I love graphjam. So much can be explained, it seems, through the simple use of pie charts! There’s also a funny one floating around about Christian music. And scores of others on the site.

As if “marriage” was a right (yawn)

“As if marriage was a right”
Are you saying it’s somehow a privilege? One only you should be entitled to?

Whether you find it funny has more to do with whether it accords with your previously held assumptions. It is not stand-alone funny, unless you think the mere observation that someone might be gay is funny, which I have not since I was, like, 12.
Repeat this ten times: Yes, I do have a sense of humor, but not sophistication.

(you’ll probably think I’m taking it too seriously, but the graph caused caused me to think, so here it is…)
If “in the closet” means those folks who were born with homosexual desires, yet fight against those temptations so as not to commit the act of homosexuality, then praise God that so many might be fighting against temptation in order to be obedient to God. (of course, full obedience only comes by Christ, but God is honored by our humble efforts to pursue righteousness as well).
If it means that there are many who superficially and hypocritically deny and disregard these desires without adequately dealing with them and fighting against them (and thus likely falling to their temptations), then it’s the fault of conservative pastors / teachers / leaders who aren’t comfortable or willing to broach the topic of fighting against homosexual desires who deserve much of the blame. Certainly, evangelicals needs to learn to talk about the reality of homosexual desires more openly as well as develop more-biblical, more-holistic approaches to counseling those who are struggling against these temptations. Certainly, this kind of pastoral-care is happening in some corners already, but it’s not common.

I love that the only group progressive folk no long feel the need to respect or treat with dignity are conservative Christians. Must be nice Tony to constantly beat the drum of love for all and acceptance but still leave enough room to mock your brothers and sisters who hold to Biblical principles.

Homophobia is the fear of being raped.
Or at least it is for me.
Why do you want to deepen that fear instead of relieve it?

Ted Seeber: “Homophobia is the fear of being raped.
Or at least it is for me.
Why do you want to deepen that fear instead of relieve it?”
If it’s any consolation, you don’t have to worry about me. Gay-hating jerks are a major turn-off as far as I’m concerned.
So stop calling me. I mean it.

Tony Jones – If your are going to be tasteless and disrespectful, bring the funny. This is not funny.

Brian,
The word “marriage” does not appear in the graph. It refers to “Christian conservatives who rail against gay rights”. You know, like the right to not be discriminated against in employment, housing and other public accommodation. The right to serve your country honorably. The right not to be beat up by cops in a Forth Worth gay bar on the anniversary of Stonewall. (Ain’t America great?) Gay
Sadly, gay Americans can still be fired in 27 States, and it’s largely due to the railing of (often closeted) “Christian” conservatives.
And yes, you are correct, marriage is not a “right” – not even for betterosexuals.

“If “in the closet” means those folks who were born with homosexual desires, yet fight against those temptations so as not to commit the act of homosexuality …”
No, ben, it doesn’t mean that.
“If it means that there are many who superficially and hypocritically deny and disregard these desires without adequately dealing with them and fighting against them (and thus likely falling to their temptations) … “
No, it doesn’t mean that either.
“evangelicals needs [sic] to learn to talk about the reality of homosexual desires more openly”
They also need to learn to talk about the reality of homosexuality mor honestly and be much more informed about it than they currently are (as showcased in your post).
“as well as develop more-biblical, more-holistic approaches to counseling those who are struggling against these temptations”
The vast majority of God’s gay and lesbian children do not “struggle” (or ‘suffer’) with their innate, God-given sexuality. We rejoice and are glad in it for it is good. What we do struggle with is mis-/dis-information being spread about us by the ignorant and the bearers of false witness about us.

Ted,
Any phobia is irrational by definition, but your particular phobia is so twisted and ugly, it shames the name of Christ because of its inherent false witness.
Trust me, your lil bumhole is safe from any and all self-respecting gay people.
Oh, and I recommend you see “Boys Don’t Cry”. It ain’t the gay folk doin’ the raping.

“Oh, and I recommend you see “Boys Don’t Cry”. It ain’t the gay folk doin’ the raping.”
Setting aside the questions of whether or not a single film can singularly express the nature of sexual assault, and whether homosexual sexual assaults happen…
The whole subtext of the film, which (ostensibly) necessitated the rape scene, is that attraction isn’t finite. The men were attracted prior to the revelation that the lead character was a woman, and immediately took the opportunity to express their desires.
Else, the film is a well-acted after-school special. You may have arrived at the opinion that it was, but, then, why recommend the film?

Husband,
I’m requesting honestly:
1) What does “in the closet” mean then with reference to Christian conservatives? (I didn’t honestly think the graph-artist intended #1, I was just doing a little re-interpretation.)
2) Please inform of some of the things that I don’t understand about homosexuality “as showcased in [my] post.” I want to learn about where I showed misunderstanding.
3) How do you know that a person’s sexuality is “God-given?” Are all “innate” things “God-given?” Are some folks (any?) personally deceived about what is God-given and what is sin? How does one guard against the possibility of such self-deception? How do YOU guard against it with reference toward YOUR sexuality?

I laughed hard. Thanks Tony.

Scoffer
2 pt 3:3

“Sacramental Bea” and “Mordred08″- it’s been some time since I was forced to be around gay people, in fact, it’s been since high school and college. But unfortuneately, words are not enough, once actions are done. And while I now know (diagnosed at 30) that my real problem is sending out mixed signals (I’m a procreation-only heterosexual, but my “body language”, or at least what you idiot neurotypicals call body language as if anything counts other than action and words, apparently screams “gay”), I had enough bad experiences with gay guys hitting on me in high school and college to know that I’d be way more comfortable if you Californicators would just keep it in San Francisco.
To dismiss my fear as merely being irrational- shows that you do not understand the power of a phobia nor the pain caused by it.

“I’d be way more comfortable if you Californicators would just keep it in San Francisco.”
I’m from Alabama, and I have to be very careful not to step out of line, or I could lose my job, maybe even my life. If homophobia is “fear of being raped”, “heterophobia” is fear of being beaten to death.

@ Bill B- It’s funny.
@ Ted- It’s definitely irrational, like my fear of deep water. I’m scared of being eaten by giant fish every time I go for a surf or dive, but it’s not really going to happen.

Mordred: “I’m from Alabama, and I have to be very careful not to step out of line, or I could lose my job, maybe even my life. If homophobia is “fear of being raped”, “heterophobia” is fear of being beaten to death.”
ABSOLUTELY RIGHT! Exactly the problem. What percentage of gay people *really* get beaten to death? Maybe 1% or less? You’ve got a better chance of a plane hitting your house. Same with a fat, old geek like me getting raped.
But increasing irrational fear, is the technique of terrorists. On both sides of the fence.

ryan,
“I love that the only group progressive folk no long feel the need to respect or treat with dignity are conservative Christians.”
Those self-described “conservative Christians” don’t respect me (I’m gay), so I guess they’re simply sowing what they reap.

ben,
“1) What does “in the closet” mean then with reference to Christian conservatives? (I didn’t honestly think the graph-artist intended #1, I was just doing a little re-interpretation.)”
We’re used to ‘re-interpretation’ from “Christian” conservatives, ben. Being in the closet means not admitting publicly what you are (aka lieing – to yourself and to others). Your conjecture re those “born with homosexual desires, yet fight against those temptations so as not to commit the act of homosexuality” is both false and hollow. Homosexuality is NOT an “act” – anymore than heterosexuality is. Gay people can also be “obedient to God”, just not your interpretation of Who/What God is and what God wants.
Also, you say regarding those “many who superficially and hypocritically deny and disregard these desires without adequately dealing with them and fighting against them”. That’s only one way of regarding things. Others not only “deal with them” but eventually come to the understanding that the way we are (our innate, unchanging humanity) is the way God ‘designed’ us (word chosen intentionally) and instead of “fighting against them” come to accept our sexuality as God’s gift. Not everyone ‘struggles with’ their sexuality, you know.
But neither approach deals with “Christian” conservatives who are in the closet. Ted Haggard is an excellent example of a closeted Chrisian. He hates the way he is, publicly lies/lied about it, too) and yet acts on it (in secret) and publicly denounces others like him.
“2) Please inform of some of the things that I don’t understand about homosexuality “as showcased in [my] post.” I want to learn about where I showed misunderstanding.”
Well, as explained above, you sure don’t know what being in the closet means for one. For another, you presume that being gay is something one should “fight” in the first place. That you place “the fault of conservative pastors / teachers / leaders who aren’t comfortable or willing to broach the topic of fighting against homosexual desires who deserve much of the blame” reveals so much misunderstanding in itself.
Another example is your statement: “Certainly, evangelicals needs to learn to talk about the reality of homosexual desires more openly as well as develop more-biblical, more-holistic approaches to counseling those who are struggling against these temptations.” You refuse to deal with those people who are happily homosexual. We don’t all “struggle” with our sexuality, and for you to believe so is yet another of your many ‘misunderstandings’.
There is, in what you post, much presumption that people should/can only be heterosexual to, to use a fundie saying, ‘be right with God’. It ain’t necessarily so.
“3) How do you know that a person’s sexuality is “God-given?” Are all “innate” things “God-given?” Are some folks (any?) personally deceived about what is God-given and what is sin? How does one guard against the possibility of such self-deception? How do YOU guard against it with reference toward YOUR sexuality?”
I don’t know a single heterosexual Christian who does not believe God made them that way, and that their sexuality is innate. That they think we gay people can/should change is disproven when we ask them in return, ‘Do you think you could become a homosexual?’
Sexuality is innate – as innate as handedness or eye color.
You can say that we are “personally deceived’ all you want. The thing is, we likewise think you are personally deceived on this topic. You have been deceived by pastors the like of Jerry Fal(se)well (who ‘teaches’ that God’s gay & lesbian children are the cause of hurricanes), or Jimmy Swaggart who thinks killing gays and lieing to God about it are a matter of humor.
Etcetera.
Thanx 4 askin’.

Ted S,
“it’s been some time since I was forced to be around gay people”
You were “forced to be around gay people”??? Gosh, a fate worse than death, I guess. Who, exactly, “forced” you? In fact, you are daily surrounded by gay people. You simply may not know it.
“And while I now know (diagnosed at 30) that my real problem is sending out mixed signals (I’m a procreation-only heterosexual, but my “body language”, or at least what you idiot neurotypicals call body language as if anything counts other than action and words, apparently screams “gay”), I had enough bad experiences with gay guys hitting on me in high school and college”
IOW, you’re an effeminate heterosexual. So what? There’s lots of folk like you – Jerry Falwell, Preston Manning, Ernest Aingley, Jimmy Swaggart, Ted Haggard (hmmm, why are so many effeminate hetreosexuals preachers???), Ned Flanders, etc. Your problem with gay guys hitting on you is as lamentable as str8 guys hitting on women all the time – totally unwanted. But people will make passes at others they find attractive. You should have been flattered they did find you attractive. Just say “No thanks.” It’s pretty easy to fend off. If you, in fact, found their advances unwanted.
And I rather doubt you’re a “procreation only heterosexual”. If you have 3 children, does that mean you’ve only had (heterosexual) sex 3 times in your life? I doubt it.
“I’d be way more comfortable if you Californicators would just keep it in San Francisco.”
Well, I’m not from Californicatia, but I can assure you there’s lots of homosexuals in Utah, Idaho, Montana, Tennessee, Kentucky, etc. San Francisco is sooo last century.
“To dismiss my fear as merely being irrational- shows that you do not understand the power of a phobia nor the pain caused by it.”
Ted, by definition, ALL phobias are irrational. It is the way you deal with your phobias that cause you pain. Assuming all gay people want to rape you is way over the top in the irrationality scale. Seek professional help.

“What percentage of gay people *really* get beaten to death? Maybe 1% or less? You’ve got a better chance of a plane hitting your house. Same with a fat, old geek like me getting raped.”
So why do you (allegedly) fear being raped so much? Oh right. The answer is …
“But increasing irrational fear, is the technique of terrorists.”
So stop living in fear and stop terrorizing God’s gay and lesbian children with your admittedly irrational fears.

Isn’t “perfect love” supposed to “cast out all fears” anymore???

I find it fascinating that liberal or emergent Christians are adamantly sensitive to people criticizing any group of people except for conservative Christians. I completely agree with the poster earlier who left a similar comment stating such. God’s word is blatantly clear that members of the church are to avoid all immoral sexual activities, and the bible plainly states over and over that homosexuality is a sin. The conflict within the church over the issue of gay marriage has risen because our emergent brethren seem to find the bible “too mean” or “unenlightened,” but liberal Christians fail to see that God’s knowledge and God’s reasoning is infinitely superior to our knowledge and our reasoning. In seeking to gather support for homosexuality in the church, liberal Christians are not only telling God what they, in their high enlightened opinion, think of His morality, but they are also picking and choosing what they will believe in His word.
Accepting God’s word is an act of faith, but many people in our modern age are too prideful or rely too heavily on their own reasoning, finding it far superior to God’s reasoning.
Here are some verses from the bible to consider:
John 7:7- The world cannot hate you, but it hates me because I testify that what it does is evil. (How this relates- Jesus is God, and God’s teaching that homosexuality is wrong upsets many people and causes many people to hate God’s word. However, Jesus told us long ago in this verse that He would be hated for speaking the truths of His father.)
2 Timothy 3:16-17 – All Scripture is God-breathed and is useful for teaching, rebuking, correcting and training in righteousness,so that the man of God may be thoroughly equipped for every good work. (How this relates- those who seek to discredit parts of God’s word live in rebellion against the truth that all of the Bible is divinely inspired and is God’s way of telling us how to live in harmony with Him).
1 Corinthians 1:10- I appeal to you, brothers, in the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, that all of you agree with one another so that there may be no divisions among you and that you may be perfectly united in mind and thought. (How this relates- Christians who seek to persecute, humiliate, or isolate other Christians are causing dissent in the body of Christ, and are ultimately inhibiting God from working His will in the world. Christians are supposed to live in humility with love for one another and for non-believers. Please take note: just because someone tells someone else that they are living in sin does not mean that the person speaking does not love the person sinning. Sin is a barrier between humans and God, Christians should hold other Christians accountable to the word of God, as given by God. As a note to the author of this post and others like him- you are causing division and fueling hatred among the brethren. Just because a Christian justly stands against a behavior the Bible has deemed immoral does that mean that that person is secretly a hypocrite and is really gay themselves.)
How long will God’s word and God’s righteous morality continued to be trampled on by those who claim to love the Lord and are spreading false teachings from the Bible?
And just before I go…
Leviticus 20:13 – If a man lies with a male as he lies with a woman, both of them have committed an abomination.
1 Corinthians 6:9-11 – Do you not know that the unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived, neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor homosexuals, nor sodomites, nor thieves, nor covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor extortioners will inherit the kingdom of God. And such were some of you. But you were washed, but you were sanctified, but you were justified in the name of the Lord Jesus and by the Spirit of our God.