Without the God part of course. Parents want an environment to raise their children with like minded people. They want an community that meets regularly where they learn to raise their kids:
They are not religious, so they don't go to church. But they are searching for values and rituals with which to raise their children, as well as a community of like-minded people to offer support.Nothing like organized religion to raise your kids, huh?Dozens of parents came together on a recent Saturday to participate in a seminar on humanist parenting and to meet others interested in organizing a kind of nonreligious congregation, complete with regular family activities and ceremonies for births and deaths.
"It's exciting to know that we could be meeting people who we might perhaps raise children with," said Tony Proctor, 39, who owns a wealth management company and attended the seminar at Harvard University with his wife, Andrea, 35, a stay-at-home mother.
[...]
The seminar's organizers wanted to reach out to people like the Proctors -- first-time parents scrambling for guidance as they improvise how to raise their daughter without the religion of their childhood.
And then there's this:
People often ask, "How do you expect to raise your children to be good people without religion?" said Dale McGowan, the seminar leader and author of "Parenting Beyond Belief." He suggested the retort might be something like, "How do you expect to raise your children to be moral people without allowing them to think for themselves?" He advocates exposing children to many religious traditions without imposing any.How are these children thinking for themselves? If they ever expressed a belief in God or that there was a divine Creator, wouldn't they stamp out that thought, not encourage it?
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Cy,
You said: I was also wondering where you got your list of atheists. I noticed you had them in alphabetical order, and left out the three you mentioned later, Lincoln, Jefferson and Franklin. What leads you to believe Franklin and Jefferson were Christian haters?
Boris says: Oh I don’t know. Their OWN words maybe:
“I have recently been examining all the known superstitions of the world, and do not find in our particular superstition (Christianity) one redeeming feature. They are all alike, founded upon fables and mythologies.” – Thomas Jefferson
“The Christian god is a three headed monster; cruel vengeful and capricious… One only needs to look at the caliber of people who say they serve him. They are always of two classes: fools and hypocrites.” - Thomas Jefferson
“Christianity is the most perverted system that ever shone on man… perverted into and engine for enslaving mankind… a mere contrivance [for the clergy] to filch wealth and power to themselves.” - Thomas Jefferson
“Lighthouses are more helpful than churches.” – Benjamin Franklin
“The way to see by faith is to shut the eye of reason.” - Benjamin Franklin
Before he became involved in politics Abraham Lincoln wrote a treatise against Christianity, arguing that the Bible was not God’s revelation and Jesus was not the son of God. After his assassination, his former law partner said Abraham was “an avowed and open infidel, sometimes bordering on atheism… He went further against Christian beliefs and doctrines and principles than any man I ever heard.” Lincoln was assassinated by a Bible believing Christian.
“It will not do to investigate the subject of religion too closely, as it is apt to lead to infidelity.” - Abraham Lincoln
Sorry for the confusion, Karen. I should have put quotation marks around Christian haters to indicate I was quoting Boris. I would never make the assertion that an atheists is necessarily a Christian hater.
Thanks for the quotes, Boris. While they clearly speak to Jefferson's and Franklin's antipathy towards 18th century Christianity, "hate" is too strong a word to apply, at least based on these statements.
Ad hominem arguments aren't convincing for me. John Booth was a "Bible believing Christian" (is there another kind?), and Josef Stalin was an atheist. Now we’re back where we started when we weren’t calling each other names.
I apologize for taking so long to reply. I bookmarked the page on my work computer, and we’ve been on holiday schedule since. I couldn’t remember where this conversation was happening.
Cy
It seems odd that they are trying to find something that works to try to teach their children the difference between right and wrong and yet, want to exclude the standard, (God), that establishes this very distinction. All our morality i, is an attempt to come as closely as possible to the ideal, which is absolute morality. Where else can an example of absoulte morality be found aside from God?
God Bless
Charlie,
As an atheist and parent of a two-year-old, I would like to find places with the sense of communtity that I had in my childhood church. However, I do not want my child to be exposed to the fear of eternal torture, or the irrational belief of extraterrestrial rewards for their behaviors. I am teaching my son to behave rationally, to take the role of the other, and to own his choices. I think that these are the bedrock of morality, not anyone's conception of a god. I think tha tyour comments beg the question, since those that don't believe in the Christian (or any other religion's) god also don't believe that morality is based on any god. Personally, I believe the exact opposite; gods were invented to personalize the morality that people had already (correctly or incorrectly) rationalized.
Thanks,
Rance
I don't want kids, but if i did, i wouldn't want them near a church. If its not the priest, its a sports coach, or Sunday school teacher. not just men, but women too. Its easier for these things to be done when no one will accuse a person of the church of any wrong doing ( although lately, things are changing ). Although People are people everywhere, ( age, sex, color, country, religion and non religion ), its easier to do these things hiding behind the idea of god ( no caps ).
FundamentalCharlie
January 3, 2009 3:05 PM
http://www.thefundamentalist.info
It seems odd that they are trying to find something that works to try to teach their children the difference between right and wrong and yet, want to exclude the standard, (God), that establishes this very distinction. All our morality i, is an attempt to come as closely as possible to the ideal, which is absolute morality. Where else can an example of absoulte morality be found aside from God?
God Bless
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