What’s this “Acts 29″ stuff?

Acts 29 is a church planting organization. Most of the men who belong to Acts 29 live off of raised support and do not have large salaries. Rather, they struggle financially so that they are able to start a congregation in communities where none may exist.

Everyone in the whole congregation knows how much my entire package is. It is neither large nor small. The figures for my package and for everyone on the staff is published in our annual report, a document given to everyone in the church (including members and curious visitors). If there is something to hide – then there is someplace you do not want God to go. As soon as that is identified, you KNOW – like kids before Christmas – someone will work hard to go there to see what is being hidden. If you are ashamed – own the shame and make it right.

As a Presbyterian pastor in the PC(USA), every year the congregation I serve sees every detail of my terms of call — salary, housing allowance, Social Security, professional expenses, continuing education fund, money taken from salary for my 403(b) retirement account, money set aside for reimbursed medical expenses, and so on. Every detail is exposed.
Money, sex, and power, baby! Richard Foster hit it on the nail with his book. Those three are all temptations for all of us. And pastors are no exception (just check the news). And what’s great about this enforced transparency is that there is never any question about what I make or don’t make. It goes a long way toward gaining the trust in the face of so many money scandals. And it opens people up to talking about the money they make and their own struggles with it.

Other than the pot-shot at Acts 29, I agree. I may be one of the minority that believes that pastors should live modestly, even if they are independently wealthy through other means. The great commission isn’t over and there are too many people with needs to justify Christians living opulent lifestyles. Not to be legalistic about it, but it should be considered that many congregations will only raise to the level of holiness of the pastors. Jesus seemed to be more concerned about idolatry of money than… almost anything else, and when a pastor is free to idolize money, he will inadvertently preach it to his congregation.
At the same time, although less probable, another error would be for a pastor to intentionally take a salary too low in order to be seen by others and receive their praise. This is the same type of hypocrisy condemned in the sermon on the mount. The act itself seems pious, but rather than being from a love for God, the act stems from the idolatry of the praise of men.
For this reason I suggest to pastors: disclose your salary at least to a reasonable range (within a few thousand dollars). Live in a way that requires a degree sacrificial of living, give sacrificially, and be hospitable.

It is true that in Presbyterian (PCUSA) churches the congregation votes on the whole “salary package” – and that there are presbytery minimums that churches must meet. The understanding is that a pastor is living out a vocation, a call, and the church is not paying the pastor a “salary”, but is providing financial and housing security to enable the pastor not to have to work, so that his or her needs are taken care of and he or she is free to simply to serve the church.
However, it is also true that there are large PCUSA churches that do not report the pastor’s salary – just lump all the pastor/staff salaries together, assuring the congregation that they are most certainly above the minimum. kind of goes against the basic philosophy of caring for the pastor’s needs so the pastor can care for the congregation when there is a broad discrepancy between pastors in the same congregation, and they don’t even know what each other makes. And it is fascinating to see the report every year when all the churches in a presbytery have their pastors’ salaries all lined up and the one or two giant ones are hidden…

Ben, it’s interesting that you’re defensive of Acts 29. If the shoe fits, I’m not so sure it’s a pot-shot.

My mother works as an accountant for a Christian talk-show host who also runs his own non-profit organization (and is a former pastor), and she becomes infuriated every time she looks at expense reports. Aside from living in a massive house with only his wife, said pastor likes his own private planes and helicopters, which he writes off as business expenses. Of course, they must sit in first class, stay in five-star hotels, and refuse to share cars/planes, etc. This, of course, is not limited to him and his wife, but other heads in the organization.
What’s sad is that many people will leave large endowments to this organization in their wills, but so much of it goes to wasteful things like paying for drivers who can’t carpool, fancy hotels, and two more helicopters, rather than to the schools, wells, and orphanages the money is supposed to fund. For this reason, my mother has ceased donating part of her salary to her work.
While evangelicals will hate on Catholics, one thing is true–priests get jack-squat for salaries. A vast chunk of the money parishioners give goes directly to the Church or Diocese. Another chunk goes to specific groups that parish is sponsoring, like a sister parish in a third-world country. Very little goes to priests, and most priests live in a small community where everything is shared. Catholic non-profit organizations are also well-known for using the highest percentages of donations for the works it sets out to do (e.g, Food for the Poor, Maryknolls).

My concern about a pastor’s salary pales in comparison to the salaries of the members of his church rich enough to enable the construction of a mega-church through their tax deductible “charitable donations.”
It was always a mystery to me to see an otherwise modest pastor live in affluence, in a large home, raising 4 children with his “hot wife” and 2 SUV’s parked out front when his church financials stated he only made $45K for the year. That was until I realized that all that salary came from whatever church franchise was who were paying it and not the ‘private donations’ made by church members.

Such a great point, Stephanie!
What are your thoughts on pastors who are making money outside their “pastoring” role at their church? If they are making a significant amount (through book deals, public speaking engagements, private donations, etc.), should they stop drawing a salary or should they stop being the “pastor” of that church?
If a church has enough money to make a big budget Easter Sunday film at the same studios Spartacus was filmed at, it does make one wonder how much money the producer – er – “pastor” is making.

It is easier for a camel to go through the eye of the needle than for a rich man to enter the kingdom of heaven.
Let that be the guiding principle for pastor’s salaries.

It is okay for a pastor to have a salary, besides they’re working for everyone. It’s quite difficult for a pastor to survive his daily life without money.

Here is a thought – if the church members tithe they shouldbe able to pay for 1 full time minister for every 10 members. OK buildings etc take up about half the church budget but that still leaves 1 full time church employee for every 20 members. If this isn’t happening either the minister is getting more money than the average church member or the church members aren’t giving enough.
OK this is deliberately simplistic but it shold make members of churches think about the issues.

What about those religions that don’t pay the pastor a salary at all?
You mention the Mormons as not being open with their financial records, but their pastors serve without pay. Similarly, I think most Pentecostal ministers that I have meet work without pay. They usually have a “day job” that pays the bills. (Although all the ones I’ve met have been self-trained and tend to come from the poor and operate out of people’s homes rather then having an actual church building, so perhaps more established Pentecostals have paid pastors).
Does that change the the way we should view “secrecy” about financial records?

Yes, it is lovely for a pastor to live in a modest, financially responsible way. On the other hand, having viewed the other side of the coin and what a pastor has to go through and endure on an inter-personal level, and a matter of stress on the family life, they can’t ever possibly be paid enough. Sometimes the amount of bull-sh*t is so high, to quote Martin Sheen, “You need wings to stay above it……”. I guess that there is no winning in this situation. The blog you are reading is an example.

Obviously there will always be underpaid people in all occupations.
What SCCL is highlighting are those pastors who are quite blatantly living a less-than modest lifestyle. The $300 jeans, the flashy cars, the nice homes, huge vacations, etc.
I wouldn’t begrudge a pastor with a full-range of responsibilities a comfortable salary – I want my pastor to be comfortable and not have to struggle and live a nice lifestyle. But this is a calling, not a job.
What I don’t like seeing is a pastor who has far exceeded his capabilities within the role of pastoring and is sucking the tithe money from his congregation to fuel his own image – not the image of a pastor, but of a celebrity, an icon.
The fact of the matter is that because churches are not-for-profit, they should be held accountable with their finances. We know how much our mayor makes, even our president. Why? Because they are public servants, we pay taxes – we are paying their salaries. Likewise, we are paying the salary of the pastor through tithes – there needs to be full accountability and transparency.
As many people have mentioned before – there are also those private donations. It’s not uncommon for people in the congregation to give money, cars, homes, etc. directly to the pastor’s family. This should be included – and used – as tithes.
Simply put, pastors are called to a higher-level of accountability.

There are also those pastors who’ve set themselves up within the structure of the church so that they will never ever be fired (this usually happens in non-denominational churches).
Therefore, those pastors will ALWAYS draw a salary, deserved or not.

Greta, ‘not-for-profit’? More like not-for-prophet most of the time

The Charlotte Observer did an interview with mega-church pastor Steven Furtick about his fashion sense. Here were some choice Q&As:
Q: Do you wear designer clothing?
I like certain lines. I love Monarchy, mainly the shirts. I like Antik Denim jeans.
Q: Do you have a favorite brand of jeans?
I like Rock and Republic Jeans. We buy a lot of jeans from Jordano’s. We also like to Shop at Saks Off Fifth at Concord Mills. I like to go to Pure Denim in South Park.
Q: Where do you buy your shoes?
We get them from all over. I just ordered a Mark Nason black boot from Zappos.com. We got these great Ed Hardy’s at Niemen Marcus Last Call in Dallas. We get some from Buckle.
(http://hollyfurtick.typepad.com/the_preachers_wife/2009/01/style-file.html

This may be the only Ponzi scheme in history where the founder was the only one who didn’t get a cut of the action.

Silver and gold have I none. Some of these guys have more than they know what to do with. Send some of that action my way…I just gave my last two mites!

As a life-long member of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, I can tell you that our “pastors” as you call them, are not paid by the Church, but keep their regular employment. That’s why there is no need for disclosure as to “how much they make from Church service” as they do not financially profit at all from their Church responsibility. Do you announce how much you make in a public forum? Living in this country, we all have the freedom to announce or keep private that information. As for how other churches deal with their clergy, “We claim the privilege of worshiping All-mighty God, according to the dictates of our own conscience and allow all men the same privilege. Let them worship how, where or what they may.”

Acts 29, sure. Sovereign Grace Ministries, very similarly structured, too: http://www.sgmsurvivors.com/?p=1455

Alisa, cool, thanks for speaking up! I don’t know much about the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, it’s nice to get your input.
(What do you call the people who serve a more or less equivalent role to Catholic/Orthodox/Protestant priests and pastors?)
I really like that last quotation.

We had a church in the middle of making a new building…money was tight. We voted on every dime and nickle spent and the ministry humbly stated their salaries, because they had to be voted on as part of the budget. Somewhere near the end of the building being finished, the church finally found a permanant senior pastor, and things changed. One by one the rest of the church staff left or were replaced, and that pesky quorum (3/4% of members) required for every member vote (esp on leadership and budgets) was dropped. While I don’t think it was intentionally malicious…it was not the same as when every penny had to be accountable (and I used to be in the office and saw every effort to stretch resources). Voting became a rubber stamp, budgets were printed but not mandatory for viewing, and it didn’t feel the same. As members noticed the changed and left, money was not as flowing, programs got cut, and more people left. Stating that the police advised against it due to robberies, the weekly offering tally was no longer reported, an important incentive for helping us know how the church was doing. That made it seem even more secret. Then one day the missionaries the church supported lost their support…possibly due to less income, but that was kept secret too… all we know is the missionaries had no support and several elders quit the church, esp the ones who were on the missions committee. We got a biulding, and we got a senior pastor, but the people who were the lifeblood of the church, the ones who gave all they could for the building fund, they were gone. Now I and my spouse have been visiting local churches for the past two years, searching for one near us like the one we loved. The church has a building but it lost its soul. Most of the people we knew scattered to several other churches…as for me, I want my church back…

In the Baptist church I attend in the UK the ministers’ pay is set in a church meeting each year as part of the annual budget. Every church member can have their say except for 2 – the ministers who leave the meeting while their pay is discussed.

I am continually frustrated when I see the excessive and ultra-comfortable lifestyles of many, if not most, professional ministers in America. They are not representing Christ properly in this. If someone has chosen to serve the Lord, they should not become wealthy and has a life of ease in so doing. Paul the apostle worked with his hands “day and night” according to his own testimony in order to avoid reproach. Their lifestyles are a reproach to the church, especially when so many are struggling in the economic problems we have.

A pastor’s salary information is not actually that secret, if the church is actually a 501c3 non-profit organization. You can go to http://www.guidestar.org to check out their IRS tax statements which list the top five highest paid people in the organization and their salaries, if you’re really curious. Registration is free and it’s really useful. This is what a lot of philanthropy organizations and funders use to assess the financial health of organizations before giving them grants.
Good luck!

I wish I didn’t know how much everybody makes. Finding out that the part time custodian makes more than I do as music director… Arg…

Sounds like your writing about the Pastor of the brooklyn tabernacle?
http://www.topix.com/forum/religion/TAK4NFJGFF607I3ED/p92

A local church has a “parsonage” which is prime lakefront property on one of the nicest lakes in the area. Houses along the lake go for over a million apiece. The pastor lives there free of charge AND gets a housing allowance (because, of course, that’s allowed by the tax code). He owns a house in addition to the parsonage.
So much for “storing up your treasure in heaven”.

Paul is incorrect that a pastor may take a housing allowance exclusion and receive a rent-free parsonage. The legislation passed as a result of Rick Warren’s tiff with the IRS codified what hadn’t been codified before. I’m not saying some don’t do it, but it’s not permitted by law.