seems to be that he is some sort of sleeper agent who is going to become President and then surrender to the “Muslims.” [I think Michele would be lovely in a burka, by the way.] Now, that assumes Al Qaeda was somehow able to manipulate the system so that Obama would go to Harvard Law, become a US Senator and then the presidential nominee. If that’s really the case, then we might as well surrender now because it would mean they are a whole lot smarter than we are. Michele, were you able to track down any information on that terrorist fist bump the bad Michelle and Barack did? Was that the signal?

“How are YOU defining Muslim? If it is what a person believes, then he was never a Muslim. He never made a voluntary profession of faith, and he never practiced, according to his own words.”
Where am I doing that? I just noted and linked. See? Shooting the messenger does not win you arguments.
“Its nice that you put a tiny addendum in the form of a link, that you don’t note is NOT to the Spectator, but to a fact checker.”
Do you think that the fact checker is any less of an opinion piece than the blog entry I linked to?

ZZ: “He’s a Muslim. His father was Muslim so he’s a Muslim. That’s how they see it. He doesn’t get to choose. In there minds he is an apostate”
Is it relevant what their definitions are? This is an election within our culture and shouldn’t it be our definitions that count? I think the security argument is a red herring because any US president is in danger from Islamic extremists.
ZZ: “Everyone knows Satan is attractive.”
I’m not going to argue this point but I would like to understand what you mean by it.

“Why do you not help Obama articulate a real Christian witness rather constantly trying to smear him? ”
I’m not trying to smear him, only pointing to the questions that the MSM refuses to ask. There is a discrepancy and this will continue if it looks like Obama is refusing to answer.

“conservative logic is amazing.” Yes, it is isn’t it?
“”There are discrepancies in his story that the MSM won’t ask him about but that won’t stop the Internet from asking.”
you’re wild imagination is making up discrepancies on a subject that is of no consequence to the election.”
Actually there are some who are saying that they won’t vote for Obama because they think he’s a Muslim. This issue does impact the race and Obama should address it by clearing up these discrepancies.

“I took a Yoga class once. Does that make me a Hindu?’
The issue isn’t if he’s a Muslim today, it’s if he was ever a Muslim as he contends. Evidently his brother thinks he was.

“Are you saying that you are in a program that does not study other religious texts? Or if you are and you study the Koran, does that make you a Muslim?”
I’m not saying that because he studied religious texts that makes him a Muslim, I’m only asking the question. His father and step-father were Muslims and he went to a school in which he studied the Koran and was listed as Muslim under religion. And then he tells us he was never Muslim? At least it rates an explanation, not a charge of smearing and ignoring the issue.
BTW, we don’t study other religious texts, we have more than enough to keep us busy studying the Bible.

“And RG, I believe the Reformed perspective could be restated as that their sins don’t count, just other people’s, to whom they are superior by virtue of divine election.”
Rob, since you haven’t a clue what you are talking about, you should refrain from speaking for the Reformed.
A Calvinist understands their sin, otherwise why would we be a Christian? We understand our need for a Savior and that we fall short of the glory of God. Our sins are just as much a rebellion against God as anyone else’s. We understand it only too well.
How about your sin, Rob? Or is only the reformed who have that problem.

Evidently, Michele, the brother he wasn’t actually raised with was wrong.
Or was using a definition that we don’t for religious membership. Such as ‘your father was a member’.
And the point is, none of it is new information. Everyone knows he went to the Muslim school. They also know he never made the shahada, the voluntary proclamation of belief that makes you officially a Muslim.
He had no control over what his father signed him in as at the Catholic school, he was a kid. But it appeared to be done to avoid having to participate in the religious observances that were required for Catholic enrollees.
Beyond that, how could he prove a negative to your satisfaction?
Last, do you think he’s a Muslim now? Do you think he actively practiced Islam, or, no matter whose standards, was ever a Muslim in anything but the most ‘technicality’ sort of way?
If not, what the heck does it have to do with anything? My parents likely signed me as Christian on tons of things. I say I never was.
So, do you say that I was a Christian all those years because of my parents signature? My sisters would likely say I was, because I didn’t tell tell them different.
What if I found out that in the 60′s, during a period of religious exploration (and before my birth), my father briefly practiced Islam? Does that suddenly make me a Muslim? By this standard, apparently.
But I would say my OWN view of what I believed and followed is more accurate than what other people think.
Do you think that a person truly is a Muslim (or any other faith) because their parents were? Is that what, to you, makes a person a member?
If not, then by your own standards, and by his own (the standards of someone who isn’t Muslim, after all), he never was. It was nothing more than the technicality of a religion, and of certain national laws that he never belonged to anyway, so they don’t apply to him.

BTW, according to Muslim beliefs, /everyone/ is ‘born a Muslim’. God made everyone initially a Muslim until they actively embrace a different faith. So, according to their rules (if we’re, apparently, going to care about their rules and define people accordingly), YOU used to be a Muslim.

“Forget Obama’s background for a minute.”
The response to Obama’s problem isn’t McCain’s. Sorry, separate issues and as I mentioned in a previous comment, one the voters are getting hung up on. Deal with the issue at hand.
I think it’s telling that not one of you addressed his brother’s comment. I guess it’s much easier to bring up McCain’s problems or attack the messenger than to explain why his own brother thought he grew up as a Muslim.

I did.
I noted that he didn’t grow UP with this brother. He didn’t grow up, past a certain point, with his father.
His brother, being Muslim, is likely using Muslim criteria for membership, which includes that their father was. However, this isn’t the sort of criteria WE use for religious membership.
So, unless you’re going to call an atheist with a Christian parent a ‘Christian’, Obama is no more Muslim than that.

Obama’s parents separated, then divorced when Obama was just a few years old. His father moved back to Kenya, remarried, and it was THERE that his siblings, a half brother and sister, were born and raised. He even notes meeting his sister, for the first time, as an adult in his biograpy.
They have no more idea of Obama’s life after his father left than anyone else.

I’ll have to agree with Moonshadow that the huzzein (or whatever they call it), is quite beautiful. Everyone knows Satan is attractive.
Sorry to disagree but God has a monopoly on beauty:
Finally, brothers, whatever is true, whatever is honorable, whatever is just, whatever is pure, whatever is lovely, whatever is commendable, if there is any excellence, if there is anything worthy of praise, think about these things.

Great first Obama trashes the only true knowlegeable woman Hillary, because she beat him in the popular vote. The dem. said, thanks but no thanks woman, stay home, work, and just stay out of the White house.
Then he trashes Palin, only because he miss the chance of a great woman. And she should be afraid, we woman, the real woman, not hollywood dummies, know it’s time for a real leader McCain, and Palin will learn from him. What will Biden teach the want to be leader? You dem. have it backwards as usual. You but the cart before the horse. Now he’s a Muslim. He’s white when he wants to be, and black when he wants to be. A voter in the Senate when he wants to be, and doesn’t want to be told on. Give me a break, now he’s a Muslin? Will the real “God” help us know something truthful about this want to be Leader.