This information also suggests strongly that reason, while important to moral behavior, is not nearly as important as emotional instinct.
I think this is a good way of explaining the success of the Church of Latter Day Saints to Christians who are want to view Mormons as a cult. That is, while their rationale to accept the Book of Mormon as truth is wrong, they still lead moral lives guided by Christ because of their emphasis on self-control (the denial of gambling, alcohol, caffeine, etc.)

Why are converts better? Probably not because of the quality of the Protestant churches they convert to or the syncretism of the Catholic Church they leave. It’s probably because they are converts, people who make a conscious decision to learn about a faith, immerse themselves in it, including its moral teachings, and adopt it as their own.
People born to a particular faith, on the other hand, view it as a birthright, as part of the background family and communal culture. And so they feel freer to pick and choose the parts of the faith that appeal to them. If a convert disagrees with a particular religion’s teachings, they’ll just find a different religion to convert to that suits them better.
That Protestant converts keep Catholic morals better is hardly surprising. As far as morality goes, they mostly teach the same things.
***
This latter finding offers scientific validation for the Orthodox Christian tradition of frequent fasts as a way to build self-control (N.B., in Orthodoxy, a goal of the moral life is to overcome the passions — not, to be clear, to live in total denial of the passions, but to gain control over them, lest they control you). Lehrer indicates that whatever one believes about the life of the spirit, to practice routine self-denial amounts to an exercise in increasing one’s neurological faculties of self-control.
Yup, this is likely true. I doubt many would complain that religion doesn’t teach good practical skills, self-denial among them. But it’s not the only way of acquiring those skills; plenty of atheists have them too, they just acquire them in other ways.
Does this point to the fundamental verity of religious teachings? Not particularly. After all, many religions teach self denial (others, as you note, may teach different things), but Christianity would hardly teach that they are all true on that basis, even if it admits that they are useful.

I think Geoff G. has it dead right here. I suspect if you looked at Catholic converts from Lutheranism in Norway, you’d find that the Catholic converts were better Lutherans then the Lutherans. Catholicism in Brazil, like Lutheranism in Scandinavia, is the default: it’s the tradition that most people were brought up in, and what they call themselves if they haven’t got any particularly strong feelings to the contrary.
In other words, it’s a matter of the proverbial zeal of the convert.

I’d agree that there’s a lot of the “zeal of the convert” phenomenon going on here, and I’d bet that it occurs in either direction.
This latter finding offers scientific validation for the Orthodox Christian tradition of frequent fasts as a way to build self-control (N.B., in Orthodoxy, a goal of the moral life is to overcome the passions — not, to be clear, to live in total denial of the passions, but to gain control over them, lest they control you).
As I was reading this, before I even got to this line in Rod’s original post, this sprang to mind. It seems to me that Orthodoxy has a more highly developed and effective ascetical theology than Western Christianity, Catholic or Protestant (though for those born into Orthodoxy, it may be taken for granted or unknown, as is all too often the case for “cradle” fill-in-the-blanks). It also occurst to me, having studied Buddhism for a long time before becoming Catholic, and still drawing insights from it, that it has some powerful tools for dealing with emotions and desires.
Of course, much of the pop-Buddhism around doesn’t get this, but it’s definitely there, especially in the Theravada tradition.

The 12-step movement figured out long ago that people can successfully fight only one addiction at a time. Which is why most 12-step meetings (except those specifically set up for nonsmokers) billow with tobacco smoke and go through multiple pots of coffee.

It seems worth while to consider the conclusion of the researchers – that it is Catholic syncretism which may be the issue in Brazil – we discussed recently how south american catholicism has incorporated elements of pagan beliefs that pre dated the introduction of Catholicism but that the protestant religions in south america have not yet absorbed these elements. The protestant religions are non-syncrenistic so to say. There is research – as well as anecdotal evidence that many of us might be able to attest to – that conversion is often affected by a desire (conscious or not) for upward mobility. The classic example is people coverting in the past to Episcopal church since that was the “upper class” religion. There are studies that demonstrate that africans will convert to Catholicism and Mormonism as an “upwardly mobile” move. I would consider that a religion (Catholicism) which is associated with old pagan beliefs in SA- beliefs that are perceived as being associated with peasants, poverty and superstition – would be abandoned by people who desire upward mobility. We have also discussed here the emphasis on prosperity among protestant churches in south america. If the protestant churches are attracting those who greatly desire prosperity and the belief that “right” behavior is more likely to result in God rewarding you with prosperity – then more adherence to moral behavior is not surprising.
there is a world of research out there that demonstrates that social groups – of whatever stripe – which articulate their norms effectively and enforce those norms by ejecting the non conformist- have members who will adhere to the norms. This will be particularly true when an individual’s life is totally involved in that group – a Mormon in Utah for example or the Amish (who practice shunning) or excommunication back in the middle ages or even teenage high school norms. Such practices not only cut you off from the larger social group – they also affected your economic status.

I would consider that a religion (Catholicism) which is associated with old pagan beliefs in SA- beliefs that are perceived as being associated with peasants, poverty and superstition – would be abandoned by people who desire upward mobility.
As for the associations that Catholicism may have in various Latin American countries, I would also suggest that the past history of close ties between the Catholic Church and the government/military of some of these countries might also play a part in people’s desire to put some distance between themselves and various aspects and symbols of the political/military past of their country.

Lehrer indicates that whatever one believes about the life of the spirit, to practice routine self-denial amounts to an exercise in increasing one’s neurological faculties of self-control.
And, if not a key to the kingdom, certainly a key to a better life is discovering the value of delayed gratification.

I am sure that the finding regarding converts reflects the fact that anyone who makes the effort to change their religious affiliation must really care about, and be serious about, spiritual and moral self-development. Within any religion there will be people with varying degrees of interest, seriousness and energy to devote to their self-development. But converts to any religion represent only the high end of that spectrum. More interesting would be to examine the effects of particular rituals on particular ethical behaviors.
One example: recently, as part of a school project, I performed a statistical analysis of some data from the 2001-2002 National Jewish Population Survey. During this process I found that Orthodox Jews volunteer and give charity at sharply higher levels than do non-Orthodox Jews. (Lest you think the key difference is in philosophy instead of in action, know also that keeping kosher is also itself, positively correlated with volunteering, regardless of denomination.

David siad: I would also suggest that the past history of close ties between the Catholic Church and the government/military of some of these countries might also play a part in people’s desire to put some distance between themselves and various aspects and symbols of the political/military past of their country.
Yes but others claim it is the epidemic of liberation theology and marxism among the RC clergy which creted disaffection with the RC Church – either way – these may explain why people became disaffected with catholicism but it does not address the question Greeley (and Rod) bring up – why would those who leave Catholicism for protestantism behave more correctly.
One could I guess speculate that Catholcism approached poverty from either the consolation POV or the revolutionary POV and neither is satisfactory for those who choose to convert. The message of “do right” and be rewarded by prosperity that some protestant denominations active in SA offer may have been a very much more appealing message which offers more immediate rewards for being good.
Rod – re: the question of what characteristics of religion promote better conformity to morals – have you ever read Durkheim? Two of his works come to mind. First – in his pionering work on suicide he discovers that suicide rates are lower among people who are involved in a religion which empasizes community as opposed to individualism. He states that it is the degree to which one is connected to others which is the determining factor. In The Elementary Forms of Religious Life – a book I think you would find extremely interesting re: this topic – he rejects Kant and asserts that morality is not simply about avoiding penalties but is also “an object of desire”. He noted that the more sacred something becomes the less “obligation” plays a role in shaping behavior. He stated that those religions which create a balance between grace and law, love and duty were most successful in shaping behavior.

There is a Catholic Church in River Forest, Illinois which was built with mafia money and to this day no one is quite sure who inhabits its foundations.
So much for religion and morality.

I think that religion does make us moral. We have values. As man left alone. He is nothing more than a mammal or beast. So, if he does not or is not taught right from wrong. He would surely kill at will, molest without guilt, steal, lie, cheat, and more than likely die by the sword that he used.
Morality and morals come through the parents beliefs. Learning right from wrong and then seeing others actions and the result of the seeds growing in their lives.
God Bless Us All.

From the description of the Brazil, it isn’t clear if it demonstrates that people who convert from Catholicism to Protestantism become more moral or already were more loyal. The “more moral” might have been self-selected to convert for some reason.

Charles Cosimano
January 27, 2010 12:55 AM
There is a Catholic Church in River Forest, Illinois which was built with mafia money and to this day no one is quite sure who inhabits its foundations.
So much for religion and morality.
So have “Paulie Walnuts” or whomever declared a saint, and bada bing, you have a shrine.

Good and informative posts by Cecilia. I’d forgotten about Durkheim.