Yes … and it seems to be that many of the people who hold that view don’t even understand that they’re making a religious statement when they say ‘human life begins at conception’.
To abstract my comment on your previous post … more … they appear to be willing to use the law to force their religious beliefs on unbelievers. To the extent that this is true it is not, I believe, in accordance with the precepts that have made this country one of the most religious in the world. … and they don’t realize or believe that the use of force (which is what law is) to create religous observence is BAD for RELIGION.
I didn’t give a rats about that before I became religious myself but now … it drives me nuts that they can’t see it.

Steven,
Of course, I agree.
However, I have also noticed that the same people defending the use of torture by Bush#43 are alSteven,
Of course, I agree.
However, I have also noticed that the same people defending the use of torture by Bush#43 are also the same ones who are adamant on denying me human status as a gay man. The same ones who refuse to recognize me as a Christian because I am gay and flat-out state their desire to sunder my marriage to another man.
Why are we surprised that they, then, refuse to recognize the separation of church and state here?
Let’s face it – a small but very vocal number of Christians in the US want to overturn our Constitution and create a State based on their definition of Christianity.
It’s pointless to even try to reach out to these hateful, mean-spirited people. We have to finally stand up for our rights and fight them with every means available to us. They have taken our God and our religion hostage. It is time to stop cowering in a corner.
These people actually believe in torture. Why do we continue to cede them the moral high-ground?so the same ones who are adamant on denying me human status as a gay man. The same ones who refuse to recognize me as a Christian because I am gay and flat-out state their desire to sunder my marriage to another man.
Why are we surprised that they, then, refuse to recognize the separation of church and state here?
Let’s face it – a small but very vocal number of Christians in the US want to overturn our Constitution and create a State based on their definition of Christianity.
It’s pointless to even try to reach out to these hateful, mean-spirited people. We have to finally stand up for our rights and fight them with every means available to us. They have taken our God and our religion hostage. It is time to stop cowering in a corner.
These people actually believe in torture. There is no basis for dealing with such people. They aren’t truly Christians. Christians don’t torture.

Well, gosh.
I think this interface has finally blown a fuse.
Sorry about the mess of my last posting – I always copy and paste after the “gotcha” has expired (and I wish these gotchas would expire).
Heaven only knows what happened.
Yikes!

Mr. Raushenbush,
You stumbled into the truth about two of the primary issues in the culture wars: prenatal homicide and redefining marriage to accomodate whatever worldview floats your boat.
“While there is no question that Barack Obama supports full rights for gay people”
pbho may be surprised to know that is what “he believes without question”.
“…he [pbho]is the most radical pro-abortion president ever…”
That is not a ‘claim’ that is an demonstable and verifiable fact.
“…he [pbho] also has defenders among the pro-life crowd who appreciate his abortion reduction strategy.”
Names, please give some names of those ‘defenders’.
Please cite the specific ‘strategies’ and the verifiable data that abortions have been reduced as a result.
I humbly suggest that one indication that abortions have been reduced would be an accompanying rise in birth rates. You might look there first.
“Largely he [pbho] has his Council on Faith Based and Community Partnerships to thank for the muted tone of the culture wars.”
If by ‘muted tones’, you mean suppressed dissent, I might be inclined to consider your assertion.
Labeling people opposed to the killing of prenatal and premature infants born alive as a result of a botched attempt on their life by an abortionists’ and the majority of Americans who are having difficuly incorporating same sex unions into their understanding of marriage’ as right wing ‘terrorists’ and ‘extremists’ is not what I call extending the right hand of fellowship.
It is more like a slap in the face with an ‘olive branch’.
Not content to just repeal the executive order of the previous administration prohibiting federal funds from being used for HUMAN embryonic stem cell research, in the spirit of leftwing secular christianity, pbho went the ‘extra mile’ and issued his own executive order prohibiting the use of federal funds for research involving adult stems cells. Oddly enough the only method that has actually produced successful results.
yor bro ken

“But couldn’t pro-life activists at least ackowledge that to those who don’t happen to share those religious views, a zygote is not the same as a “baby” and therefore those who terminate that zygote are not “baby killers”?”
No they can’t. Or more accurately, they won’t. They know the truth, the whole truth, and will not alter their response, because they know the truth.

Its a shame that the media and politicians pretty much let the Catholic Church skate on the pedophile priests or these crunchycons would have been defending that, too. And yes, the Catholic church sure did get away with it. Imagine a large corporation where 30% of the executives admit to being involved in transferring and protecting pedophiles who preyed on children on corporation property (as 30% of Catholic bishops admitted in the Church’s own survey). Imagine the grand juries all over the country hauling in everyone from the cleaners on up to testify and forensics teams scraping every inch of the corporation’s facilities. I don’t recall very many TV talk shows on the pedophile priest scandal. Lawsuits are still in the courts and the Catholic Church is still pressuring politicians regarding statutes of limitation.
If it was a corporation, you couldn’t imagine both major party presidential candidates going to a charity dinner held by the corporation and making speeches full of jokes written by professional comedy writers. The Al Smith dinner is a creepy event. You couldn’t imagine a president going to one of the corporation’s plants and giving a speech honoring the corporation and taking an award from a 30%-pedophile-protection-racket-corporation. Its a damned shame there was so little public accountability for the size and scope of the evil and wrongdoing.

IT IS VERY SIMPLE SPERM AND EGG MEET= LIVING HUMAN BEING!!!!!!! GOD,PLEASE HELP EVERYONE TO UNDERSTAND THIS!

If someone says that the unborn in the womb is not a person and does not deserve personhood…then they wouldnt be opposed to abortion up until natural delivery, right?

There is nothing scarier to me than evangelists who claim they have THE truth and impose it onto others. What audacity. What ego.
Please God, help these people understand that a zygote that develops at the moment a sperm and egg meet is not a living human being. Please make them stop posing ridiculous questions about full term abortions.
Please help them to focus on the circumstances that lead a woman to feel she has no other choice than to terminate a pregnancy…
What each of us has been raised to believe is a result of the family, environment and events we have experienced. How can anyone assume that what they believe is what someone else should believe. Why not support a responsible search for one’s own truth?
Have you no faith in God?