THANK YOU (!) for addressing this, Stephanie!
We watched this video a couple weeks ago and just shook our heads at Mark Driscoll. Next think he’ll tell us we can’t listen to anything with a beat because some African tribes use drums in worship to other gods.

Mark probably wouldn’t care too much for Christopher Moore’s “Lamb: The Gospel According to Biff, Christ’s Childhood Pal,” which had Jesus and Biff going East in search of the three Magi during the lost years of Jesus’ life and Jesus spending time as a Buddhist priest in a Tibetan monastery.

Mark Driscoll does not represent all evangelicals– not by a long shot.
Nor can, or should, one say that “Christian culture” (whatever that is, and however broad that may be!) has a problem with Yoga.
More accurate in this case would be to say that Mark Driscoll, and some from parts of the Reformed theology camp in particular within American Protestantism, sometimes known as Neo-Calvinists, have a problem with Yoga– a problem big enough to elicit the kind of response you see above.
If you wish to critique– or poke some fun– at Mark Driscoll for his comments, fine. Let’s just not make the brush any broader than it actually is.

So it was the Devil making me do those downward dogs! Good, I was looking for an excuse to avoid yoga anyway. Now if this guy could just come out against crunches and ab work.

The add on this page is for mormon.org/helen and it says “rollover to see more of Helen”. That is some serious funny.

Oh, Russell, he is clearly against ab work!

No Taylor, I think she has it pretty much right. Christian Culture, which is not like Christianity itself tends to be that whole “having the Appearance of godliness” thing and not do much the actual godliness. So what makes a person who dabbles in CC look holy?
Blatant disregard for other cultures, yet apropriating them to add “color” to the service-check
Ripping off trends (some from 10 years ago)to appear “relevant”-check
Pushing the idea of “cleaning oneself up from sin” instead of just letting them come as they are-check
Demonizing something like Homosexuality while turning a blind eye to lying, theft, and bigotry?- big ole check.
I think when you belittle the whole idea of Christian Culture that you are in turn belittling scores of people who were burned by well meaning people who were involved with things like this. That may not be what you are doing, but that is how it is coming off as.
And as for the difference in what you said and what I am trying to say, I’ll explain it this way: Christian Culture is “doing things” instead of building relationships with God, other believers, and heck..yourself. So, yeah, this does fall under CC.
But when you use the Reformed bit and so on, of course it doesn’t look like it’ll fit or even make sense. But it does. Even if the things which are done to avoid relationships are different than what Stephanie listed, it’s still avoiding relationships. And condemning people. So as it may, it does require a large brush. Because despite all Christians being different, large chunks of things remain the same.

Actually, Christmas and Easter were *not* pagan feasts — that seems to be a myth created by Protestants to distance themselves from Catholicism.
In most cultures around the world, Easter is known as “Pascha” or “Pasque” or some such word, which reflects the festival’s roots in the Jewish Passover (or “Pesach”).
And as for Christmas, the evidence apparently suggests that whatever pagan festival existed around that time was created to compete with Christmas, not vice versa.

Wow. You know, I live so far away from this stuff now (geographically, eccliastically, and what have you) that I forget how insane it all was. And I used to be pretty gung-ho about it, too. So now, when I cringe at the combined arrogance and ignorance I just heard from Mark Driscoll’s mouth, it’s as much from shame that I ever thought and behaved that way myself. Ouch.

Peter, I would love to read more. Would you post your sources?

now say what you will about pasture mark, but my wifey and i are just soooooo thankful that we have him here to tell us what not to think about and what not to do. i mean, where would we be without pasture marks’s wisdom and his genuine love for us pitiful, evil white people?
here is a clip of pasture pat roberson with his slightly more liberal and worldly take on the yogas.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kCZW0fOR8_8

4 u, Gaypet: http://www.religioustolerance.org/easter1.htm

4got winter solstice. been around since before xtianity.

I am confused. I was asking for evidence of Peter’s assertions that his god came first.
But I love that I was sent to another site that wants me to “rollover” and see more of Helen. Maybe I should give Helen a go?

My butt seems to manifest demons every time I do yoga poses. Embarrassing.

I’m a yoga teacher who does not identify as Christian (other than culturally) though I was raised Catholic and attended mass regularly until I was 18 and then dabbled in many forms protestantism in college until I finally realized that just because I’m American, it doesn’t mean I have to be Christian. My yoga practice did not have anything to do with my leaving Christianity; in fact, many of my fellow teachers and practitioners are Christians (some even ministers). That said, as someone who is interested in religion and culture in general, I’ve been following the recent “yogagate” with great interest and have done my share of headdesking in response to much of the misinformation I’ve heard.
1. The practice of yoga is not, nor was it ever actually a specifically “hindu practice.” Yoga philosophy itself, and Patanjali’s Yoga Sutra stems from a philosophy called Sankhya (sometimes spelled Samkhya). Sankhya is a duelist philosophy that’s actually atheistic. Yoga philosophy itself is not atheistic (though it is, like Christianity as I understand it, dualistic.), but it doesn’t get into which deity to worship, which religion to be, or anything like that. Patanjali’s Yoga Sutra is written in such a way that it’s really accessible to people of almost any religion.
There’s a translation of the Yoga Sutra called “How to Know God” that does an excellent job of explaining the sutras to a western, Christian audience (interestingly enough, it is also written from an advaita vedantic–or non dual perspective.) It’s very clear and short, with almost no Sanskrit.
2.When the sutras were written (and that time frame is often debated) “asana” simply referred to one’s meditation posture (the word asana basically can be translated as “seat”.) not the sun salutes, downward dogs and standing poses of today.
The hatha yoga practices didn’t come about (or at-least weren’t written about) until the middle ages. These include asana (in this context, referring poses besides a meditation posture too) pranayama (breathing practices), bandha (physical locks to build heat in the body, increase mental attention to energy, and control the flow of energy throughout the body) and mudra (gestures, or seals–subtle techniques for controlling the flow of energy.)
And actually, many of the hatha yoga practices that are taught today (standing poses, etc., much of what you would find in a typical class) only date back to the late 1800s. Many of these asanas were introduced by Sri Krishnamacharya and many are said to be inspired by other disciplines like gymnastics. Krishnamacharya was a pioneer in teaching yoga in a therapeutic context. Previously, Ayruveda, yoga’s sister science, was the discipline that people tended to turn to for healing the physical body, and yoga was seen as a purely spiritual (though not sectarian) pursuit. As you can probably tell…things have changed quite a bit
Also, I do find it worth noting that yoga is not “Hindu” but it is Indian and many postures are named after particular characters in Indian mythology, and the majority of people in India are what we would call “Hindu.” It’s natural that the religion would influence the culture and the culture would influence the practices.
I often think of the fact that, for many years I danced ballet, which has strong roots in France and other European countries that have Christian heritages. Many ballets have Christian themes, reference Christian stories, use Christian names, etc. but that doesn’t mean that one needs to be Christian to dance ballet, and as dance can often be extremely spiritual–it doesn’t mean that a non-Christians can’t have a strong spiritual experience while dancing a Christian-themed ballet.
3. Yogic Meditation is NOT about “emptying the mind”. I’m not super familiar with Buddhist practices (someone who is, please correct me if I’m wrong) but I’m under the impression that “emptying the mind” is desirable in Buddhist meditation, but it is not something that is practiced in yogic meditation.
The word used to describe meditation in the Sutras in “Dhyana” it’s root is “Dhi” which means intelligence. To risk getting into too much detail, the practice of yogic meditation (or really, at this point, concentration, or dharana) involves focusing on a particular object; it could be a mantra (sacred sound), a yantra (a geometric diagram), a candle flame, the breath).This makes the mind one-pointed. Meditation then,is like an advanced state of concentration; it’s no longer just you focusing of the chosen object (which in a Christian context, could be Christ, or a cross) there’s actually a connection, a relationship. The practice is not to empty the mind, but to become so focused on one’s chosen object that something happens, where eventually, it’s only about you and the object of focus; and then there’s that connection, that relationship, and eventually, through much practice, one may even get a glimpse of samadhi (and there are also different levels of samadhi), spiritual absorption, oneness–you become one with whatever you’re paying attention to. And this isn’t a “one time deal” either, it’s a process.
What’s quite interesting though is that early Christians–the Dessert fathers–actually practiced meditation and concentration techniques that are very similar to those described in Yogic Scriptures.

Christmas and Easter were not pagan feasts. That is technically true. Christmas and Easter just happen to take place at the same time of the season, display the same iconography, and generally observe the same rites as pre-Christian feast days. But that’s just a coincidence. Right?

Well of course it’s not a coincidence that Easter coincides with a pre-Christian holy day, i.e. Passover. As I already indicated, that’s an essential part of the Easter narrative and it has been since day one.
As for Christmas, I must confess I conflated things a bit. It does seem that the early Christians had settled on December 25 as the date of Christ’s birth before the rival pagan festival was established in the late 3rd century; however, the Christmas feast day as we know it was instituted at some point in the 4th century.
touchstonemag.com/archives/article.php?id=16-10-012-v

#197 Making excuses for the superstitious, benighted cretin Albert Mohler.

So Easter is legit because it is a Spring celebration (as is Pesach, as you say)? Of god killing someone (or lots of someones)? It’s date (Easter) is calculated by figuring the first Sunday after the first full moon after the vernal equinox (that does not sound pagan AT ALL!). Or (as pointed out by urname)the Germans like white? And Pesach is dated for the barley harvest. btw. If we are going to continue to give “evidence” that doesn’t mean anything.
And Dec 25th could not possibly be connected to the winter solstice. ‘Cause the world is only 6 thousand years old and people didn’t need to concern themselves with the seasons and survival.
I am still interested in evidence. Well researcher, academic, any-damn-thing.

@ gaypet: haha!
germanz like trees, 2. (xmas trees.) was a german thing, came to UK in mid1-9th c. pre-xtian deal.

Demons? Demonic demonism? Really? My husband wants to know why I’ve drifted (or run) so far from Christianity. I show him stuff like this and the lovely article that came out last year about Halloween candy being prayed over by witches and say: “That. That is some crazy right there.”

No Pilates! Awww!

ah mark driscoll… i went to this dude’s church to check him out. during this time he gave a lecture for ‘men only’ that i attended in which he told everyone in the room what we should be striving for is a job that pays at least 70k per year, a stay at home wife who has steak on the table and is naked on the bed when we get home from our 70k job, and to drive the biggest suv you can buy to protect your loved ones in case of an accident. he also wanted 10+% of that 70k for his church of course.
i don’t have the words to express how disturbing this man is.

Gaypet, I have no idea what you’re going on about re: Easter (or, as it is known in most cultures, Pascha; it is only the German- and English-speaking cultures that have given it this other name). The fact that Jesus was crucified at Passover, and the fact that the earliest Christians believed he rose from the dead only a few days later, is simply a matter of history. Yes, yes, we can get into all sorts of interesting speculations about why the Jews had been celebrating Passover in the springtime for over a thousand years before Jesus’ lifetime. But as far as Christianity’s holiest day is concerned, there’s really no need to look any further than the fact that Jesus was a Jew and was executed by the Romans on a Jewish holiday. And the gospels aren’t even our earliest source for that: the link between Passover and the crucifixion of Jesus is made explicit in one of Paul’s epistles (i.e. I Corinthians 5:7), which almost everyone agrees is earlier than the gospels.
As for Christmas, I’ve already pointed out to the article in Touchstone magazine. You either know how to read it or you don’t.

http://www.newadvent.org/cathen/05224d.htm
From the horse’s mouth so to speak. The Catholic encyclopedia explains Easter..the Holy Day and the name. It was based around the Jewish Passover.
http://www.newadvent.org/cathen/03724b.htm-Christmas. Apparently the origins of the holiday was similar to the practice of some churches today of holding Harvest Parties instead of Halloween parties and the idea just…stuck.
The articles are pretty detailed and scholarly..and dare I say boring in places but overall pretty interesting.
And as far as Yoga is concerned isn’t it possible to do the exercises without listening to the philosophy behind it?

HAHA!
I’m going to start a Christian Yoga Club. I’ll name it, “Stretching the Truth.”
nicodemusatnite.blogspot.com

The path to hell is a slippery slope, that’s what Jesus said.

Actually, the Christian school I go to has “Yoga as Christian spiritual practice” where you recite psalms in Yoga poses.
Which is probably just as silly. Why does yoga have to be specific to any religion, why can’t it just be meditation/calming/exercise?

Well certainly. We must name any potential “bushes” that satan may be hiding behind in order to protect ourselves from him. Lets build a whitewashed fortress while we’re at it. We could make the gates out of pearl & pretend we’re already in heaven. And then kill each other in our paranoia. Watch out for the kool-aid.
Gag.

I’ll tell you what. I just hope, I hope, that this might begin to convince you that not all Evangelicals should be caricatured like they are around here…
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FZFG5PKw504

I think this is a matter of perspective. I am sure there are millions of people like this guy who thinks Jesus is a gateway to hell or Jesus is demon himself. Strange how this works Demons always gets attention. Hope someday people will start respecting each others belief or non-believers.

Mark Driscoll is full of shi+ about everything. I have yet to hear or read anything of his with which I agree.

Jorge! That video was amazing! That’s might surpass Ray Comfort’s “Banana is an atheists worst nightmare” video. That’s one of the most mind boggling creationist videos I’ve ever seen. Thanks for sharing!

“Exercise that is Biblical”…what the hell is that?

Mark Driscoll is everything that is wrong with American society, just after reality television and punditry.

How long will it be before the vast majority of Christians start mocking Mark Driscoll the same way they mock Pat Robertson? Not a minute to soon for me: the man is a complete loon.

“Should Christians stay away from Yoga because of its demonic roots?”
No fair! That’s a loaded question!

That video was a riot. Edward Current couldn’t do a better parody.

Does this guy not get it that you have to be in touch with your own spirit to be able to send it outwards to Jesus to commune? What is prayer but a meditative act to commune with God. What an idiot – he obviously has no REAL connection with God but rather a jaded and very narrow view of what and how it should be. God, Jesus, Love and spirit – all encompassing. “My way or no way” seems to be his call to action. Talk about self centered.

http://www.everythingisterrible.com/2010/05/not-that-pagan-yoga.html
As someone who grew up in the evangelical world, your site is hilariously on target. Keep up the great work!